Keys, Synths & Samplers

[dan88z]

I bought a used Yamaha S70XS last Sunday. I spent a few hours each night this week working up all the patches I had in my S90ES on the XS (there is no way to transfer them as the voice architecture is different). Last night I assigned all the patches to Master slots and filled all of banks A and B, and most of C, around 45 sounds. Many multi part splits and layers, and a lot of midi control from the XS to my Stage Compact.

Overall the board sounds great. All of the patches that I recreated sound better on the XS.

I had some growing pains getting the midi worked out from the XS to the Stage, but once I figured out what settings had to be adjusted on each master, it only took an hour or so to go thru them all and get everything working as I expected it to.

Some people have said they don't like how Yamaha went to the smaller screen on this board, but really, it didn't bug me a bit. Navigation is easier with the way the have the operating system set up. The PC editor is really nice so voice level editing was easy. The one drawback, which won't be an issue live, is with the small screen, when you hit a bank button, it doesn't bring up a list of the voices in that bank like the S90ES does. So when I was programming things into Masters from voice and performances, I'd have to scroll thru to find the sound I needed. Like I said, this won't be an issue live as I have an excel spreadsheet with all our songs and what patch goes to what. I make the set lists for the band and print out a copy for me that has the patches along with the song so it's no problem getting around the sounds live.

It's hard to logically lay out the master section when you have so many sounds that are specific to one song. I put bread and butter stuff on bank A- piano, piano/string layer, Rhodes, Dyno/chorusy Rhodes, Wurlie, piano/ep/string layer, a couple slots where I trigger the Nord Stage sounds with no internal sound from the XS, 3 different string patches, a big horn section sound I programmed, and a velocity horn patch. Then on banks B and C, I put all the song specific patches. They aren't really in any order, I just went down a set list I had and added them in. It's too much work to reprogram Master mode to follow the set list for each show, and a lot of times we'll sub a song in or skip something so I'd have to know what the patch is for that song anyway. I've used thie spreadsheet method for years with the ES and it works well for me. I had most of the locations memorized on the ES, which were completely random in how I had them programmed, just wherever there was an open slot, I'd store a new sound for a new song we learned. Now I'll have to reprogram my brain to learn the new locations on the XS!

[pdiddy]

Hey Dan,

Glad to hear the board is working out for you. Still considering an S70 myself. Can you confirm that you can directly call up your sounds if you know the storage location, like User A 12 for example? Also, what are you planning to do for a road case?

[dan88z]

If you are calling up a voice or performance, in voice or performance mode, you have to scroll to the bank you want then hit your A 12 for the voice. I think there are 6 or 8 preset banks and then 4 user banks. There are 4 user banks for performances. I always map everything to master mode, that way you have 128 locations to store either voices, performances or sequence/multis.

I have an old SKB 5820 case I'm using. It was a little too small for my S90ES. It's got the modular foam in it so I was able to add enough to make the XS fit in there well. It's not saving me any weight over the soft bag I used on the S90ES, but it's a lot safer and actually easier to move around in the SKB.

[c4racer]

I have had a S90ES for several years now - probably 4 at least. I still haven't gotten around to programming user banks with my most used sounds. Is it hard to do on the S90ES? I should probably do that, but I just have a sheet with patch #'s and the song and it isn't all that hard to just pull them up, plus the 5 or so I use the most I don't even need the cheet sheet. Is it really worth it to program pre-set sounds into the user banks?

[dan88z]

Master mode is different then using voice mode. You aren't really reprogramming sounds to user banks, you are simply mapping to them from a master program location. It's a lot easier especially when you have 30+ sounds you use in a night.

[c4racer]

Master mode is different then using voice mode. You aren't really reprogramming sounds to user banks, you are simply mapping to them from a master program location. It's a lot easier especially when you have 30+ sounds you use in a night.

I should try that. I probably have at least half that at least for some of my projects.

[delaware dave]

Congrats Dan. Best of luck with the new board. I just purchased a new Kurzweil PC3; had to send the 1st one back as it was defective; the replacement is arriving tomorrow. Dreading those nights in the basement getting the keyboard dialed in but I guess that is all part of the new keyboard package.

[GigMan]

Congrats Dan. Best of luck with the new board. I just purchased a new Kurzweil PC3; had to send the 1st one back as it was defective; the replacement is arriving tomorrow. Dreading those nights in the basement getting the keyboard dialed in but I guess that is all part of the new keyboard package.

Ha - "delaware dave" and "dan88z" - both Delaware guys... ? :eek: :lol:

Dan - as an owner/user and fan of of the sounds of the Yam S90ES for several years am interested to hear you say you like the sounds on the S70XS better... but that programming you describe still sounds like a lot of work - - all I ever did was get my favorite patches into "Favorites" on the S90ES and created a couple layered patches - Piano w/organ and EP w/organ...

I've been really eyeing up the Yamaha MOX8 lately though, since it is soooo much lighter than the S90 series, yet still has 88 keys. I do NOT like that fact that it has only 64 note Polyphony and NO sliders - but I still will prob'ly go to Guitar Wanker and hear it sometime.

Have also been waiting for Kurzweil to release a 76 key version of the PC3K8 - a "PC3K7"? though I'll have to drive about 1.5 hrs. to NY state to see/hear it at Alto Music. :cool:

[dan88z]

Gigman, Dave and I have known each other for a long time. We've played with a lot of the same circle of players, and he and my brother have played in a couple bands together. A fine guy and a fine player!

