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Eletro-Acoustic with no battery?


BouncingCzech

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Hi folks,

 

I'm at my wits end with this, I agreed to play backing for my wife as she's singing at a friend's wedding and couldn't find a decent backing track.

 

It's a big venue so probably have to plug my acoustic in to the PA (something I've never done).

 

Thought I best give it a try at home plugged in to my amp to see how it sounds and it was pretty poor (lovely acoustic sound without but terrible through the amp clean) and after doing some Googling it seemed like a good idea to change the battery inside it and try again.

 

I've taken the strings off and for the life of me I can't find any battery, all of the videos and guides I've found have the battery mounted somewhere inside but I've covered every inch of the inside and there just isn't one...

 

Is this even possible? It was my understanding that EVERY acoustic with a cable jack would have to have a 9v battery inside to power it?

 

There is one bit of plastic housing where the Tone/Volume sliders are but I took that apart and all that was inside it was a bit of circuit board... there was some space behind it but was bolted on and it certainly wasn't enough for a big square battery.

 

Could the pickups on my guitar be passive? Or could there possibly be some kind of custom battery behing that circuit board I can't get to? This seems unlikely given that I've had the guitar more than a decade and sound still comes out of it!

 

The guitar itself is an "Encore" but I doubt that means anything to anyone.

 

Any advice would be appreciated!

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When there is a battery on the guitar it is there for a preamp and signal conditioner (usually in a barn door on the side or sometimes in the soundhole). There are a lot of pickups that don't have a preamp in the guitar - they will have a undersaddle transducer or a little stick on piezo unit under the bridge that goes directly to the jack. Most of these work best with an external preamp or DI box going into your amp or PA.

 

If your guitar does have a battery it is almost always either in a little compartment that is accessible from the outside or in a little cloth bag that is stuck to some Velcro up inside the guitar - usually by the neck heel.

 

It sounds like yours has a tone and volume control like an electric guitar but no pre amplification. Consider an external unit.

 

 

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As you've guessed, the pickup is probably passive. The earliest acoustic/electric guitars simply had a transducer and a volume control if that. As you've noted, they don't necessarily sound good. Also, what kind of amp did you use? Acoustic guitars sound pretty bad through an electric guitar amp. A bass or keyboard amp will work though if you have access to one and give you a better idea how the guitar will sound. A good DI box will help but your guitar still still be putting out a fairly weak signal. Find out if you can mike your guitar. You won't be able to move--maybe sit on a stool--but it might be your best bet. Or you could talk your wife into letting you buy a new, better guitar. Tell her you're doing it for her because you want her to shine. ;)

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Thank you for the replies guys, was kind of expecting to get flamed for such a newbie question so thank you for your understanding.

 

Yes I was trying it through an electric guitar amp, so I will give it a go through my bass amp and see how that sounds!

 

I have a Focusrite Scarlett Solo pre-amp, so I guess I could plug it in to that and maybe the DJ can take the output from that? It sounds as though just putting a mike on the guitar would be the most straightforward solution though (with a new set of strings ;) )

 

...although the suggestion of a new guitar is also a good shout! very-happy.png.197c47f720636f02390cc2b0a33804da.png' alt='smiley-veryhappy'>

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Hello & Welcome

 

 

. . . . Could the pickups on my guitar be passive?. . . .

 

Yes, that's presicely what it is - so the signal coming from the guitar will be weaker than from an onboard amplified EQ system. You could either feed it through an exterior EQ preamp or boost the gain and volume on the amplifier.

 

I have a couple of guitars with similar passive pick-ups and with a bit of tweaking they sound OK

 

. . . . The guitar itself is an "Encore" but I doubt that means anything to anyone.

 

Any advice would be appreciated! . . . . .

 

I know exactly what it means - a budget guitar produced by John Hornby Skewes, a UK musical instrument and audio equipment wholesaler. Their "Vintage" series of acoustic guitars are very good. The "Encore" series was a small range of budget instruments, all-laminate but of quite good quality that generally sound and play OK. There are many worse guitars out there.

