The Political Party

[GTRMAN]

Why does it matter that it happened to be a gun store in this case? Why are youtrying to obfuscate the discussion? Why do you have a problem with someone using an AR-15 for home defense? What if he'd used an SKS? Would that be an issue for you?

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mdwagner73 wrote:

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GTRMAN wrote:

People have their homes and businesses broken into all the time.

So why not use an AR-15?

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mdwagner73 wrote:

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GTRMAN wrote:

Why not use an AR-15?

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mdwagner73 wrote:

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rbstern wrote:

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mdwagner73 wrote:

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So we need to maintain the country's supply of legally available guns so people who sell guns have plenty of guns to protect their guns from people who want to steal guns...  That makes perfect sense.

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Happens to be a gun store.  Could have been any type of establishment with high dollar inventory, cash business, ATM machine, etc.  The drive-in style of attack used by the invaders is a common enough method.

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Okay, then show me the story about somebody who had to defend himself with an AR15 when someone broke into his story to steal his ATM machine. 

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Why would the guy need an AR15 if he didn't have a store full of guns? 

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Great, then show me the story of the guy who needed an AR15 to protect his home or business that wasn't a gun store.

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[GTRMAN]

I personally have no interest in the AR-15. I just don't understand why people fear them so...

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rbstern wrote:

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GTRMAN wrote:

People have their homes and businesses broken into all the time.

So why not use an AR-15?

Apparently, mdwagner73 gets weak-kneed when he sees an AR15.

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[Mossy Mossy Mo…]

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GTRMAN wrote:

Why does it matter that it happened to be a gun store in this case? Why are youtrying to obfuscate the discussion? Why do you have a problem with someone using an AR-15 for home defense? What if he'd used an SKS? Would that be an issue for you?

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mdwagner73 wrote:

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GTRMAN wrote:

People have their homes and businesses broken into all the time.

So why not use an AR-15?

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mdwagner73 wrote:

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GTRMAN wrote:

Why not use an AR-15?

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mdwagner73 wrote:

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rbstern wrote:

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mdwagner73 wrote:

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So we need to maintain the country's supply of legally available guns so people who sell guns have plenty of guns to protect their guns from people who want to steal guns...  That makes perfect sense.

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Happens to be a gun store.  Could have been any type of establishment with high dollar inventory, cash business, ATM machine, etc.  The drive-in style of attack used by the invaders is a common enough method.

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Okay, then show me the story about somebody who had to defend himself with an AR15 when someone broke into his story to steal his ATM machine. 

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Why would the guy need an AR15 if he didn't have a store full of guns? 

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Great, then show me the story of the guy who needed an AR15 to protect his home or business that wasn't a gun store.

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A grenade launcher could also be used for home defense. 

[mdwagner73]

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rbstern wrote:

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GTRMAN wrote:

People have their homes and businesses broken into all the time.

So why not use an AR-15?

Apparently, mdwagner73 gets weak-kneed when he sees an AR15.

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I don't have any problems with AR-15s.  But if you're trying to make a case for ordinary people having a legitimate use for AR-15s, a gun shop owner is not the best example.  Gun dealers are licensed.  This gun shop owner is more regulated and, most likely, far more experienced with firearms than your average convenience store owner or non-gun related business owner.  It's his business to know how to handle a firearm.

[rbstern]

Here are some AR-15 self-defense incidents, including an armed robbery at a convenience store:

http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20110119/NEWS01/301190078/Man+shot+during+Louisville+store+ro...

http://www.wsmv.com/story/17551512/shooting-reported-in-north-nashville

http://www.fox5vegas.com/story/20418735/police-home-invasion-suspect-shot-killed

http://www.khou.com/news/crime/Burglary-suspect-shot-by-15-year-old-son-of-deputy-97430719.html

[rbstern]

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mdwagner73 wrote:

I don't have any problems with AR-15s.  But if you're trying to make a case for ordinary people having a legitimate use for AR-15s, a gun shop owner is not the best example.  Gun dealers are licensed.  This gun shop owner is more regulated and, most likely, far more experienced with firearms than your average convenience store owner or non-gun related business owner.  It's his business to know how to handle a firearm.

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Gun store owners aren't all firearms enthusiasts who practice regularly.  Getting a federal firearms license has no pretense of skill with a gun.   Many FFLs are pawn shop owners with a small handful of guns in the store, alongside the gold necklaces in the glass case.  Or a hardware store owner with a display of guns just behind the lawn and garden section.

Getting an FFL isn't much different than getting a concealed weapons permit in many states.  Same FBI background check.  The FFL involves more paperwork, but that's mostly about compliance, not someone's trustworthiness with guns. 

Maybe learn more about the world of guns before you offer prescriptions for solving their ills?