Dave, I actually like the work of getting a new board gig ready. Experimenting with the sounds, creating patches. It's a lot of work but it's very satisfying. Best of luck w/ the Kurz, it's about time you got rid of one of those General Music boards!!!

One thing I learned tonight, that I wish I had figured out last week- there is an import function on the patch editor/librarian, where I was able to open up sound banks I had saved from my S90ES, select a patch from the bank and a destination, and it would convert to the XS format. What's cool is I bought the Vintage Keys sound set, and was able to get a bunch of patches I use loaded up. A couple nice Rhodes sounds, and I added in the new key off samples and they really work now.

Gigman- I bet that this would be a part of the MOX editor as well, so you might be able to at least get custom patches off of your ES. There isn't a way to do performances though, which is most of the work for me.

Everything went well on the gig Saturday. I had a couple things to tweak, but nothing too bad. The vocoder gave me problems, but it was because of the mic I used, an old crown headset mic my bass player had. I worked on it tonight, lots of eq adjustment, and it's better now. I'll try it again at the next gig.

[GigMan]

cool... actually, other than the couple layers (Piano/Organ & EP/Organ) I created - I have NO custom patches set up on the S90ES. :facepalm:

So, Dan - why did you make the move from the S90ES to the S70XS... for portability? Seems like it only reduces size/weight a weeee little bit. :confused:

[dan88z]

Yes, a little smaller footprint on stage, we play some pretty tight places. I'm not saving any weight because I'm using an SKB hard case to move it vs the soft Motif bag I have for the ES, but it's easier to move it around in the hard case. There are better sounds and some cool arpeggio features as well. Not that I'll use them all the time but they are good enough that I could do a cocktail set improvising over the grooves.

I was going down the Kronos path, played it for a few hours one day, really liked it, but felt it wasn't worth the expense. I wasn't as turned on by the sounds as I wanted to be, it has a lot of features that I wouldn't use, and couldn't justify spending the $$ on it. I had been looking at the XS as well, and this one fell in my lap for a real good price, so I jumped on it.

[dan88z]

Dave the S90ES is a really nice board, and that's a great price. I'm selling mine for $1000. It's in good shape, a couple dings on the end caps but that's it. To get one in mint for that price is real good. I paid 1500 for my XS too. It's been gigged but not hard. A couple scratches where it rubbed against the guy's stand, but that's all.

[tucktronix]

I've been really eyeing up the Yamaha MOX8 lately though, since it is soooo much lighter than the S90 series, yet still has 88 keys. I do NOT like that fact that it has only 64 note Polyphony and NO sliders - but I still will prob'ly go to Guitar Wanker and hear it sometime.

Hey GigMan, remember me???? I bought a MOX8 about a month ago and I absolutely love this board. The features(not to mention the pianos) are very good, considering what I've actually paid for it. Haven't had any real issues with the 64 note polyphony thus far, but YMMV

[GigMan]

Hey GigMan, remember me????

I bought a MOX8 about a month ago and I absolutely love this board. The features(not to mention the pianos) are very good, considering what I've actually paid for it. Haven't had any real issues with the 64 note polyphony thus far, but YMMV

Cool - I had seen your posts, Tuck, was wondering how you made out w/the MOX8. :wave: I

I long for its portability but am still concerned over polyphony & ability to adjust on the fly w/out any faders... how easy is it to adjust layers, ie, fading in Strings over Piano, Organ over Rhodes, etc... ? :confused:

Plus I absolutely LOVE the acoustic piano sound in my S90ES :cool: - does the MOX8 at least come close, w/acoustic pianos?

[pdiddy]

Took delivery of an S70XS yesterday. Coming from the classic S90. First impression - nicely built machine. 2nd impression - how am I ever going to get comfy with those piano sounds? I've been relying on the S90 bright S700 alot for band use and I can't find anything comparable so far. I only spent a couple hours so far poking around and got pretty distracted by some of the cool performances on the machine - I can definately see using some of these for cocktail hour type gigs. I don't expect to have much trouble dublicating my setups from the S90 over to the new machine as many of the old voices carry over intact or improved. But I think first I gotta focus on finding a piano voice I can live with that will cut as well as the S90's.

Purchase decision was between this and the new Nord Stage 2 - and while money wasn't the most important consideration, at 2X the cost the Nord seemed dang expensive and a bit of a gamble as far as me knowing what I would be getting myself into.

[dan88z]

there are a lot of pianos in the XS, plenty of bright "rock" type pianos. I like the S6 sound, added a little upper mids to the EQ and it cuts fine for me.

[mrvegas]

Hey Dan, I am a working stiff accountant with an S70xs that I have not made the time to learn yet. I could sure use some help on the basics of creating songs, especially with drum patterns, intro's, chorus, etc. Wish I lived in Delaware, I would be willing to pay you to get me up to speed. On the www.sninety.com website there is an instructional DVD for Motif XS, but I am guessing that the underlying software/screens/etc are too different between the Motif XS and the S70XS to make it worthwhile. Also, I would love to learn how to do some of the stuff shown on this video ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvShmhN6V9M

[dan88z]

mrvegas, I have barely touched the arps and drum patterns. My focus is creating the sounds I need for my band gigs. I do like to play around with some of the performances that let you jam along but I haven't gotten into creating ones that call up any of the thousands of patterns that are in there.

On that demo vid, those are all stock patches he's using, just go into performance mode and start scrolling thru, you'll find lots of fun stuff to play with.

[mrvegas]

dan, there is an instructional DVD for sale on sninety.com but it is for the Motif XS. Do you think that would be helpful to get me going on song creation, loops, drum patterns, etc, or do you think it would confuse matters because it is not really the same board?