Songwriting Workshop

[stickboymusic]

Hello

Just came out with this one - its just a start.

Do you think its working this far.... i hoping its going to be a sparse/intimate recording

Got a way to go with the writing at the mo but anything jumping out?

Here is a rough demo recorded quickly onto my phone.

http://picosong.com/384d/

If you're lonely
Then it seems you do not know me
I've been hanging round forever
Only to find
I am never in your arms
And never on your mind

If you're lonely
Reach out your hand and hold me
For a million days won't matter
If you don't see
That a million dreams will shatter
When I leave

Life is like a rollercoaster running out of steam
First you have the ups and downs and then the inbetween
If you don't want to take this ride alone then let it show
I guess that lonely, is the only thing you know

[rangefinder]

I don't know, I'm not taking much away from it. In particular, the second verse doesn't make sense to me. Where did a million days come from, and who's having these a million dreams? In any case, a million is a pretty big number. And why is he leaving?

The melody is pleasant enough but it makes... me... sleepy. Sparse/intimate is one thing, somnolent is another.

[stickboymusic]

Originally Posted by rangefinder

I don't know, I'm not taking much away from it. In particular, the second verse doesn't make sense to me. Where did a million days come from, and who's having these a million dreams? In any case, a million is a pretty big number. And why is he leaving?

The melody is pleasant enough but it makes... me... sleepy. Sparse/intimate is one thing, somnolent is another.

I am not sure it needs an explaination but what is being said is that a life time (a million days?) wont matter if she (the girl) doesnt realise she needs to speak up soon or the man will be gone.

I am not sure what sort of music you are into, you have only really ever posted here with strong critisisms, no suggestions and bluntness.

I am always happy for some negative/constructive feedback but yours always seems a little pointless.

Maybe stick my demo on again and get yourself to sleep.

[oldgitplayer]

There's probably never a song of yours that I feel like saying 'Dump it and start again'.
I think this one has its strength to build on. The only weakness I'm hearing is the melodic weakness of the 1st two lines of the verses.

The 1st line is OK on its own, but when its followed by the 2nd, they sound very predictable. It's mainly the upward inflection on the words 'hold me' that is the weakest link.
I don't know what key you are in, but it sounds like 1st line - C / Cmaj7 and 2nd line F / Fmaj7. Maybe try descending the melody on the 'hold me' or alternatively change the F / Fmaj7 to another chord.

For some reason, when I first read the lyric, I imagined Gerry Marsden singing it in a mid-tempo Liverpool cheeky chappy sort of way as he did in the mid-sixties.

[tbry]

I usually love everything you do but in this case the melody is not up to your usual standards. I have no suggs just an observance.

[rangefinder]

Originally Posted by stickboymusic

I am always happy for some negative/constructive feedback but yours always seems a little pointless.

Actually it's most of the songs on here that seem a little pointless, hence my generally negative feedback.

I like songs that actually have structure and meaning, set to music offering some level of interest, not quasi-poetic ramblings over quasi-random guitar noodlings.

If people gave more real thought to their songs, I'd give more real thought to my feedback. Otherwise, there's usually not much to say.

Don't worry, since this forum appears to be overwhelmingly hobbyists and their fanboys, I probably won't be around for long.

[bee3]

Originally Posted by rangefinder

Actually it's most of the songs on here that seem a little pointless, hence my generally negative feedback.

I like songs that actually have structure and meaning, set to music offering some level of interest, not quasi-poetic ramblings over quasi-random guitar noodlings.

If people gave more real thought to their songs, I'd give more real thought to my feedback. Otherwise, there's usually not much to say.

Don't worry, since this forum appears to be overwhelmingly hobbyists and their fanboys, I probably won't be around for long.

Holy christ, you are a supreme asshole. Good riddance.

[LCK]

As the beginnings of something, I think it's definitely got the potential to be a really good tune. I really like the chords and the tune, though

I think the lyric is off to a terrific start. I'm never in your arms or on your mind. Beautiful.

I really like the way it ends now, but thought maybe this might be a bit better?

