Members Pocock Posted February 26, 2015 Members Share Posted February 26, 2015 Is anyone familiar with the Alvarez Yairi DY 85 model from the 70s? I'm having a hard time figuring out if the back/side wood is solid or lam. Can anyone help me out? Gracias! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pocock Posted February 26, 2015 Author Members Share Posted February 26, 2015 I believe the back/side wood on this model is laminate but I'm still having difficulties trying to confirm this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members katopp Posted February 26, 2015 Members Share Posted February 26, 2015 Yairi is almost always lam. Yairi believed in a very rigid frame for responsive tops, so his creations have been mostly lam b/s. Nothing wrong with that, IMHO. Only corksniffers rate the materials higher than the craftsmanship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pocock Posted February 26, 2015 Author Members Share Posted February 26, 2015 Yairi is almost always lam. Yairi believed in a very rigid frame for responsive tops' date=' so his creations have been mostly lam b/s. Nothing wrong with that, IMHO. Only corksniffers rate the materials higher than the craftsmanship.[/quote'] Ha! Well, my experience is that solid woods tend to improve tonally with age. Maybe it's the top wood that contributes the most to that? I've certainly played lams that sound terrific, but never owned one, so I'm not sure if the tone improves with age. I know my solid wood guitars all sound better the more I play them. Either way, thanks for the info! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DeepEnd Posted February 26, 2015 Members Share Posted February 26, 2015 The general consensus is that the top is the main contributor. A guy I knew in college had what I think was a DY85 and it was an awesome guitar. But if you're thinking of buying one, bear in mind that we're talking about a 40 year old guitar. It's likely going to have multiple expensive-to-fix issues like a neck that needs to be reset. Personally, I'd pass unless you can get it really cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members recordingtrack1 Posted February 27, 2015 Members Share Posted February 27, 2015 I own a DY48 from the 80's now. Play it every day and it is the loudest guitar I have ever owned. Great Bluegrass guitar. Lam b/s. I used to have a DY55 and it too was Lam b/s. It was a nice guitar but couldn't touch my other one. I am firmly of the belief that any model # above 77 is solid wood. While I don't have the backup for that I believe a little internet research would clear that up. For a while Yairi's were the best steal on the ebay. then suddenly people started waking up and realizing they were actually worth something. the prices went up on them some time back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarcapo Posted February 27, 2015 Members Share Posted February 27, 2015 Yea they are usually laminate back and side guitars with a solid spruce (or sometimes cedar) top. I had a DY45 growing up as a kid. My first guitar. Great sounding and playing instruments. Back in the late 1970's, there weren't all of the options that there are today when buying an acoustic. Taylors didn't exist as a brand you could buy in stores. Nor were there any of the boutique builders like Santa Cruz, Collings etc. We basically had Gibson, Guild, Martin....and this new Japanese upstart "Alvarez Yairi" Gibsons were horrible acoustics at the time. But still expensive. A company called Norlin bought the brand name and really didn't know what they were doing. Guilds and Martins were nice....but ran around $1,000 and up even then. My only option was an Alvarez. I saved all summer working in a cemetery for $3.50 and hour to buy a new DY45 for $400 in 1980. It was a great guitar that I played for about 12 years all through college. Then one day the bridge popped cleanly off the body and I stupidly gave it away to a friend. I didn't realize that it was an easy repair. I bought a new Takamine but it never sounded or played as well as that Alvarez. Occasionally I see a DY45 on Ebay...but they always sell for too high and I already have way too many acoustic guitar in my collection. But if I ever see a clean one at a good price I just might bite for the memories. BTW one nice thing about Yairis is that because the back and sides are laminate, the woods used are often very exotic and beautiful. I agree that the back and sides really don't contribute much to an acoustic guitar's sound in spite of all the hype. It's all in the top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pocock Posted February 27, 2015 Author Members Share Posted February 27, 2015 Is there a 'Holy Grail' of Yairis? I would like to have a yairi, had one very early in my guitar playing days. My primary player is a Gibson Advanced Jumbo. I'm looking for a nice bassy yairi but there aren't many in Chicago that I've found. Just curious on the perspective of Alvarez yairi fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pocock Posted February 27, 2015 Author Members Share Posted February 27, 2015 Is there a 'Holy Grail' of Yairis? I would like to have a yairi, had one very early in my guitar playing days. My primary player is a Gibson Advanced Jumbo. I'm looking for a nice bassy yairi but there aren't many in Chicago that I've found. Just curious on the perspective of Alvarez yairi fans. So just to clarify the above... what is the Alvarez equivalent to the Martin D-28/35/45 or the Gibson Advance Jumbo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DeepEnd Posted February 27, 2015 Members Share Posted February 27, 2015 So just to clarify the above... what is the Alvarez equivalent to the Martin D-28/35/45 or the Gibson Advance Jumbo? Apples vs. oranges. Yairis sound different from Martins or Gibsons but they're all very nice guitars. Yairis generally look more like Martins than anything else if that matters. Find a shop near you that sells them and choose the one you like best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pocock Posted February 27, 2015 Author Members Share Posted February 27, 2015 Apples vs. oranges. Yairis sound