Electric Guitars

[GreatDane]

Originally Posted by ajcoholic

That neck is 100% maple. No doubt about it.

I did a job 2 or 3 summers ago (forgot) where I took a guys old white Studio, stripped it and defretted it, bound the body and neck and did a refret, and did the black top/ natural back and sides. Lovely finish... the guy was very happy.

Some of you guys take this guitars thing WAY too seriously. I mean its not an original 59' or something... come on. It;ll be WAY more valuable to the owner as a fixed up, playable guitar than some restored antique.

AJC

ooh, what a tease! that looks great, AJ! I have a feeling, with the P90s and reassembly, this Deluxe has the potential to look even better

[Super Bass]

Anything with P90's = better.

That guitar above with P90's = AWESOME!

Black covers would look better than creme though.

[meandi]

Originally Posted by ajcoholic

That neck is 100% maple. No doubt about it.

I did a job 2 or 3 summers ago (forgot) where I took a guys old white Studio, stripped it and defretted it, bound the body and neck and did a refret, and did the black top/ natural back and sides. Lovely finish... the guy was very happy.

Some of you guys take this guitars thing WAY too seriously. I mean its not an original 59' or something... come on. It;ll be WAY more valuable to the owner as a fixed up, playable guitar than some restored antique.

AJC

Thanks AJ, you're just the guy I was hoping would chime in & verify what I strongly felt.
Inspirational work there.

I assume the neck on it was mahogany, or did you do a tint on maple to achieve the color match?
Although the maple on GreatDane's neck is more of an amber color than some of the maple in my shop, it's still considerably whiter than the mahogany in the body.
Part of how I'm spending the weekend is researching formulas that will allow me to shoot a dye tinted wash coat on the neck to bring it more into sync, color wise, with the body woods.

[docjeffrey]

Originally Posted by Ryan Trevisol

Wow, seriously, caretakers while we are here on earth? Is someone having a 3/4 life crisis?

Some people wouldn't know a good Les Paul if it jumped up and bit them in the ass, but great instruments are few and far between.

Even in the 1950's, Ted McCarty and Les Paul recognized that Honduran Mahagany worked best with the Les Paul guitar. McCarty did tests to figure out which combination of woods gave them the optimal sustain and tonal properties. This stuff is no longer available. And, even 50 years ago, McCarty recognized that African mahogany was "junk" as he put it.

The bottom line is that there are a finite number of guitars that have the magic formula of tonewoods. We need to protect them so that 50 years from now they are still making great music by guitarists that have yet to be born.

If some of you would read something besides HCEG, you'd start to appreciate what the pioneers of the modern electric guitar gave us. Their knowledge goes far beyond what you'll find on the internet. Les Paul understands tone. So did Ted McCarty, Seth Lover and all of the other founding fathers of the Les Paul and the ES335.

They provided us with a reference point upon which we still judge tone today. Without those reference points, the electric guitar might be irrelevant and we could all be playing [shutter] keyboards.

So, show a little appreciation of history, and understand that this thing is a lot bigger than your little world of $89 SX's.

And try reading a fucking book once in awhile. I'd recommend:

Lawrence, The Early Years fo the Les Paul Legacy, 1915-1963

Carter, The Gibson Electric Guitar Book

Hembree, Gibson Guitars, Ted McCarty's Golden Era, 1948-1966

Then come back to HCEG and you folks might be able to speak intelligently about Les Paul guitars--rather than taking a cheap shot at someone who says something to which you disagree like you were in 2nd grade.

[BG76]

We should all send the person who owns this guitar a check for $100.00, as we are all responsible for the care and well being of this guitar.

Maybe President Obama can raise our taxes and start a program to care for the guitars of America.

[meandi]

Originally Posted by BG76

We should all send the person who owns this guitar a check for $100.00, as we are all responsible for the care and well being of this guitar.

Maybe President Obama can raise our taxes and start a program to care for the guitars of America.

Yall can send them there checks to me while it's in my care...

[BG76]

will do. Now, I must go read a book so I can decide if my Les Paul is any good before it bites me in the ass.

[GreatDane]

i'll split the 'care and well-being' proceeds with you, meandi.

[meandi]

Originally Posted by GreatDane

i'll split the 'care and well-being' proceeds with you, meandi.

Sounds like a deal to me, I'm a reasonable man.

[seajay]

Originally Posted by docjeffrey

It takes 5 seconds to look up a Les Paul Deluxe in Wine Red which would make it a '71-'75.

Edit--it could be early 80's (lots of colors offered).