[mdwagner73]

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rbstern wrote:

Here are some AR-15 self-defense incidents, including an armed robbery at a convenience store:

http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20110119/NEWS01/301190078/Man+shot+during+Louisville+store+ro...

http://www.wsmv.com/story/17551512/shooting-reported-in-north-nashville

http://www.fox5vegas.com/story/20418735/police-home-invasion-suspect-shot-killed

http://www.khou.com/news/crime/Burglary-suspect-shot-by-15-year-old-son-of-deputy-97430719.html

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First story doesn't say anything about an AR-15, unless it's in the "paid archive".

In what way did the guy in the second story need an AR-15?  He faced one intruder, the other fled after hearing gunshots.  The gun shop owner was facing 3 intruders, which might necessitate more firepower, but this story just sounds like that's what he had, not what he needed.

The third story sounds suspicious.  A gun fight that spilled into the parking lot?  Is that really what you're advocating?  Gun fights in the parking lots of apartement complexes?  Sounds like more than just a home invasion.  And I don't see any mention of what type of firearms were used.

Fourth story, same as second story.  Nothing to indicate that the assault rifle used was necessary.  Plus, it's a story about a minor, are you suggesting that minors should be allowed to have assault weapons too? 

[mdwagner73]

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rbstern wrote:

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mdwagner73 wrote:

I don't have any problems with AR-15s.  But if you're trying to make a case for ordinary people having a legitimate use for AR-15s, a gun shop owner is not the best example.  Gun dealers are licensed.  This gun shop owner is more regulated and, most likely, far more experienced with firearms than your average convenience store owner or non-gun related business owner.  It's his business to know how to handle a firearm.

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Gun store owners aren't all firearms enthusiasts who practice regularly.  Getting a federal firearms license has no pretense of skill with a gun.   Many FFLs are pawn shop owners with a small handful of guns in the store, alongside the gold necklaces in the glass case.  Or a hardware store owner with a display of guns just behind the lawn and garden section.

Getting an FFL isn't much different than getting a concealed weapons permit in many states.  Same FBI background check.  The FFL involves more paperwork, but that's mostly about compliance, not someone's trustworthiness with guns. 

Maybe learn more about the world of guns before you offer prescriptions for solving their ills?

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The gun shop in the story is not a pawn shop with a small handful of guns.  So why pretend that that's what it is?

Who said anything about concealed carry permits?  We're taliking about using an AR-15 to defend a home or business.  Who carries an AR-15 as a concealed carry weapon? 

I didn't offer any prescriptions to cure anyone's ills. 

[gspointer]

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mdwagner73 wrote:

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rbstern wrote:

Here are some AR-15 self-defense incidents, including an armed robbery at a convenience store:

http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20110119/NEWS01/301190078/Man+shot+during+Louisville+store+ro...

http://www.wsmv.com/story/17551512/shooting-reported-in-north-nashville

http://www.fox5vegas.com/story/20418735/police-home-invasion-suspect-shot-killed

http://www.khou.com/news/crime/Burglary-suspect-shot-by-15-year-old-son-of-deputy-97430719.html

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First story doesn't say anything about an AR-15, unless it's in the "paid archive".

In what way did the guy in the second story need an AR-15?  He faced one intruder, the other fled after hearing gunshots.  The gun shop owner was facing 3 intruders, which might necessitate more firepower, but this story just sounds like that's what he had, not what he needed.

The third story sounds suspicious.  A gun fight that spilled into the parking lot?  Is that really what you're advocating?  Gun fights in the parking lots of apartement complexes?  Sounds like more than just a home invasion.  And I don't see any mention of what type of firearms were used.

Fourth story, same as second story.  Nothing to indicate that the assault rifle used was necessary.  Plus, it's a story about a minor, are you suggesting that minors should be allowed to have assault weapons too? 

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And this is why it is a waste of your time to show anything to those quivering folks that fear an inanimate object.

Show them a story where someone was killed after emptying a 6-shot revolver, they will say he only needed 7 shots.

They are not using anything but emotion, they have been fully sucked in to the current propaganda and are pretty much hopeless. They have been programmed to believe that guns are scary, and all anyone "needs" (love hearing the brainwashed folks use that word) is a double barrel shotgun.

[rbstern]

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mdwagner73 wrote:

The gun shop in the story is not a pawn shop with a small handful of guns.  So why pretend that that's what it is?

The point is: You are attributing universal characteristics to federal firearms licensees that don't exist.

Who said anything about concealed carry permits?  We're taliking about using an AR-15 to defend a home or business.  Who carries an AR-15 as a concealed carry weapon? 

Again, you were giving special status to gun store owners, and I am explaining that the process to become an FFL is not rigorous relative to other forms of gun-related permits. In fact, many carry permit owners have a gun-use training requirement that no FFL has to meet.

In fact, it's possible to get an FFL knowning absolutely nothing about guns, except how to record their model and serial numbers in a notebook.

I didn't offer any prescriptions to cure anyone's ills. 

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Your posts suggest otherwise.

[rbstern]

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gspointer wrote:

They have been programmed to believe that guns are scary, and all anyone "needs" (love hearing the brainwashed folks use that word) is a double barrel shotgun.

Joe Biden said that's all I need.  I can certainly trust him. He's a politician. 

