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The 60s and early 70s

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  • #16


    I wonder if a lot of the cross-pollination had to do with the degree of independence of many FM radio DJs. I remember variety programing which really stretched the gamut of musical expression - from baroque to musique concrete to rock to jazz to ethnic to the DJ playing the same cut over & over because he/she personally liked it so much. Granted this was FM, what was considered underground but it influenced the more commercial programming also. The "long" version of Light My Fire was a big deal on commercial radio. Many of the commercial FM stations would be more adventurous in the early morning / late night hours. While there are probably many on line stations providing a wide latitude of musical exposure (the BBC's Radio 3 Midnight Junction for example) the push by the predominant technocratic algorithmic programming is niche oriented as everyone here knows.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Phil O'Keefe View Post

      That brings up an interesting question ... does one track the rhythm section and then overdub the vocals first, or the lead instruments? Some vocalists want to have everything there (including solos) and the track as finished and polished sounding as possible since they feel it's inspiring... while having the vocals there is obviously beneficial for the soloists and lead instruments - they tend to like to follow the vocalist, or at least know where the holes are that the signer left that they can fill...
      This is why people should be able to record with as much of the group playing and singing together as possible. If you need a second guitar, get another player. If you need a harmony vocal, get another singer. Maybe overdub the two bars of english horn in the third chorus, or, with some reservation, the string quartet.

      Record what you are, not what you think you can be.
      --
      "Today's production equipment is IT-based and cannot be operated without a passing knowledge of computing, although it seems that it can be operated without a passing knowledge of audio." - John Watkinson, Resolution Magazine, October 2006
      Drop by http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com now and then

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      • #18
        Originally posted by electrow View Post

        I wonder if a lot of the cross-pollination had to do with the degree of independence of many FM radio DJs...The "long" version of Light My Fire was a big deal on commercial radio. Many of the commercial FM stations would be more adventurous in the early morning / late night hours.
        As someone who did a lot of radio interviews back then, I can attest that many DJs played the "long" versions of songs so they could go smoke a joint in a leisurely fashion.
        The first 3 books in "The Musician's Guide to Home Recording" series are available from Hal Leonard and http://www.reverb.com. Listen to my music on http://www.YouTube.com/thecraiganderton, and visit http://www.craiganderton.com. Thanks!

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Phil O'Keefe View Post

          That brings up an interesting question ... does one track the rhythm section and then overdub the vocals first, or the lead instruments? Some vocalists want to have everything there (including solos) and the track as finished and polished sounding as possible since they feel it's inspiring... while having the vocals there is obviously beneficial for the soloists and lead instruments - they tend to like to follow the vocalist, or at least know where the holes are that the signer left that they can fill...
          Some of the tracks I did had a temporary vocal on it, that changed when the singer did the final take. And some of my answer parts were no longer appropriate, it sounded like I wasn't really listening to the singer. When the call and response was for the temp vocals, not the final track. This embarrasses me becatuse I pride myself on the ability to add response lines that are appropriate to what the vocalist is doing. They may contrast, slightly mimic, continue the theme, complete, or anything else that the vocal line inspires in me. But when I'm "on" they are always appropriate (at least I think so).

          This is another reason why I like recording everything at once. When played live on stage, rock, blues, jazz, country and other modern pop genres of music are about group improvisation over a song structure. When we are doing it all at once, and when we are listening to each other like we should, the interactions are spontaneous and organic. The vocalist might inspire a line from the guitarist that inspires the piano to change his/her comp lines which feeds back to the vocalist, and so on with it's endless variations.

          Of course there is more than one right way to do anything, and there are other advantages to endless tracks, but when we were limited to 4 tracks, and had to do everything at the same time, I think the interaction between musicians and vocalists was at its high peak.

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          • #20
            I was born in 1948 and I think I'd extend the the end of rock music that I enjoy into the 80's. A lot of the artists started a lot earlier, but they had some good stuff coming out after the 70's. I'm thinking of Fleetwood Mac, The Eagles, Pat Benatar, Boston, and Heart to name the ones that come to mind. I don't think I listen to any new groups that appeared in this century, and can probably only name a handful.
            Last edited by Jeff Leites; 08-27-2016, 08:07 PM.
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            • #21
              Originally posted by Jeff Leites View Post
              I was born in 1948 and I think I'd extend the the end of music rock music that I enjoy into the 80's. A lot of the artists started a lot earlier, but they had some good stuff coming out after the 70's. I'm thinking of Fleetwood Mac, The Eagles, Pat Benatar, Boston, and Heart to name the ones that come to mind. I don't think I listen to any new groups that appeared in this century, and can probably only name a handful.
              I was born in 1952 and I know where you're coming from, but I dug and still dig a lot of the stuff that came out in the 90's. Grunge brought the rock back to rock for a time..And the West and Northwest coast produced some fine rockin stuff. Pearl Jam, Soundgarden(and Soundgardens progeny), kept the Guitar front and center. As did STP. A lot of young blues artists came up as well. Rap and Hiphop pretty much have influenced everything since the turn of century as far as popular stuff is concerned. There's not much new music that resembles any of the music old guys like us grew up loving.

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              • #22
                Originally posted by MikeRivers View Post

                This is why people should be able to record with as much of the group playing and singing together as possible. If you need a second guitar, get another player. If you need a harmony vocal, get another singer. Maybe overdub the two bars of english horn in the third chorus, or, with some reservation, the string quartet.
                I agree with all of that in general principle, and like more "documentary" recordings... but...

                Record what you are, not what you think you can be.
                I can also appreciate creative recording too. I see nothing wrong with trying to create something more fanciful and beyond the scope of "the band" if that's what everyone is interested in trying to do.
                **********

                "Look at it this way: think of how stupid the average person is, and then realize half of 'em are stupider than that."
                - George Carlin

                "It shouldn't be expected that people are necessarily doing what they appear to be doing on records."
                - Sir George Martin, All You Need Is Ears

                "The music business will be revitalized by musicians, not the labels or Live Nation. When the musicians decide to put music first, instead of money, the public will flock to the fruits and the scene will be healthy again."
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