Forget about this guitar for a minute.

When it comes to decent guitars, especially those that are 30+ years old, none of us can claim ownership to them. We are caretakers of them while we are here on earth. All of us will die long before our guitars end up in the dumpster. If we happen to be in possession of an instrument that has some sort of historic value, who are we to fuck it up before we hand it off to the next worthy player? As Neil Young says (referring to a Martin flattop that used to belong to Hank Williams) "This old guitar, ain't mine to keep..."

In this case, the market value, the missing hardware, and the big hole in the top make most of what I said moot. In excellent condition, this guitar is worth $2600 so it is not particularly collectible. I'm very happy that someone is willing to give it a new life and a home.


[--Ratae--I'm not talking about you here.]
Please don't scoff when you see someone trying to preserve a guitar that might have some historical value. We need those reference points, both good and bad, to provide a living record of what the instruments were like 50 or 60 years ago. And maybe you don't think that Honduran Mahogany and Eastern Maple are a big deal when it comes to Les Pauls; but Les Paul, the late Ted McCarty, Slash, Billy Gibbons, Mike Campbell; Tom Petty and scores of guitarists who are a whole lot better than me DO think it's a big deal.

Wow. You are an extremely irritating twat.

Originally Posted by Super Bass

Anything with P90's = better.

That guitar above with P90's = AWESOME!

Black covers would look better than creme though.

No. They won't.

[axegrinder]

Originally Posted by docjeffrey

Some people wouldn't know a good Les Paul if it jumped up and bit them in the ass, but great instruments are few and far between.

Even in the 1950's, Ted McCarty and Les Paul recognized that Honduran Mahagany worked best with the Les Paul guitar. McCarty did tests to figure out which combination of woods gave them the optimal sustain and tonal properties. This stuff is no longer available. And, even 50 years ago, McCarty recognized that African mahogany was "junk" as he put it.

The bottom line is that there are a finite number of guitars that have the magic formula of tonewoods. We need to protect them so that 50 years from now they are still making great music by guitarists that have yet to be born.

If some of you would read something besides HCEG, you'd start to appreciate what the pioneers of the modern electric guitar gave us. Their knowledge goes far beyond what you'll find on the internet. Les Paul understands tone. So did Ted McCarty, Seth Lover and all of the other founding fathers of the Les Paul and the ES335.

They provided us with a reference point upon which we still judge tone today. Without those reference points, the electric guitar might be irrelevant and we could all be playing [shutter] keyboards.

So, show a little appreciation of history, and understand that this thing is a lot bigger than your little world of $89 SX's.

And try reading a fucking book once in awhile. I'd recommend:

Lawrence, The Early Years fo the Les Paul Legacy, 1915-1963

Carter, The Gibson Electric Guitar Book

Hembree, Gibson Guitars, Ted McCarty's Golden Era, 1948-1966

Then come back to HCEG and you folks might be able to speak intelligently about Les Paul guitars--rather than taking a cheap shot at someone who says something to which you disagree like you were in 2nd grade.

Doc,

I understand you're feeling attacked. You could argue that your sanctimonious comments were taken out of context...but really it all started because your sanctimonious comments were GIVEN out of context.

The guitar in question was "compromised" (i.e. jacked up) when it was 'Kahlerized" 80's style. I believe even you have acknowledged that. The fact that you continue to defend your sanctimony in this thread misleads your attackers into believing you are discrediting this project...or at the very least soiling/highjacking the thread. You're okay with this project, right?

Is there really any need to throw a fit and belittle everyone? Based on the beginning, this has the makings of a memorable thread. Do you really want to play antagonist throughout?

[Dmerge]

Originally Posted by docjeffrey

Some people wouldn't know a good Les Paul if it jumped up and bit them in the ass, but great instruments are few and far between.

Even in the 1950's, Ted McCarty and Les Paul recognized that Honduran Mahagany worked best with the Les Paul guitar. McCarty did tests to figure out which combination of woods gave them the optimal sustain and tonal properties. This stuff is no longer available. And, even 50 years ago, McCarty recognized that African mahogany was "junk" as he put it.

The bottom line is that there are a finite number of guitars that have the magic formula of tonewoods. We need to protect them so that 50 years from now they are still making great music by guitarists that have yet to be born.

If some of you would read something besides HCEG, you'd start to appreciate what the pioneers of the modern electric guitar gave us. Their knowledge goes far beyond what you'll find on the internet. Les Paul understands tone. So did Ted McCarty, Seth Lover and all of the other founding fathers of the Les Paul and the ES335.

