Members TheForkWigger Posted April 4, 2017 Members Share Posted April 4, 2017 What they like? Anything can be done eg shaving braces to improve them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kwakatak Posted April 4, 2017 Members Share Posted April 4, 2017 A friend had one with a black finish but had a lifting bridge. She asked if I could fix it so I looked inside and saw that there was lot of glue slop and whoever had installed the piezo had drilled right through one of the X braces. There was no shining that turd. Normally I'd say you get what you pay for but she got even less. Look elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted April 4, 2017 Members Share Posted April 4, 2017 No experience with that particular guitar but I do get to work on a few Rogues. Kind of seems a shame to charge someone a hundred or two dollars to fix a fifty dollar guitar. However if you are looking for something to practice shaving brace on I can't think of a better choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TheForkWigger Posted April 4, 2017 Author Members Share Posted April 4, 2017 meh i guess i'll pass on wasting my money in this particular way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Grant Harding Posted April 5, 2017 Members Share Posted April 5, 2017 Yeah - shaving the bracing on one of those is definitely a waste of time. Like stripping the finish off a dead sounding guitar in the hopes that it'll come to life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted April 6, 2017 Members Share Posted April 6, 2017 FWIW, I have one of the old 70's Martins that has had its braces shaved and it made a heck of a difference. Not saying that aftermarket scalloping isn't worthwhile, just choose the guitar wisely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil O'Keefe Posted April 6, 2017 Share Posted April 6, 2017 FWIW' date=' I have one of the old 70's Martins that has had its braces shaved and it made a heck of a difference. Not saying that aftermarket scalloping isn't worthwhile, just choose the guitar wisely.[/quote'] If you don't mind me asking, in what way? What improvements did you notice with the shaving? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted April 6, 2017 Members Share Posted April 6, 2017 If you don't mind me asking, in what way? What improvements did you notice with the shaving? My D18 is a 1974 model - that period where Martins are thought to be overbraced. It had the large rosewood bridgeplate and 5/16 unscalloped braces. It was due for a neck reset and I had the work done by Brian Kimsey who is noted for modifying modern Martins (particularly '70's and '80's to more pre war specs. I asked him to reset the neck, replace the bridge plate with small maple one, do some medium scalloping, replace some frets and a few minor and cosmetic repairs. Total cost was about 700 bucks. When the guitar was returned there as a baggie of wood chips in the case - what was left of the bridgeplate and braces. Took it out, tuned up and my wife's first comment was "you are playing louder" (I didn't think I was doing anything different. Took it to a local bluegrass jam (I'm not a bluegrasser but I can play the basic three chords LOL). There were a bunch of Martins there including a D18GE (don't know the year) and a 1937 D18 (yes, the Grail). We passed guitars around and everyone felt that my little '74 held its own very well. Not a very scientific study but it did inspire me in my building to scallop the hell out of everything I build. Here is a link to some of Kimsey's thoughts - his page should be required reading for any old Martin owner http://www.bryankimsey.com/music/lutherie.htm http://www.bryankimsey.com/GE_tuneup/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil O'Keefe Posted April 6, 2017 Share Posted April 6, 2017 Great info - thanks Freeman! Do you know when Martin stopped scalloping their braces? The reason I ask is because my father in law has a '55 D-18 that he purchased new. It's a really nice sounding guitar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted April 7, 2017 Members Share Posted April 7, 2017 I honestly don't know - the '70's were regarded as the "over built" era - people claim it was because there were too many warranty claims. Also different guitars got different braces at different times - forward and back shifted, both 1/4 and 5/16 wide, scalloped or tapered, different sized bride plates (and bridges) made out of different woods. There are some very knowledgeable folks at UMGF who know all these details - I don't. Kimsey has a pretty good section on his site on what to look for with post war Martins - neck angle, where they typically crack, even the ones with the saddle slots in t he wrong place. My '74 (and my '80 D12-28 which has also been Kimsefied) are good examples of how you can take a less desirable guitar and make it pretty darn good. Guitars from that era will never be collectible and can be picked up fairly inexpensively. With a