Members rasputin1963 Posted June 12, 2009 Members Share Posted June 12, 2009 Chaz (nee "Chastity") Bono begins sex reassignment surgery. http://www.tmz.com/2009/06/11/chastity-bono-becoming-a-man/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Magpel Posted June 12, 2009 Members Share Posted June 12, 2009 thread title: lolChastisty's choice, well, given the means you can buy your own ends...or something like that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Billster Posted June 12, 2009 Members Share Posted June 12, 2009 "Yes, it's true -- Chaz, after many years of consideration, has made the courageous decision to honor his true identity," confirmed Bono's publicist, Howard Bragman. "He is proud of his decision and grateful for the support and respect that has already been shown by his loved ones. It is Chaz's hope that his choice to transition will open the hearts and minds of the public regarding this issue, just as his 'coming out' did nearly 20 years ago. We ask that the media respect Chaz's privacy during this long process as he will not be doing any interviews at this time." A publicist asking for privacy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Geoff Grace Posted June 12, 2009 Members Share Posted June 12, 2009 It is Chaz's hope that his choice to transition will open the hearts and minds of the public regarding this issue, just as his 'coming out' did nearly 20 years ago. No need to worry about my opinion. One of my best friends in high school got a sex change in college back in the '70s. He was very unhappy before -- suicidal, in fact -- but as soon as he began the process that led to his sex change, he became a happy person. I kept in touch with him for another twenty years and his life turned out very happily. I'm convinced that the sex change not only saved his life, it made it worth living. Best, Geoff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jotown Posted June 12, 2009 Members Share Posted June 12, 2009 We ask that the media respect Chaz's privacy during this long process What a joke. You put out a press release to the world that you are going to be getting a penis soon, and then you asked for privacy. If you wanted privacy you should not have announced it. Who was going to know if you didn't tell everyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Lee Knight Posted June 12, 2009 Moderators Share Posted June 12, 2009 No need to worry about my opinion. One of my best friends in high school got a sex change in college back in the '70s. He was very unhappy before -- suicidal, in fact -- but as soon as he began the process that led to his sex change, he became a happy person.I kept in touch with him for another twenty years and his life turned out very happily. I'm convinced that the sex change not only saved his life, it made it worth living.Best,Geoff Same here... The older brother of my good friend had the procedure done. He was the most unbearable older brother you could ever find. The quintessential older brother from the teen movies. Just a mean, unhappy guy who wanted everyone to be miserable too. When I visited my good buddy after his brain surgery, little did I know that there would be someone visiting with an even more remarkable, recently performed, surgical procedure visiting as well. I will never forget him saying, "Lee... I'm XXX!" But using some awkward female version of his name. I didn't get it. I didn't know who she was. My friend in bed recovering from brain surgery, with a black and blue face... his eyes were hurt... and I looked back at his brother, now sister, and it fell into place for me. My friend never came to grips with his brother's sex change. Still hasn't, best I can tell. From my perspective it seems like it was his only choice. I don't think I ever saw him smile in his old role. She seems very happy now. Good luck Chas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members cereal Posted June 12, 2009 Members Share Posted June 12, 2009 no thanks..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kurfu Posted June 12, 2009 Members Share Posted June 12, 2009 SO... she's going to have a voluntary double mastectomy and start taking testosterone so she can grow some facial hair... that doesn't make her a "man", it just makes her a disfigured woman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rhino55 Posted June 12, 2009 Members Share Posted June 12, 2009 FWIW, "Hedwig and the Angry Inch" is a great movie/rock opera that deals with sexchanges and what not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mudcat007 Posted June 12, 2009 Members Share Posted June 12, 2009 A childhood friend went from being Greg to Gina at some point in his twenties. This guy played sports all through high school (6' 2" handsome and very athletic), had no problem dating girls and had all appearances of being completely well-adjusted to everyone around him. He was just "one of the guys." My jaw dropped when I heard he was starting the sex-change process. His decision to do this really devistated his family, although my understanding is they have all reconciled and do see each other now. I haven't seen him in person since "he" became "she." The unnerving thing is that in the photos I've seen Gina appears to look extremely feminine and fairly attractive (in a very tall sort of way). All I know is something wild must have been going on in his head to go through that whole process. I can't comprehend it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Anderton Posted June 12, 2009 Members Share Posted June 12, 2009 IF you accept some of the tenets regarding reincarnation, it's plausible that a soul with a particular and strong gender identification ends up in the wrong body...basically, a glitch in the system. Anyway, I don't think there's a "one size fits all" analysis here. I've known a variety of people of a variety of sexual persuasions over the years. Some, like