Acoustic Guitars

[kwakatak]

Exactly, knock. There are TWO adjusting wheels. and threaded posts, but one side has a spring. How the heck is the thing supposed to stay level? Ya got me. Stewmac's instructions are ambiguous and I had to pore through their website to find a tutorial that was on-topic but still left room for interpretation. One thing that make me confused was that they suggest you drill several pilot holes along the length of the saddle slot to save the bit but they never discussed a way to keep the bit correctly aligned or how to come to the final level. In the end I came away with the feeling that even they feel that a router is a better tool for the job. *shrugs*

Anyhoo, I'll give it one more shot then probably just give it a whirl on my last remaining rosewood blank. If I get a 1/8" slot that's clean then I'd be okay with it and try to get an oversized saddle blank somewhere but if not I'll just send the whole thing back to Freeman and look for a serviced bridge. The problem is that all I can find are Martin or Gisbon style belly bridges or pyramid bridges. I'd really like a Taylor bridge but as far as I know nobody sells them.

[knockwood]

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kwakatak wrote:

Exactly, knock. There are TWO adjusting wheels. and threaded posts, but one side has a spring. How the heck is the thing supposed to stay level? Ya got me. Stewmac's instructions are ambiguous and I had to pore through their website to find a tutorial that was on-topic but still left room for interpretation. One thing that make me confused was that they suggest you drill several pilot holes along the length of the saddle slot to save the bit but they never discussed a way to keep the bit correctly aligned or how to come to the final level. In the end I came away with the feeling that even they feel that a router is a better tool for the job. *shrugs*

Anyhoo, I'll give it one more shot then probably just give it a whirl on my last remaining rosewood blank. If I get a 1/8" slot that's clean then I'd be okay with it and try to get an oversized saddle blank somewhere but if not I'll just send the whole thing back to Freeman and look for a serviced bridge. The problem is that all I can find are Martin or Gisbon style belly bridges or pyramid bridges. I'd really like a Taylor bridge but as far as I know nobody sells them.

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Sorry to hear you're having trouble with the PRB too, but I have to admit I'm glad it's not just me. I've really never gotten the hang of that thing when it comes to adjusting it. To save myself from disaster, I just make sure to practice everything on scrap until it comes out how I want it before I try it on the real thing. But I often spend some very frustrating time spinning one way and then the other, ending up with a lopsided base, spinning some more, accidentally popping out the spring, swearing, etc.

Is it possible to buy a Taylor bridge from Taylor? If not, there is this guy - Kevin Waldron - who makes outstanding luthier supply stuff. I've bought a couple of templates from him and they are spectacular. He also makes some unusual - meaning not Gibson or Martin - bridges that are drilled and slotted. Can't remember whether or not I've seen Taylor bridges on his site (link below), but he will make some stuff to order if asked (though that can be expensive). He's a super nice, helpful guy & runs a family business.

http://waldronmusic.com/

Taylor bridge template:

http://www.waldronmusic.com/product_info.php?products_id=1176&osCsid=ro6c9qpstunt2794q77bfhd2k3

[kwakatak]

I posted this same question over at AGF because they're llike the a cult for Taylor guitars over there. I got a response that was very similar and here was my reply:

"Thanks, but I actually would prefer the finished product. I actually made a plexiglass template based on the Official Luthier's Forum (medium jumbo) plans that I purchased from Stewmac. My issue is that I don't particularly find Stewmac's Precision Router Base couple with the Saddle Slotting jig all that precise because there's no plumb function and leveling the tool is a bit ambiguous as well. I ordered a 3/32" carbide bit for my Dremel and despite my best efforts I end up with a slot that's 1/8" wide.

Otherwise I think I'm okay with using a drill instead of a drill press to drill out the pin holes. I can get pretty accurte measurements thanks to a 6" digital caliper from Harbor Freight. The rest of it I can do with my little 9" band saw and the grinding wheel on my little Dremel 300.

Here's how the latter steps came out on my first attempt. Note the slop on the saddle slot:

"

[Freeman_Keller]

Neil, once again, I am sorry this isn't working for you - with all the trouble you were having before I was hopeful that this would make it easier.   I agree that the StewMac jig is a bit figity to use, but the only other three methods that I know of are (1) make a template for your standard router.   Kinkead shows this, he has a camming clamp arrangement to hold the bridge in place and some sort of guide thing for the router.   Frankly I can't figure it out and it looks like a lot of work for one or two bridges.   (2)  Cumpiano shows two methods - the first entirely by hand with chisels and such - looks easier for a classical bridge but still a PITA.   (3)   Cumpiano also shows using a drill press as a router - make an angled sliding jig to affix to the table and either drill a series of holes with a brad point bit or chuck your down cut bit in the drill press.    I was actually going to use that method, however my drill press is not at my shop and since I had the PRB I bought the rest of the StewMac pieces and used it.