[Disemboweler]

I never understood the "need" argument when applied to firearms. I'm a former marine infantryman. All I "need" to kill someone is my hands. I could kill people more easily with a knife. Or a pistol, or a rifle. 

The "need" argument is absurd. Everytime I downgrade the amount of firepower I can untilize, I increase the risk to myself. I don't believe in fair fights, and if I had a homing death ray gun whose death rays would home in on and vaporize whoever was attacking me, I'd take it in a heartbeat.

Amazing how much these armchair generals tell others how much firepower they "need" to protect themselves.

[Belva]

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Mossy Mossy Moss wrote:

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Belva wrote:

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Mossy Mossy Moss wrote:

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Belva wrote:

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Mossy Mossy Moss wrote:

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rbstern wrote:

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John Ellis wrote:

Seems like the AR15 was the right tool to secure it.......lol

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It's pretty funny, isnt it?  Liberwhack gun grabbers argue all day long about how nobody needs an AR15.  The business owner in this story righteously goes into a one against three armed confrontation,  prevails using an AR15, and the liberwhacks are still arguing how there is no valid reason for civilians to legally own an AR15.

It's like arguing with a guy on the deck of the Titanic, who insists the ship is unsinkable, even as the water is washing over his shoes.

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He could have done the same thing with a baseball bat, if he weren't such a pussy.

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Yeah, right. And my butt is 24K gold. Did the owner know whether or not the bad guys were armed? They could very well have been even if they had no guns when they first crashed thru the front of the store.

But people like you with small dicks don't have much common sense

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Guns are for pussies who can't win a fist fight. He wouldn't have even needed a baseball bat if he wasn't carrying a bunch of guns, making him a target for burglary. 

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How do you propose making this guy sell something other than guns?

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Outlaw the sale of guns.

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SCOTUS has stated that the status quo for the 2nd Amendment means that people who want guns can have guns. If you aren't happy with that, feel free to move to country that has a total gun ban.

Your wish won't happen, deal with it. I'm sorry you can't masturbate because of your tiny penis. Don't come here and take the frustration caused by that out on everybody

[Mossy Mossy Mo…]

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Belva wrote:

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Mossy Mossy Moss wrote:

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Belva wrote:

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Mossy Mossy Moss wrote:

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Belva wrote:

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Mossy Mossy Moss wrote:

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rbstern wrote:

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John Ellis wrote:

Seems like the AR15 was the right tool to secure it.......lol

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It's pretty funny, isnt it?  Liberwhack gun grabbers argue all day long about how nobody needs an AR15.  The business owner in this story righteously goes into a one against three armed confrontation,  prevails using an AR15, and the liberwhacks are still arguing how there is no valid reason for civilians to legally own an AR15.

It's like arguing with a guy on the deck of the Titanic, who insists the ship is unsinkable, even as the water is washing over his shoes.

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He could have done the same thing with a baseball bat, if he weren't such a pussy.

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Yeah, right. And my butt is 24K gold. Did the owner know whether or not the bad guys were armed? They could very well have been even if they had no guns when they first crashed thru the front of the store.

But people like you with small dicks don't have much common sense

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Guns are for pussies who can't win a fist fight. He wouldn't have even needed a baseball bat if he wasn't carrying a bunch of guns, making him a target for burglary. 

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How do you propose making this guy sell something other than guns?

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Outlaw the sale of guns.

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SCOTUS has stated that the status quo for the 2nd Amendment means that people who want guns can have guns. If you aren't happy with that, feel free to move to country that has a total gun ban.

Your wish won't happen, deal with it. I'm sorry I can't masturbate because of my tiny penis. I come here and take the frustration caused by that out on everybody

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It's going to happen. It's only a matter of time.

We're coming for your guns.

[John Ellis]

 You anonymous little chickenshit, you ain't coming for anything. 

[Mossy Mossy Mo…]

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John Ellis wrote:

 I gargle with hobo semen

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Indeed.

[GTRMAN]

So what is your problem with an ordinary citizen having an AR-15?

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mdwagner73 wrote:

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rbstern wrote:

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GTRMAN wrote:

People have their homes and businesses broken into all the time.

So why not use an AR-15?

Apparently, mdwagner73 gets weak-kneed when he sees an AR15.

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I don't have any problems with AR-15s.  But if you're trying to make a case for ordinary people having a legitimate use for AR-15s, a gun shop owner is not the best example.  Gun dealers are licensed.  This gun shop owner is more regulated and, most likely, far more experienced with firearms than your average convenience store owner or non-gun related business owner.  It's his business to know how to handle a firearm.

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[55gibby]

In other news.... billions of unarmed people.live normal lives and are never assaulted

[GTRMAN]

What' good for the goose is not always what's good for the gander. We do not live in a one-size-fits-all world.

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55gibby wrote:
In other news.... billions of unarmed people.live normal lives and are never assaulted

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[55gibby]

Gtrman...

It's not the caliber of the weapon, It's the quality of the society that keeps us safe