Backstage With the Band

[Kramerguy]

There's still a few of these in our area.  What is surprising is that a few of them are actually very desirable places to play.  In the past we've never done those, contending that we don't play for free unless it's charity, but now we're considering one of them...This is notably for our coverband, not originals.

Any experiences with this?

As it stands, my only experiences were with my former originals band, and every single one of those experiences was bad- mostly it was a disingenous attempt to get more people to the open mics.  Even in situations where we clearly killed it and slayed whatever crowd was there, we never once got a booking out of doing it.

[jeff42]

IMO it has to be a place we REALLY want to play to have us do that. When we 1st started Ostrich Hat A new bar in the area was demanding we come and play their OPEN MIC night before they would even think of booking us. (they were pretty rude about it)

Their attitude changed when we started booking at every other place around them. 

There & Back Again did something similar to that at the Pig Pen in allentown a few years back which led to.....

NOTHING.

It was one of those sunday night play for an hour gigs to a crowd of 7. I hope you guys have better luck than we did. 

[RoadRanger]

One more step towards "nobody gets paid" hell but that's where the "industry" is going so flip a coin and don your asbestos long johns   .

[texasfenderben…]

Yeah we have those in Dallas to.

You NEVER know what might come of any opportunity.

There are SO AMNY Bands out there that we just aim at getting a toe in the door.

Once we do we just play like there are Thousand people in front of us: if something comes out of it great!

You just have to take whatever opportunity comes your way Brother.

There are a LOT of Flaky bar and Venue owners and if they can get FREE entertainment they will do it all day long.We are a NINE PIECE and just getting everybody together for a "maybe" is a total Bitch: but it comes with the territory.  Worse case scenario "You may burn us ONCE ..But not a second time"

J.B

www.jonnyfortunato.com

[RupertB]

Sometimes worth it, particularly for duo/trio acts, or bands just getting started; especially if it is a desirable place to play, or if you band's style or the size of your market mean that there are few ideal venues for you.

For established acts, especially in larger markets, it doesn't make much sense.  This is one reason why "play our open mic" places are often seen as for marginal acts (or they're simply pikers).

I can imagine the GFY look I'd get from our drummer if I suggested he haul his kit out to play for nothing.  Even if there were already a kit & backline and we were desperate for the gig, they'd get 3-4 songs tops.  If they can't figure out we're good in 15 minutes, another 15 minutes isn't going to change their minds.

If you think the venue is just jerking people around to get attendance at their open mic, just talk to some of the existing talent.  "Did you guys play the open mic there?" is a perfectly reasonable question.

[Kramerguy]

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jeff42 wrote:

IMO it has to be a place we REALLY want to play to have us do that. When we 1st started Ostrich Hat A new bar in the area was demanding we come and play their OPEN MIC night before they would even think of booking us. (they were pretty rude about it)

Their attitude changed when we started booking at every other place around them. 

There & Back Again did something similar to that at the Pig Pen in allentown a few years back which led to.....

NOTHING.

It was one of those sunday night play for an hour gigs to a crowd of 7. I hope you guys have better luck than we did. 

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Well I guess around here, the clubs that do it have always done it that way, and the ones I mention specific to the cover band ARE places that are considered desirable to play, or a step-up from the local bars.  We might do this one as a test run and see what happens, like I said- I never did it for a cover-gig before, so I was wondering if there was at least a higher ROI than with the related originals side of it.

My originals band fell for that "pig pen" model at the croc rock up there in allentown.. we were told there'd be HUNDREDS if not 1000+ of people there, including industry reps and agents, etc...  and OH the opportunities it would lead to...so we played for free to the bartenders for about an hour.. was probably the worst gig I can recall.  Sadly we shared that tragedy with no less than 15 other bands between 2 different stages that day.  Never again.

[WynnD]

The Little Bear in Evergreen is like that for local bands. (Yes, it's that "Little Bear". National acts are common there or at least have been in the past.) Personally, unless you have an exceptional low volume band, a rarity anywhere, it's not worth the effort. We did that at a Thursday night at the Cool River Cafe and the manager's only comment was the band was loud. (Nice thing to tell us after the gig. Not my current band, but a previous louder one.) I talked with a few other bands that had done the same thing and pretty much none of them ended up in the weekend rotation. Think the club was only interested in funk bands. (And ours wasn't one.)

[Potts]

I don't think I'd do it with a full band with the experience you have. But of course I don't know what your gig situation is either. I won't do them for acoustic gigs either though. HOWEVER- I do frequent open mics occasionally to support some friends that are running them and have gotten gigs from both of the venues...go figure

[3shiftgtr]

I've been asked to audition...play a set....but not too audition at an open mic.

The only way I'd do it is to get a verbal that if the buyer likes you, then he has to be able to book you (or say no) that night. No put offs or call backs. Do a couple tunes and ask for a gig.

I have gotten gigs from auditions. Now that I think about it, although I haven't done many, I've never NOT gotten a gig from a band audition. Probabbly cuz they were real auditions, not a nut massage for a free gig.

[New Trail]

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Kramerguy wrote:

There's still a few of these in our area.  What is surprising is that a few of them are actually very desirable places to play.  In the past we've never done those, contending that we don't play for free unless it's charity, but now we're considering one of them...This is notably for our coverband, not originals.