They provided us with a reference point upon which we still judge tone today. Without those reference points, the electric guitar might be irrelevant and we could all be playing [shutter] keyboards.

So, show a little appreciation of history, and understand that this thing is a lot bigger than your little world of $89 SX's.

And try reading a fucking book once in awhile. I'd recommend:

Lawrence, The Early Years fo the Les Paul Legacy, 1915-1963

Carter, The Gibson Electric Guitar Book

Hembree, Gibson Guitars, Ted McCarty's Golden Era, 1948-1966

Then come back to HCEG and you folks might be able to speak intelligently about Les Paul guitars--rather than taking a cheap shot at someone who says something to which you disagree like you were in 2nd grade.

Whoa, back up, Doc. The point of this thread is to salvage a guitar that has already been butchered. Just because you don't agree with the method chosen doesn't change the ultimate goal - to preserve and use a classic guitar.

[ajcoholic]

Originally Posted by docjeffrey

Some people wouldn't know a good Les Paul if it jumped up and bit them in the ass, but great instruments are few and far between.

Even in the 1950's, Ted McCarty and Les Paul recognized that Honduran Mahagany worked best with the Les Paul guitar. McCarty did tests to figure out which combination of woods gave them the optimal sustain and tonal properties. This stuff is no longer available. And, even 50 years ago, McCarty recognized that African mahogany was "junk" as he put it.

The bottom line is that there are a finite number of guitars that have the magic formula of tonewoods. We need to protect them so that 50 years from now they are still making great music by guitarists that have yet to be born.

If some of you would read something besides HCEG, you'd start to appreciate what the pioneers of the modern electric guitar gave us. Their knowledge goes far beyond what you'll find on the internet. Les Paul understands tone. So did Ted McCarty, Seth Lover and all of the other founding fathers of the Les Paul and the ES335.

They provided us with a reference point upon which we still judge tone today. Without those reference points, the electric guitar might be irrelevant and we could all be playing [shutter] keyboards.

So, show a little appreciation of history, and understand that this thing is a lot bigger than your little world of $89 SX's.

And try reading a fucking book once in awhile. I'd recommend:

Lawrence, The Early Years fo the Les Paul Legacy, 1915-1963

Carter, The Gibson Electric Guitar Book

Hembree, Gibson Guitars, Ted McCarty's Golden Era, 1948-1966

Then come back to HCEG and you folks might be able to speak intelligently about Les Paul guitars--rather than taking a cheap shot at someone who says something to which you disagree like you were in 2nd grade.

Its crap like this that makes me come here maybe once a month at most now.

I am sure Meandi will make this poor, abused LP into a GREAT instrument.

Meandi, the studio I worked on has a mahog neck. From your photo with the scraped finish I can ID that ad definitely, 100% maple. No doubts. Remember I am a pro woodworker and ID woods daily, its my job!

Carry on with the restoration - like I said based on your work it will be great.

AJC

[docjeffrey]

Originally Posted by ajcoholic

Its crap like this that makes me come here maybe once a month at most now.

I am sure Meandi will make this poor, abused LP into a GREAT instrument.

Meandi, the studio I worked on has a mahog neck. From your photo with the scraped finish I can ID that ad definitely, 100% maple. No doubts. Remember I am a pro woodworker and ID woods daily, its my job!

Carry on with the restoration - like I said based on your work it will be great.

AJC

I have already acknowledged all of that. The problem is that some people here would rather engage in name calling than to have an intelligent conversation about guitars. If you're ignorant about a topic, it's easier to just call someone a twat rather than to rebut a point.

This in NOT a restoration project. It's a refinish and repair project. Let's be straight on at least that point.

[axegrinder]

Originally Posted by docjeffrey

This in NOT a restoration project. It's a refinish and repair project. Let's be straight on at least that point.

If we're going to split semantic hairs, I don't believe anything was broken on this guitar. Therefore I'd classify it as restoration and refinish.

And for someone who professes his LOVE for guitars as much as you do, I'd expect a higher level of appreciation for what is happening here.

[newbuilder]

Originally Posted by docjeffrey

Some people wouldn't know a good Les Paul if it jumped up and bit them in the ass, but great instruments are few and far between.

Even in the 1950's, Ted McCarty and Les Paul recognized that Honduran Mahagany worked best with the Les Paul guitar. McCarty did tests to figure out which combination of woods gave them the optimal sustain and tonal properties. This stuff is no longer available. And, even 50 years ago, McCarty recognized that African mahogany was "junk" as he put it.