Geoff's friend, felt really strongly they were in the wrong body and once that got squared away, everything changed, and for the better. Some people changed because of some fundamental psychological issues that weren't resolved, and then became devastated because the sex change didn't resolve those issues (like the people who are miserable and think that being a rich rock star will make them happy...only to find themselves still miserable because what was making them miserable wasn't due to a lack of money). In any event, regardless of how anyone feels about the subject themselves, anyone who does a sex change deserves psychological support. It must be an incredibly difficult decision that I'm sure no on undertakes lightly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Geoff Grace Posted June 12, 2009 Members Share Posted June 12, 2009 Well put, Craig! Best, Geoff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Anderton Posted June 12, 2009 Members Share Posted June 12, 2009 Thanks Geoff. The reason why I'm so against prejudice isn't just because of the damage it does to the person who's subject to the prejudice. It also damages the person being prejudiced, because of cutting themselves off from the entirety of human experience. I've had some great nights on the town with gay guys...not because of any romantic reasons, but damn, they knew how to party and where the best clubs were. And I can guarantee they had zero interest in me sexually. The important point here is that we identified with each other's taste in music, not each other's sexuality. You don't have to be gay to like dance music And that's really the point, isn't it? A gay human being isn't a "gay human being," but a "human being who's gay." There's a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members slight-return Posted June 12, 2009 Members Share Posted June 12, 2009 The reason why I'm so against prejudice isn't just because of the damage it does to the person who's subject to the prejudice. I have a gay prejudice that I stand by -- when a gay friend hands me a drink I pre judge it to be about half again as strong as the same drink mixed by a straight friend. then again "Sexuality and Its Queer Discontents in Middle English Literature" is dedicated to me and the wife. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ernest Buckley Posted June 13, 2009 Members Share Posted June 13, 2009 What a joke. You put out a press release to the world that you are going to be getting a penis soon, and then you asked for privacy. If you wanted privacy you should not have announced it. Who was going to know if you didn't tell everyone? +1, Yeah its ridiculous and for some reason she sort of reminds me of the heavyset chick from Wilson Philips... remember when she lost all that weight and had that special surgery? I don`t get these "celebrities" feeling the need to share with us their personal lives... the constant need for attention... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ernest Buckley Posted June 13, 2009 Members Share Posted June 13, 2009 I've had some great nights on the town with gay guys... What?! I stopped reading after that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jotown Posted June 13, 2009 Members Share Posted June 13, 2009 Anyway, I don't think there's a "one size fits all" analysis here......... In any event, regardless of how anyone feels about the subject themselves, anyone who does a sex change deserves psychological support. It must be an incredibly difficult decision that I'm sure no on undertakes lightly.I have no problem with sex changes, species change or phone number changes. I just think it is pretty silly to announce something to the public that they would never know about otherwise, and then ask people to respect your privacy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ernest Buckley Posted June 13, 2009 Members Share Posted June 13, 2009 Hey Lee, I too know someone who is going for a sex change... it is a long process and it is definitely taking a toll on his family. I`m actually friends with the parents. His mom is devastated. She is close to 80 and cannot believe her son would do this. The father will not talk about it. All the mom says is, he couldn`t wait until we left this place? Its got to be hard for everyone involved but my attitude is as long as the patient is happy in the end, then it was worth it. Its got to be a really awkward feeling... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rasputin1963 Posted June 13, 2009 Author Members Share Posted June 13, 2009 I'm afraid I got initiated kinda early to the world of trannies. I started playing in clubs when I was 14. At one bar (it wasn't a gay bar, either, but a respected gourmet restaurant) there was a waitress named Yvonne. She had a very low voice, enormous breasts and a face riddled with pock marks. Occasionally she would come sit at my side at the piano, squeeze my knee and purr in her smoky baritone: "Oh, you're going to be such a handsome man when you grow up..." :lol: As for sexuality, I've heard different theories, but one that seems to ring true with me: It involves how a fetus is either feminized or virilized during several "critical windows" of gestation. The fetus's hypothalamus is the critical brain zone that seems to respond one way or the other during these critical windows. There is a basic or typical way that a fetus's brain can be administered these important sex hormones. But Mother Nature has a lot of leeway: a fetal hypothalamus, because of its mother's hormonal balance, can be doused with female or male hormones (oestrogens and testosterone) in differing proportions at these critical periods. An infant will be categorized by three things: Its actual physical sex (male or female genitalia and endocrines) Its behavioral or "play" style... Rough-and-tumble and hierarchical (boyish), or quiescent and cooperative (girlish) Its