If you don't want to take this ride alone then let it show
unless lonely, is the only thing you know.

or

If you don't want to take this ride alone just let me know
unless you think that lonely, is the only way to go.

There are lots of possibilities. But it's great as is.

[stickboymusic]

Originally Posted by tbry

I usually love everything you do but in this case the melody is not up to your usual standards. I have no suggs just an observance.

I often have this problem when posting a rough phone demo straight after writing the initial idea - if there is "something" there I can usually much improve it once I start recording and trying as few things.

Originally Posted by LCK

As the beginnings of something, I think it's definitely got the potential to be a really good tune. I really like the chords and the tune, though

I think the lyric is off to a terrific start. I'm never in your arms or on your mind. Beautiful.

I really like the way it ends now, but thought maybe this might be a bit better?

If you don't want to take this ride alone then let it show
unless lonely, is the only thing you know.

or

If you don't want to take this ride alone just let me know
unless you think that lonely, is the only way to go.

There are lots of possibilities. But it's great as is.

Thanks - will have a look at those last two lines.

Originally Posted by oldgitplayer

There's probably never a song of yours that I feel like saying 'Dump it and start again'.
I think this one has its strength to build on. The only weakness I'm hearing is the melodic weakness of the 1st two lines of the verses.

The 1st line is OK on its own, but when its followed by the 2nd, they sound very predictable. It's mainly the upward inflection on the words 'hold me' that is the weakest link.
I don't know what key you are in, but it sounds like 1st line - C / Cmaj7 and 2nd line F / Fmaj7. Maybe try descending the melody on the 'hold me' or alternatively change the F / Fmaj7 to another chord.

For some reason, when I first read the lyric, I imagined Gerry Marsden singing it in a mid-tempo Liverpool cheeky chappy sort of way as he did in the mid-sixties.

Similar to what I said above, melody/structure will be improved in the recording - thanks OGP

Originally Posted by rangefinder

Actually it's most of the songs on here that seem a little pointless, hence my generally negative feedback.

You're probably right - but in your world isnt EVERYTHING pointless - booo hooo

[Lee Knight]

I love that rangefinder guy.

I've been wanting to listen to this but I am out of town with only an iPhone. It seems your choice of playback site requires flash. Looking forward to getting the chance though.

[RickDieffenbach]

Hi Stick,

I pulled the song into a wave editor, and took a small snip out of the first verse, just to hear a slightly different chord change sequence and change in melody. I kinda like it. It may not match your vision of your song, but maybe might generate an idea.

www.allureiw.com/cut.mp3

If your lonely, then it seems you do [SECTION CUT] forever only to find...


Rick

[RickDieffenbach]

Originally Posted by rangefinder

Actually it's most of the songs on here that seem a little pointless, hence my generally negative feedback.

I like songs that actually have structure and meaning, set to music offering some level of interest, not quasi-poetic ramblings over quasi-random guitar noodlings.

If people gave more real thought to their songs, I'd give more real thought to my feedback. Otherwise, there's usually not much to say.

Don't worry, since this forum appears to be overwhelmingly hobbyists and their fanboys, I probably won't be around for long.

The only thing Rangefinder and having looked at your last 30-50 posts I can confirm this, is that there are those that sit on the side lines and heckle, and those that point out issues and use their experience to pitch in and help. You may in fact be right in some of what you say in some of your posts, but from my vantage point I see about 50% just way off base.

If your comments were purely on the music, then that would be one thing. But they tend to stray into the personal "I am better than you" category quite often. The only thing is, you may think you are better than everyone else, but my sense is that you are probably the only one who believes that.

As for this song of Stick's, It's a DEMO. It's an IDEA. It's not a friggin finished piece. I'm a friggin amateur who sits in his basement and trys to write music and I can listen to the this song and get past that. If you're such an expert, why can't you?

There's an old saying, pardon me for using what is a cliche, it's 20 years in the military talking: Lead, follow or get out of the way.