bit of Brian's magic they can be great players. ps - remind your FIL that as the original owner any warranty work is covered, including the inevitable neck reset Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted April 7, 2017 Members Share Posted April 7, 2017 Great info - thanks Freeman! Do you know when Martin stopped scalloping their braces? The reason I ask is because my father in law has a '55 D-18 that he purchased new. It's a really nice sounding guitar. I know this is off the original topic but a partial answer to Phil's question. I have a 1951 000-21 on my bench right now and it has non-scalloped 1/4 inch tapered braces and the small maple bridge plate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil O'Keefe Posted April 8, 2017 Share Posted April 8, 2017 Maybe it was done on the pre-war guitars, but they stopped doing it after WWII? I'm just taking a guess here. I have a copy of a great book here called The Martin Archives - I just got back from a gig and I'm pretty beat or I'd check now, but I will try to remember to see if there's anything about that in there sometime tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DeepEnd Posted April 8, 2017 Members Share Posted April 8, 2017 To the OP: Why not find a halfway decent used guitar, something that started out a notch above firewood, and experiment on it? I was in a local pawn shop earlier this week and saw a "Laurel Canyon" IIRC on sale for around the $50 mark. I didn't look it over very carefully but it didn't seem half bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members FretFiend. Posted April 8, 2017 Members Share Posted April 8, 2017 According to the Johnston/Boak Martin history books and based on notes from the factory foreman of that era, the last D series guitar with scalloped bracing was serial number 89926 in 1944. As to the OP, accept the Rogue for what it is... a very inexpensive all laminate guitar. You can't soup up a Kia and expect it to run like a Ferrari. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Idunno Posted April 8, 2017 Members Share Posted April 8, 2017 My D18 is a 1974 model - that period where Martins are thought to be overbraced. It had the large rosewood bridgeplate and 5/16 unscalloped braces. It was due for a neck reset and I had the work done by Brian Kimsey who is noted for modifying modern Martins (particularly '70's and '80's to more pre war specs. I asked him to reset the neck, replace the bridge plate with small maple one, do some medium scalloping, replace some frets and a few minor and cosmetic repairs. Total cost was about 700 bucks. When the guitar was returned there as a baggie of wood chips in the case - what was left of the bridgeplate and braces. Took it out, tuned up and my wife's first comment was "you are playing louder" (I didn't think I was doing anything different. Took it to a local bluegrass jam (I'm not a bluegrasser but I can play the basic three chords LOL). There were a bunch of Martins there including a D18GE (don't know the year) and a 1937 D18 (yes, the Grail). We passed guitars around and everyone felt that my little '74 held its own very well. Not a very scientific study but it did inspire me in my building to scallop the hell out of everything I build. Here is a link to some of Kimsey's thoughts - his page should be required reading for any old Martin owner http://www.bryankimsey.com/music/lutherie.htm http://www.bryankimsey.com/GE_tuneup/ So, what did the guitar sound like? Humor. Ar...ar... BTW, whilst visiting th AGF today I read a thread stating Martin no longer performs neck resets gratis for original owners. They never really did as a matter of policy. They just accommodated original owners as a gesture of appreciation and made the repairs at no charge to them. But, now they're not taking in any resets gratis unless the joint is actually loose, per the original warranty terms of agreement. So, be careful about spreading the word around anymore about Martin's free neck resets to original owners. I mean, at a couple decades on, who in their right mind would assume the cost of repairing someone's troubles? Martin is finally making some sense about resets. Edit - @ forkwigger - Buy the thing and tear it up. It might implode and make Donald fire missiles at its maker but @ $50.00/pop you can go through 10 of those babies and probably get a good one worth a lot more. Go for it but on your way to the store stop by your neighborhood Army/Navy surplus store and buy some frontal body armor first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted April 8, 2017 Members Share Posted April 8, 2017 That is timely. I have a 1952 000-21 that needs a reset. The original owner is the father of the present owner, unfortunately he has passed away. I was going to ask my Martin shop to call and see what the coverage would be. Sounds like I'll get to do the reset and be paid for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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