I drilled two holes at each end on a drill press.   I would not try to do that with a hand drill motor.   As I said before, I jury rigged a method of holding the bridge blank and very carefully lined up the guide pieces so the bit was right above my line (and from one hole to the next).    I lowered the bit so it was just a hair into the hole (I'll describe in a minute), then lifted up the dremel and that base thingie a hair, turned it on and lowered it into the hole.   Made a very shallow cut - probably ten thou or so stopping at the other hole.  Lowered it another turn or two of the big knobs (motor off) and made another shallow cut.    Repeated three or four times....

I don't have the PRB right in front of me but this is how I remember setting the wheels.  Loosen the little knobs on top and the one with no springs.    Use the knob with the springs to bring the bit down flat on something - just touching.    Snug the other knob up to touch the bar that holds the dremel.    Measure with your machinist rule that both sides are the same height above whatever its sitting on.   If they are not the same adjust until they are.  Now turn each big wheel the same number of turns until the bit is sticking down as much as you want it - lay a straight edge across and measure.   Now snug the two little knobs on top - their function is to clamp the height.   I have used this base a lot for inlay - I'll promise that it is much better than the cheap little plastic cone things that you can buy from Dremel.

Last couple of comments - I also own a plunge Dremel base that I use for cutting circles (rosettes and sound holes).    It is very wobbly compared to the PRB.   Also, I have no shame in buying pre-made bridges (or fretboards for that matter) - just make sure the pin holes are the width you want.   I've only used this setup twice - that was because I wanted bridges with no compensation for the Weissies.

I'll also say that if this is not working for you, Neil, then just box it up and send it back.   I guess what I would suggest then is the drill press trick unless Tim or your friends at AGF have a better idea.

[kwakatak]

No worries, Freeman. It's probably just me being anal retentive. If you wouldn't mind, I'd like to work with it another day or two, cut the slot in my blank then I'll send it back. FWIW the plans call for a 1/8" bridge anyway and since I'll be making the saddle from scratch as well I can compensate for any variance in thickness. The plans also call for 2-1/8" string spacing and I want to do 2-1/4" so I'm playing an audible there as well.

[Freeman_Keller]

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kwakatak wrote:
No worries, Freeman. It's probably just me being anal retentive. If you wouldn't mind, I'd like to work with it another day or two, cut the slot in my blank then I'll send it back. FWIW the plans call for a 1/8" bridge anyway and since I'll be making the saddle from scratch as well I can compensate for any variance in thickness. The plans also call for 2-1/8" string spacing and I want to do 2-1/4" so I'm playing an audible there as well.

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Take all the time you need - I am a long way from starting my next one, maybe not until later this spring.   Decided to finally do the sawn off neck reset on my FG-150 since I'm taking a road trip and need a guitar to take with me.   I just didn't want you to be burning up a lot of nice rosewood or ebony if it wasn't working out.

[kwakatak]

Funny you should mention that. I've been looking at my Tak with the pulverized heel and the epoxied slip block faux reset and have been thinking of further hacking it. Right after I kick off build #2 for that OLF newbie challenge.

Anyway, tonight I tapered the fretboard so I've got that hurdle to jump at the same time. I like burning both ends of the candle. ;o)

Don't worry about me burning through a lot of rosewood. I'm actually practicing on the face plate of an old pine drawer. It's the same thickness as the only rosewood blank I have.

[kwakatak]

Crap. I tried routing the saddle slot today but didn't have everything as tight as it could've been so the Dremel's vibration loosened some fittings and the bit wandered. Again, I blame user error. I've been anguished about it but then I realized that I can still use the blank if I turn it around; the design of back end of the bridge is ramped so my errant first attempt will be sanded out.

That being said, I'm going to try a differnt approach by doing the following:

1: mark the centerline again

2: draw the centerline for the saddle slot

3: gauge a pilot trench with something sharp like the tip of a nail using a metal straightedge as a guide.

4: using a nail I'm going to punch in a series of pilot holes along that line

5: Again, I don't have a drill press but I do have an angled drill guide that I can fit a hand drill to. I'm going to put in a 1/16" drill bit and measuring up just shy of 1/4" I'm going to wrap a piece of tape as a visual depth guide.

6: using the pilot holes I'm going to drill a series of holes along the length of the saddle slot

7: Then I'll replace the 1/16" bit with a 3/32" bit, again measure and mark with a piece of tape for a little less than 1/4" depth and enlarge each hole.

8: the result should be a straight trench that just needs cleanup along the sides and leveling along the base. That's what the Dremel is best-suited for and using Freeman's jigs that's what I'll do - fingers crossed of course!