Rick

[Chicken Monkey]

I thought the chord progression was cool. I liked the lyric of the first two lines--old gitplayer complains about the melody, and that might be valid, but I was delighted enough by the forced rhyme that it worked for me. The bridge lyric is exceptional. Rangefinder is right in that the whole thing is a bit sleepy, but that can get ironed out with a fuller arrangement and a more confident performance.

[Marshal]

I like the song so far. Melodically it's not compelling. But it stays consistent in it's sad story-telling bent. The story itself is a great start. I feel like I'm forming an impression of these characters. I care about what's happening. The language is simplistic sometimes, but you have a knack of closing a phrase in a unique way that keeps them fresh, without being obtuse. That's a gift.

Like I said, it's not compelling, but it's an engaging storyline.

You could develop another verse that gives some specific example of their interaction, and then run through your rollercoaster chorus. Maybe make it occur in a carnival or something.

[LeonardScaper]

This I like.....

I've been hanging round forever
Only to find
I am never in your arms
And never on your mind

And this......it might work fine without the millions, although that does remove the whole lifetime thing.

For a million days won't matter
If you don't see
That a million dreams will shatter
When I leave

Was thinking that a rollercoaster is a gravity driven device but given further thought the 'running out of steam' still works as a colloquialism.

Life is like a rollercoaster running out of steam

Originally Posted by rangefinder

I like songs that actually have structure and meaning, set to music offering some level of interest, not quasi-poetic ramblings over quasi-random guitar noodlings.

Interesting. As I think about that as it relates to this particular thread my mind drifts back over the last year of workshopping here. I would have to say that a good percentage of what we throw up here falls squarely into that category. But there are definitely a few golden nuggets as well.

I'm still glad that anything goes here and that folks have the courage to put their early efforts out for all to see and comment on.....that's what we do here.

Oh, btw, stickboy.......how many of those quasi-poetic tunes of yours have you placed commercially again?

[Monkey Uncle]

Originally Posted by bee3

Holy christ, you are a supreme asshole. Good riddance.

Ha! I'm going to borrow that for my sig, if you don't mind.

[bee3]

Originally Posted by Monkey Uncle

Ha! I'm going to borrow that for my sig, if you don't mind.

I'm honored!

[bee3]

I think the song is good and have no doubt that when you flesh this out, it'll be up to par with anything else you've done. And I love this line: First you have the ups and downs and then the inbetween

The song resonates because today, I came into work to find out that a co-worker who was a supreme loner passed away yesterday. She was an odd-bird through and through... in fact, my interactions with her were rather uncomfortable because of her behavior, which in-turn led to her loner lifestyle (or maybe it was the other way around... who knows?) Regardless, she was apparently so alone, that her second cousin called her boss and asked him to write the obituary. There was no one else to do it.

[LordBTY]

I love it. A few tweeks are needed, but I enjoyed listening to this. Firstly, I'd set it to ballad form - AABA.


If you're lonely
Then it seems you do not know me
I've been hanging round forever
Only to find
I am never in your arms
And never on your mind

If you're lonely
Reach out your hand and hold me
For a million days won't matter
If you don't see (This is where things start to feel a bit slow and pointless, maybe engage the listener with some interesting imagery.)
That a million dreams will shatter
When I leave

Life is like a rollercoaster running out of steam
First you have the ups and downs and then the inbetween
If you don't want to take this ride alone then let it show
I guess that lonely, is the only thing you know

I'd repeat that last line of the B section or something for hook/emphasis. I'd then repeat the first verse.

[LordBTY]

I love it. A few tweeks are needed, but I enjoyed listening to this. Firstly, I'd set it to ballad form - AABA.


If you're lonely
Then it seems you do not know me
I've been hanging round forever
Only to find
I am never in your arms
And never on your mind

If you're lonely
Reach out your hand and hold me
For a million days won't matter
If you don't see (This is where things start to feel a bit slow and pointless, maybe engage the listener with some interesting imagery.)
That a million dreams will shatter
When I leave

Life is like a rollercoaster running out of steam
First you have the ups and downs and then the inbetween
If you don't want to take this ride alone then let it show
I guess that lonely, is the only thing you know

I'd repeat that last line of the B section or something for hook/emphasis. I'd then repeat the first verse.