Graeca wrote:One of the guys I play with, used to play clubs in Montreal when he was young (25 years ago). He's a very talented guy, and he still receives royalty cheques for stuff he's written and sold over the years. Unfortunately, that guy has no job, and he's a drunk. A "falling down" drunk. He often has to pawn his guitars, just to get through the month. He's aked me to lend him gear, so he can go make a few bucks playing in bars and restaurants, and I simply say no. I simply have no confidence that he would return my gear, because I know he'll get loaded, and someone could grab that gear when he's not looking, then I'm out,,,, not him. He'd never be able to replace that gear. That said; I love playing with this guy. We're incredibly well-suited to sing harmony together, and we both like and play much of the same music. So you see,,, I DO get "something" out of it.
Used to work with a guy like that...great harmony singer, excellent rhythm guitarist, funny guy to hang with, in all but one way The Perfect Band-mate...he was addicted to codeine cough-syrup and, like your friend, tended to lose gear in hockshops unless I'd get it out for him, then deduct it from what we'd make, and often he needed me to lend him an instrument...
Finally, I found a surprising nice-playing/sounding Hondo II D-28 knock-off w/ a Gawd-awful paint job, one that no pawnshop would lend any $$$ on, at a swap-meet...problem solved. Best $7 I ever spent.
That's toooo funny.
Bobby1Note wrote:
Graeca wrote:One of the guys I play with, used to play clubs in Montreal when he was young (25 years ago). He's a very talented guy, and he still receives royalty cheques for stuff he's written and sold over the years. Unfortunately, that guy has no job, and he's a drunk. A "falling down" drunk. He often has to pawn his guitars, just to get through the month. He's aked me to lend him gear, so he can go make a few bucks playing in bars and restaurants, and I simply say no. I simply have no confidence that he would return my gear, because I know he'll get loaded, and someone could grab that gear when he's not looking, then I'm out,,,, not him. He'd never be able to replace that gear. That said; I love playing with this guy. We're incredibly well-suited to sing harmony together, and we both like and play much of the same music. So you see,,, I DO get "something" out of it.
Used to work with a guy like that...great harmony singer, excellent rhythm guitarist, funny guy to hang with, in all but one way The Perfect Band-mate...he was addicted to codeine cough-syrup and, like your friend, tended to lose gear in hockshops unless I'd get it out for him, then deduct it from what we'd make, and often he needed me to lend him an instrument...
Finally, I found a surprising nice-playing/sounding Hondo II D-28 knock-off w/ a Gawd-awful paint job, one that no pawnshop would lend any $$$ on, at a swap-meet...problem solved. Best $7 I ever spent.
That's toooo funny.
It worked out, and he used that ugly thing for the last 13 years of his life. And it really sounded surprisingly good, once I put a piezo p/u under the bridge...guess Hondo II's QC f'ed up and let a good one past!
Audiopile wrote:I was in a similar situation in the '80's. I was supplying, transporting, storing, maintaining, and setting up & tearing down the production gear for a band I was playing in. The members were kicking-in approx. $10 ea. per show to me to "cover it". One of the guitarists that was playing with us at the time (a short time) kicked in for approx. 8 or 10 shows ($80 - $100 total worth of "payments"), and then quit the band to move out of the area (his wife got a good job elsewhere)... and he wanted me to "cash him out" on the spot for what he alledged was his bought & paid for 20% share of about $20K worth of production gear (in the '80), and my dually one-ton cube van and trailer. He even released an attorney on me to "get satisfaction". I refunded the guitarist's $80 - $100 in "payments" after a short chat with his attorney and it was resolved, but I suspect it could have gotten uglier (if I hadn't known the attorney well).
This is one of the reasons why I've never charged a dime for providing PA and/or lights when I've provided for the bands that play with. The minute you start collecting $$$ for providing PA and/or lights - the potential for misunderstanding goes thru the roof. Some folks will assume that by virtue of their regular payments ... they've somehow established a sort of equity in the system. Others start making assumptions that their $15 per gig contribution somehow obligates whoever received the $$$ to perpetually provide PA.
Being that I unilaterally decided to go out and purchase my system - paid in full at the time of purchase - the few $$$ I might collect is not as important to me as to avoid any sort of conflict and/or confusion about the system. By not collecting a dime - there's no question that it's 100% mine. Nobody can assume that their contribution gives them any standing in discussions about a) how I set it up and/or operate it and/or b) that they have any standing in discussions about when or how I plan to upgrade / replace / repair gear. Finally, IF I elect to not provide PA in the future - nobody has any claim that my acceptance of their previous contributions somehow obligates me to continue providing PA.
It's funny how different people have different attitudes towards this. Amy and I paid for everything we use on stage. If an amp went bad, we replaced it. Speaker needed fixed - we fixed it. We bought a trailer for the PA, shirts, stickers, paper and toner, etc. - whatever it took to keep the band running, it seemed that we were buying it.
But about a year ago, our then-drummer suggested that we start a PA fund - by giving the PA fund an even share (a 7-way split, including our soundman) - with the money going towards upgrades and PA maintenence (cables, etc.) and everyone agreed to it. With that fund, we were able to buy a couple of Yorkville powered subs. 
Then, we bought some powered EV tops (special MF deal - less than half of what they normally cost). Those speakers sound amazing and were worth every penny we paid (and a lot more) - and everyone benefits from their use. There wasn't enough in the band fund to cover all of it, so I put the rest (most of their cost) on a credit card and the PA fund is now paying me the balance so I can pay them off. After they're paid off the PA will come into positive numbers and we can start saving for the next upgrade or whatever we need. Makes sense, yes?
However, someone recently wanted to stop doing the PA fund thing altogether, although the speakers are about 20% paid for. 
Not to mention, we're going to need to replace some cables and some other little things soon - which is one of the reasons why we started the band fund in the first place.
Someone else had the idea to simply take a night's gig pay and pay off the balance and be done with it. 
To me, this would be the quickest/easiest solution (and save me on credit card interest), but not everyone is willing to take a hit for a night, but whatever... we'll just continue on as we have been with it.
Still, the bottom line - everyone benefits from the PA. We wouldn't be a working band without one.
Simple math shows a rather cheap $10K PA taking 100 gigs to pay off - hardly "short order". Then there's upgrades, replacing "missing" cables, transport, etc...
Easy Listener wrote:As you can see, if the band gigs a lot, the guy who owns the pa will get it paid for in short order. And once it's paid for, it's pure profit AND he gets his PA paid for.
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