The bottom line is that there are a finite number of guitars that have the magic formula of tonewoods. We need to protect them so that 50 years from now they are still making great music by guitarists that have yet to be born.

If some of you would read something besides HCEG, you'd start to appreciate what the pioneers of the modern electric guitar gave us. Their knowledge goes far beyond what you'll find on the internet. Les Paul understands tone. So did Ted McCarty, Seth Lover and all of the other founding fathers of the Les Paul and the ES335.

They provided us with a reference point upon which we still judge tone today. Without those reference points, the electric guitar might be irrelevant and we could all be playing [shutter] keyboards.

So, show a little appreciation of history, and understand that this thing is a lot bigger than your little world of $89 SX's.

And try reading a fucking book once in awhile. I'd recommend:

Lawrence, The Early Years fo the Les Paul Legacy, 1915-1963

Carter, The Gibson Electric Guitar Book

Hembree, Gibson Guitars, Ted McCarty's Golden Era, 1948-1966

Then come back to HCEG and you folks might be able to speak intelligently about Les Paul guitars--rather than taking a cheap shot at someone who says something to which you disagree like you were in 2nd grade.

I appreciate the shit out or your love for the instrument in question or any others that might be played out there, but come on. What makes them special is our individual interpretation of them or on them. This is a great project with some really good insite on materials and what could be awsome, you should see how this goes with anticipation and tollerance.

[docjeffrey]

Originally Posted by newbuilder

This is a great project with some really good insite on materials and what could be awsome, you should see how this goes with anticipation and tollerance.

I never said it wasn't. I said I was glad that someone was willing to take a guitar like this and make it playable and give it a good home.

My initial response was--hold on. Before you strip the finish, make sure it's not something worthy of more careful restoration. It wasn't until I sounded the alarm that information about the guitar was disclosed. Once I found out--no problem. Go for it.

I think it's a great project, and the fact that it has a maple neck is extremely intriguing.

[docjeffrey]

^^Also, when I pointed out that it probably had Honduran Mahogany and Michigan Maple I was met with "you're an elitist corksnffing snob..."

If you know anything about the evolution of the Les Paul, you are aware that those kinds of comments are ignorant because the original designers of that guitar were extremely picky about their choices of tonewoods. They did conduct tests on different kinds of woods to see which had the most desirable properties for their new solidbody. So I suppose that Les Paul and Ted McCarty were cork sniffing tone snobs. Thank god they were.

[seajay]

Originally Posted by ajcoholic

That neck is 100% maple. No doubt about it.

I did a job 2 or 3 summers ago (forgot) where I took a guys old white Studio, stripped it and defretted it, bound the body and neck and did a refret, and did the black top/ natural back and sides. Lovely finish... the guy was very happy.

Some of you guys take this guitars thing WAY too seriously. I mean its not an original 59' or something... come on. It;ll be WAY more valuable to the owner as a fixed up, playable guitar than some restored antique.

AJC

See, now this one is a travesty. LP Studios look awesome in white, and it's not a very common color for them.

Now it's gone.

This owner fails as a guitar caretaker.

[GreatDane]

Originally Posted by docjeffrey

I haven't read all of the responses, but that guitar is worthy of a good craftsman like you'd find through Dan Erlewine, George Gruhn, or Elderly. The original finish should be preserved (if that's the original) at all costs. Don't let someone fuck it up with a rattle can or a shitty half assed amateurish job. It may have more holes than it takes to fill the Albert Hall, but it's still an old Les Paul made in Kalamazoo with old wood--probably Honduran Mahogany and Michigan Maple--possibly Brazilian Rosewood.

Try to preserve as much as you can. Just say no to a complete refin.

Sorry to be a dick.

initial response from Doc on or around page 6 (bolding of certain words is his, not mine).

Originally Posted by docjeffrey

I never said it wasn't. I said I was glad that someone was willing to take a guitar like this and make it playable and give it a good home.

My initial response was--hold on. Before you strip the finish, make sure it's not something worthy of more careful restoration. It wasn't until I sounded the alarm that information about the guitar was disclosed. Once I found out--no problem. Go for it.

I think it's a great project, and the fact that it has a maple neck is extremely intriguing.

the year of this LP Deluxe's manufacture was disclosed at post #71 and then again at post #74; both on or around page four. information had been disclosed well before Doc's first post on or around page 6, but (as Doc himself acknowledges originally) Doc didn't read all of the responses. Had Doc actually read those earlier posts, he probably wouldn't have "sounded the alarm".