Any experiences with this?

As it stands, my only experiences were with my former originals band, and every single one of those experiences was bad- mostly it was a disingenous attempt to get more people to the open mics.  Even in situations where we clearly killed it and slayed whatever crowd was there, we never once got a booking out of doing it.

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Do you think there is a correlation between playing originals, rather than playing covers, at an open mic and not being booked back?

[Crownman]

Years ago I had a bar approach me with the open night psuedo audition for gigs type of thing.

I countered this: if we did the open mid thing and he booked us for a future gig that night, we were cool with it. But if he decided that he didn't want to book us then he was to pay us $100 for the open mic show.

He declined of course. But after that most of the bands did exactly what I did. This guy just wanted free entertainment but after all the other bands started proposing what I did the guy just shut the place down claiming that everyone was against him, lol. I claim that as a victory.

[Blackbird 13]

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Crownman wrote:
Years ago I had a bar approach me with the open night psuedo audition for gigs type of thing.

I countered this: if we did the open mid thing and he booked us for a future gig that night, we were cool with it. But if he decided that he didn't want to book us then he was to pay us $100 for the open mic show.

He declined of course. But after that most of the bands did exactly what I did. This guy just wanted free entertainment but after all the other bands started proposing what I did the guy just shut the place down claiming that everyone was against him, lol. I claim that as a victory.

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Nice way to handle it.

I play for free for charity... otherwise, I don't get the idea of working for nothing. It's like telling the club owner/booker that you want to come in and sample the food and beverages, and if you like it, you'll come back.

[GtrGeorge!]

Any experiences with this? yeah and No is the answer. ..any questions???? This is why we have a free DVD. You can see and hear the band free. You can go online 24/7 and see the same content at any of our 3 websites, 365 days a year. The only reason a venue offers you that deal is if they think your naive and want to have you work for free.

[Blackbird 13]

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GtrGeorge! wrote:
Any experiences with this? yeah and No is the answer. ..any questions???? This is why we have a free DVD. You can see and hear the band free. You can go online 24/7 and see the same content at any of our 3 websites, 365 days a year. The only reason a venue offers you that deal is if they think your naive and want to have you work for free.

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This.

The other big thing is that a venue "offering a deal" like this has already established that they have NO respect for you or what you do, in the sense of it having any value. What's the point in even trying to establish any kind of business relationship with someone who already thinks that what you bring to the table is worthless?

[Howie22]

Kind of a different side of the same coin.

I once went to an open mic where they advertised on Craigslist to "Come play our Monday open mic and get a gig on Friday" sort of thing. I went, I played. I asked about talking to the person that handles booking. . .

"Oh, she doesn't work on Mondays."  

[Kramerguy]

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New Trail wrote:

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Do you think there is a correlation between playing originals, rather than playing covers, at an open mic and not being booked back?

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Absolutely yes.  With playing covers, it's all about song selection, crowd interaction, and stage show.  All true with originals also, but more focus is established on the originality of the band, songwriting, and even the wardrobe- depending on what kind of music is played.  Original bands are far more preyed upon for "free" work than cover bands, and considering that an originals project is looking for places to play- it unspokenly dictates to those who would profit off them that the band cannot produce it's own following (else they would rent a music hall and sell tickets).

The cover band is (or at least should be) more about entertaining people and selling booze.  Original acts play far more places than bars.  I'm using the cover-band analogy in aspect to bar bands.. corporate and wedding bands are a different animal.

Which brings up showcasing.. even cover bands have to showcase for corporate and wedding gigs.. so whats the difference?  A bar band can be likened to that by showcasing at the open mic, right?

(disclaimer) At this point, I'm just playing devils advocate to see all sides and everyones personal beliefs on this-

[GuitarPlayerFL]

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GtrGeorge! wrote:
Any experiences with this? yeah and No is the answer. ..any questions???? This is why we have a free DVD. You can see and hear the band free. You can go online 24/7 and see the same content at any of our 3 websites, 365 days a year. The only reason a venue offers you that deal is if they think your naive and want to have you work for free.

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There is one bee-yotch here who, when given the chance to watch a band demo DVD or online, says something like, "I need to see how the band interacts with the crowd and if the crowd likes the band."

[mstreck]

[SeniorBlues]

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GuitarPlayerFL wrote:

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GtrGeorge! wrote:
Any experiences with this? yeah and No is the answer. ..any questions???? This is why we have a free DVD. You can see and hear the band free. You can go online 24/7 and see the same content at any of our 3 websites, 365 days a year. The only reason a venue offers you that deal is if they think your naive and want to have you work for free.

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There is one bee-yotch here who, when given the chance to watch a band demo DVD or online, says something like, "I need to see how the band interacts with the crowd and if the crowd likes the band."

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So when you do videos of the band performing, be sure to include time between songs that includes  interaction.  Even better if it's during the song.  I've got some footage that I never thought was worth keeping, so I'm glad you brought it up.

[guido61]

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Kramerguy wrote:

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Which brings up showcasing.. even cover bands have to showcase for corporate and wedding gigs.. so whats the difference?  

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I've never played any sort of showcase with any cover band I've ever been in.