eventual sexual orientation (heterosexual or homosexual) So basically you can end up with a child who demonstrates possibilities/permutations like these: a physical boy who behaves like a boy (likes rough-and-tumble, hierarchical play) and sexually is drawn to girls a physical boy who prefers "girlish" (quiescent, cooperative, noncombatant, non-hierarchical) play and is drawn sexually to girls a physical boy who behaves like a boy and is sexually attracted to boys, a physical boy who behaves like a girl and who is sexually drawn to girls, a physical girl who behaves like a girl and who is sexually attracted to boys, a physical girl who behaves like a boy and is sexually drawn to girls, a physical girl who behaves like a girl and is sexually attracted to girls, a physical girl who behaves like a boy and is sexually drawn to boys. Well, you get the picture. So Mother Nature has some real "one-armed bandit" possibilities up her sleeve. Most G/L's will tell you that they knew they were "different" by the time they were 5, 6 or 7 years old. I have heard some interesting stories though about transsexuals. For example, there is the story of R.R., the great tennis player of the 1970's, who went from man to woman with the surgery. Some of us will remember her story and travails in PEOPLE magazine back then. (ie., Should a post-op trannie be allowed to play on the Women's Team? After all, she still has a man's musculature, etc.) Except, over time, the new woman she became began to sexually prefer women. So in essence, she became a transsexual lesbian. As Craig says, naturally an egalitarian and thoughtful and kind approach is always the best watchword, socially and in the business realm. Perhaps one of today's most pernicious scenarios is one in which a gay person may receive no threats or slurs to his/her face at all, ever.... but in which s/he is slowly edged out and excluded from social and business opportunities. Like the one-armed bandit's display above, you just never know what kind of fruit you're dealing with. P.S. Transsexuals---- as always, if they have the money---- can have actual bone surgery on their face to sand down a masculine chin and brow (or conversely, to build one up). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Lee Knight Posted June 13, 2009 Moderators Share Posted June 13, 2009 Hey Lee, I too know someone who is going for a sex change... it is a long process and it is definitely taking a toll on his family. I`m actually friends with the parents. His mom is devastated. She is close to 80 and cannot believe her son would do this. The father will not talk about it. All the mom says is, he couldn`t wait until we left this place? Its got to be hard for everyone involved but my attitude is as long as the patient is happy in the end, then it was worth it. Its got to be a really awkward feeling... It is a huge event for all those involved, it seems. I certainly empathize with anyone who has this dilemma in their life. I can't even begin to imagine how difficult it might be to not do the procedure... or to do it. Either way, it appears devastating to all those involved. Perhaps as we learn to accept the position of "women trapped inman's body" and visa versa, it will become a little less of an upheaval for those in this situation. My buddy was not ready for his brother to become his sister. He still begrudges the fact. On the other hand, the brother/sister appears to be comfortable in her skin at last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Super 8 Posted June 13, 2009 Members Share Posted June 13, 2009 that doesn't make her a "man", it just makes her a disfigured woman. Where is the dividing line? When does a woman become a man? Taking away her breasts? Survivors of breast cancer are still women. Adding a mustache? Frida Kahlo had one and she was still a woman. Is it dressing "manly"? What about changing her name to Chaz? Will that make her more of a man? Why couldn't she be a man named Chastity? What's so wrong with that? Johnny Cash sang about a boy named Sue. My kids come home from school talking about Morgan or Addison and I never know if they're talking about the boy in their class with that name or the girl. So much this just seems to be about appearances. They're even calling her a man and she hasn't even had the changeover yet. Is saying your a man all it takes to make you one? If a female identifies with men more than with women, fine. A mustache and a husky voice isn't going to add anything to you. In cases like that people usually only think of you as a woman in name only anyway. You typically are treated like a male because being around you 'feels' like being around a male. If she feels that nature gave her a raw deal in the beginning and she's been a guy all along, then why not get the penis and make it complete? Can you just decide one day that you are a woman and expect everyone to consider you accordingly? Could you later decide that you are a man and expect to be treated like one? If that were true, I would have become a woman every school day about 15 minutes before swim class. It all reminds me of this:[YOUTUBE]sFBOQzSk14c[/YOUTUBE] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ernest Buckley Posted June 14, 2009 Members Share Posted June 14, 2009 Theres a book called Psycho Cybernetics by Dr. Maxwell Maltz which gets into this. Dr. Maltz talks about how many of his patients thought that plastic surgery would fix their unhappiness only to find out that it didn`t. He later went on to study more about the thoughts we consciously and unconsciously tell ourselves all day and the images we hold in our heads and how much these things affected our happiness more than anything else actually. So when I read something like this, it screams "HELP ME!". Its sad. The answer truly is within. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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