Things would have been much easier had I had a router with a base that allowed me to lower the bit to a desired depth. The precision router base with the underpowered Dremel is not suited for this sort of work. Even Stewart McDonald suggests a similar procedure to the one that I outlined above.

[kwakatak]

Well, it looks like I need to buy a couple more blanks because this one is well and truly fudged. I planed it too thin and drilled right through it in three places - and no I'm not installing a piezo in this guitar! I HATE piezos!

[kwakatak]

The epoxy for the fretboard just cured and I trimmed off the excess. Here are some teaser shots before I refine the neck profile and inlay the dot markers:

It's now living in the Tak's old dread-sized case which is actually a snug fit.

[kwakatak]

I took a little time last night to mark where to put the fingerboard markers and after I put Joey on the bus I went and drilled the holes and stuck in the 2.3mm (3/32") dots in with some super glue. I used tweezers so luckily I was able to prevent gluing any parts of my body to the guitar. Afterward I went at the neck with a rasp and a sandpaper belt to refine the neck profile. It felt like I was gripping a baseball bat before and though I'm still not done (I need to removed about 1/16" from either side of the fretboard to get it down to 1-3/4" wide at the headstock end) I'm much closer to where I need to be. I also broke out the sanding wheel on my Dremel and cleaned up the edge of the fingerboard at the soundhole.

[kwakatak]

The tuning machines (replacement Shaller style Gotoh tuners recycled from my defunct Takamine) went on tonight after a few days of marking where I wanted to drill the holes in the headstock. I measured 3 times and even made a template/caul out of scrap maple but I still screwed it up so that I had to mount the tuning machines upside down. I kind of like the look though.

[poppytater]

Lookin" good

[kwakatak]

Thanks, poppy. It's getting so close that I'm wondering what song I'll play on it to get it started. I just heard a nice version of James Taylor's "Carolina on my Mind" that I'd like to learn for the occassion.

[kwakatak]

My friend the photographer and guitar builder chided me for jumping into a second build so quickly, so I decided to pay some attention to old #1 here. Last night I ventured forth and installed the frets.

I also checked with a 3' steel rule and everything seems to be seated level and the fretboard extension now lays flat on the top. Then I took off the neck, trimmed off all the rough ends and then filed them all flush. I bought a $10 set of jeweler's files to dress the frets.

I also have a a quart of 2 pound cut shellac dissolving right now so that I can go ahead with final sanding and then pore filling. The fretboard is 1.75" at the nut but I have to clean up the area so that everything's square. I also went back to clean up the best of my failed attempts at making a bridge.

[kwakatak]

I just thread through most of this thread last night to reminesce and am amazed at how long a trip this has been. I've been truly anal about this and probably should have just ventured forth more than a few times. I've also taken note of all those who've chimed in and really appreciate all the helpful pointers, kind gestures and all the supportive comments these past (Gawd!) 32 months! I'm amazed that some of you took inspiration and went on to build your own guitars - sometimes more than one - in the whole time I fumbled through this one. I'm still not quite done but I see the light at the end of the tunnel and I'm proud of what I've done so far.

I've given myself the deadline of June 14th so that it will be done in time for the annual McKnight jam. Sure I have final sanding, pore filling and French polishing ahead of me but the only real roadblock regarding actual contruction that remains in my way is that darned bridge! Knock, if you're out there I think I'm gonna give that Waldron guy a call.

[kwakatak]

I still have some slight imperfections that I need to fill with CA glue so I
sealed the body with 1 pound cut of ultra blonde shellac. This shows what the
final tint of the woods will be:

[Freeman Keller]

I can feel your excitement.   Finishing will be both fun and frustrating, don't rush, savor each coat.    You've got a really beautiful guitar there, the final touches just makes it more so.

[kwakatak]

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Freeman Keller wrote:

I can feel your excitement.   Finishing will be both fun and frustrating, don't rush, savor each coat.    You've got a really beautiful guitar there, the final touches just makes it more so.

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Thanks, Freeman,

Even in these "honey shot" photos I can see every blemish though. I want to finish up the little rough spots this week then move on to pore filling with pumice. Do you think 5 weeks for French polish too aggressive for a newbie like me? I want to get it done by June 14th.

[Freeman Keller]

Never done a French polish so I can't say.    With lacquer I figure a week of prep, a week to 10 days of laying on the coats, two or three weeks to cure (those are the hardest) and a couple of days to color sand and buff.   That usually ends up being about six weeks total.  Then honestly, there is another couple of weeks of futzing around with bridge, hardware, frets, setup before it is "finished".    I would say you will have it presentable, but don't rush this part of the build.