 

http://www.jhs.co.uk/intro.htm

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Thank you for the replies guys, was kind of expecting to get flamed for such a newbie question so thank you for your understanding.

 

Yes I was trying it through an electric guitar amp, so I will give it a go through my bass amp and see how that sounds!

 

 

Generally a bass or keyboard amp is a better partner for an acoustic-electric guitar since they tend to have a wider frequency response than a regular electric guitar amp.

 

I have a Focusrite Scarlett Solo pre-amp, so I guess I could plug it in to that and maybe the DJ can take the output from that?

 

If you want to record you can go straight from the guitar's output to the 1/4" input on the Focusrite, but using it as a preamp for your acoustic guitar in a live situation isn't really ideal. For that you want something like a acoustic guitar preamplifier, which come in a couple of different forms - as a onboard preamp that can be added to the guitar, or as a external box. Fishman, LR Baggs and several other companies make them.

 

 

It sounds as though just putting a mike on the guitar would be the most straightforward solution though (with a new set of strings ;) )

 

...although the suggestion of a new guitar is also a good shout! very-happy.png.197c47f720636f02390cc2b0a33804da.png' alt='smiley-veryhappy'>

 

For recording, nothing beats the realism and sound quality of good microphones. They almost always sound better than pickups. For live use, the convenience, freedom of movement and relative feedback resistance make onboard pickup systems the better choice, although again, the sound quality is somewhat worse than using microphones.

 

 

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Always glad to help. If you're in the UK, as suggested by your Encore guitar, you should have Tanglewood available, along with Crafter and some others. Tell your wife you don't want your poor sounding guitar to detract from her lovely voice and see what happens. ;)

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. . . The guitar itself is an "Encore" but I doubt that means anything to anyone. . . .

Unlike garthman, I'm not from the UK but a bit of web searching turned up the brand. Nothing wrong with it. I used to own an Ensenada and I still have a Sakura, neither of which means much to most folks. The proof is in the sound, not the name on the headstock.

 

. . . For recording' date=' nothing beats the realism and sound quality of good microphones. They almost always sound better than pickups. For live use, the convenience, freedom of movement and relative feedback resistance make onboard pickup systems the better choice, although again, the sound quality is somewhat worse than using microphones.[/quote']

Great advice as usual. The OP will be playing live and accompanying a solo vocalist through a PA. Given the guitar's budget electronics, a stationary mike should work all right.

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I agree with Phil on recording and excellent mics being better than plugged-in sound and relying on the pickups. Even a CAD M-177 or similar inexpensive condenser mic can make a big difference in terms of natural tone. If you want to record using the pickup in the guitar, a Roland Loud Mini is a sweet, clean sounding choice for an amp. Play it at low volume and mic it with two microphones. One pointed straight at the amp below center and one higher up, off axis. That combination gives you a natural, fat sound and is often better than the pre-amp tweaking that people tend to do. Then, use the EQ in the mix to modify tone if you are not satisfied with the track as recorded. I know lots of recording engineers who prefer recording flat sound, as is, and EQ or color things in the mix to avoid a colored track that cannot be easily tweaked.

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. . . Even a CAD M-177 or similar inexpensive condenser mic can make a big difference in terms of natural tone. . . .

Yeah, I'm always a bit amazed at how good my Samson C01U condenser is. But the OP is talking about live performance, not recording. A fair mike is better than cheap onboard electronics in that situation. Of course, the option of a new guitar is always worth considering. ;)

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you arent going to know the sound of that fiddle until you plug it into a proper acoustic amp or better yet a good di into a decent pa... that electric guitar map wont tell you the truth about an acoustic guitar... that said, my taylor doesnt use a battery... had the baggs hexidecimal system installed and its got individual pick ups and bridge on each string so the output is hot enough to use. (personally think its still too weak and am partial to the fishman aura direct in but there are many other good ones out there... i hope ive caused sufficient confusion?

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You could do it the old fashioned way -your only doing one song an my guess is that your only background any ways .

Why not use a shot-gun-microphone -maybe a shure 57 . Think you could easily borrow one before hand to get use to it .

they are not an exspensive mike -the directional mic is the basic way to do it without a pickup.

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