different from Martins or Gibsons but they're all very nice guitars. Yairis generally look more like Martins than anything else if that matters. Find a shop near you that sells them and choose the one you like best. I have yet to find a shop that sells Alavarez guitars in Chicago. In fact, I did their locator feature and the closest shop is in Milwaukee. Regarding the sound, I've owned Alvarez's and I think they very much sound similar to the Gibson and Martin dreads. They have that big and deep bassy tone, that's why I'm looking for one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pocock Posted February 27, 2015 Author Members Share Posted February 27, 2015 I've been researching Yairis all day and here are some other tidbits I've discovered. Early DY models and YW models were pretty much all laminate b/s. However, the YW models over 1000 (2000, 2500 etc...) are solid b/s of varying tone woods. Also, model names in the early days used 4 digit numbers... for instance, the Alvarez Yairi model 5060 became the DY-85 (the guitar I mention in the OP). Here's a copy/paste from some of my searches: YW-1000 has laminated Brazilian Rosewood sides and back.YW-1000 is the same as Alvarez Yairi DY90 or 5070.YW-1200, YW-1500, YW-2000, YW-2500 and YW-2600 - all have solid back/sides.YW-2000 and YW-2500 have solid Brazilian Rosewood.YW-2600 has solid Maple sides and back.YW-2000 is the same as Alvarez Yairi DY95 or K.YAIRI DY45.YW-2000 switched model numbers, and it became the DY45 in 1975 spring or summer Hopefully that helps others who are having trouble locate accurate data on early Alvarez guitars. Another question I have... I've seen some guitars that are labeld as K. Yairi on the headstock. I'm assuming these were hand crafted by K. Yairi but I'm curious why they aren't labeled as Alvarez? Thanks for all the posts. Much appreciated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DeepEnd Posted February 28, 2015 Members Share Posted February 28, 2015 AFAIK, some early Yairis were rebranded as Alvarez while others were simply sold as Yairis. As for model numbers, avoid anything with a 4-digit model beginning with "5". Those guitars were made in the 70's and you really don't want to go there unless you know what you're doing. I checked your local CraigsList and didn't find anything. Here's a NOS '02 DY100 on eBay in Deerfield for $2760 if you can afford it: http://www.ebay.com/itm/YAIRI-Alvarez-DY100-Handmade-Sitka-Spruce-Top-Solid-Mahogany-Body-Rare-Valuable-/201276572554?pt=Guitar&hash=item2edd04c38a. Looks like a nice guitar but 'way too rich for my blood. You might be able to arrange to play it first if it's not too far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pocock Posted February 28, 2015 Author Members Share Posted February 28, 2015 AFAIK' date=' some early Yairis were rebranded as Alvarez while others were simply sold as Yairis. As for model numbers, avoid anything with a 4-digit model beginning with "5". Those guitars were made in the 70's and you really don't want to go there unless you know what you're doing. I checked your local CraigsList and didn't find anything. Here's a NOS '02 DY100 on eBay in Deerfield for $2760 if you can afford it: http://www.ebay.com/itm/YAIRI-Alvarez-DY100-Handmade-Sitka-Spruce-Top-Solid-Mahogany-Body-Rare-Valuable-/201276572554?pt=Guitar&hash=item2edd04c38a. Looks like a nice guitar but 'way too rich for my blood. You might be able to arrange to play it first if it's not too far.[/quote'] I've never read or seen anything regarding the 70s models being bad. In fact, I thought the 70s Yairis were the more desirable? Can you be more specific about the 5060 and similar models? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DeepEnd Posted March 1, 2015 Members Share Posted March 1, 2015 I've never read or seen anything regarding the 70s models being bad. In fact, I thought the 70s Yairis were the more desirable? Can you be more specific about the 5060 and similar models? Okay, let me say it again: A 1975 guitar is 40 years old, more or less. A 40 year old guitar is likely to have structural issues. This applies to any 40 year old guitar, not just Yairis: Martin, Gibson, Guild, you name it. If you're Freeman Keller or someone like him and have the tools and knowledge to put a 40 year old guitar in shape, or if you have someone you trust who can put the guitar in playable condition and the price is right, fine. Figure close to half a grand for a neck reset plus the cost of the guitar. If it's not worth it to you, find another guitar. A '75 Yairi 5XXX for $500 could end up being a $1000 guitar easily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarcapo Posted March 2, 2015 Members Share Posted March 2, 2015 Laminate Brazilian rosewood Yairis: Laminate quilt mahogany Alvarez Yairi: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pocock Posted March 2, 2015 Author Members Share Posted March 2, 2015 Okay, let me say it again: A 1975 guitar is 40 years old, more or less. A 40 year old guitar is likely to have structural issues. This applies to any 40 year old guitar, not just Yairis: Martin, Gibson, Guild, you name it. If you're Freeman Keller or someone like him and have the tools and knowledge to put a 40 year old guitar in shape, or if you have someone you trust who can put the guitar in playable condition and the price is right, fine. Figure close to half a grand for a neck reset plus the cost of the guitar. If it's not worth it to you, find another guitar. A '75 Yairi 5XXX for $500 could end up being a $1000 guitar easily. Well, sure. That much is obvious regarding older guitars. I thought you had something against the 70s models Yairis specifically. Thanks for clarifying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarcapo Posted March 3, 2015 Members Share Posted March 3, 2015 This might be your "Holy Grail" Yairi: http://www.ebay.com/itm/1984-Alvarez-Yairi-DY-92-Lute-Back-by-Kazuo-Yairi-The-Masterpiece-by-the-Master-/141590717946 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pocock Posted March 3, 2015 Author Members Share Posted March 3, 2015 This might be your "Holy Grail" Yairi: http://www.ebay.com/itm/1984-Alvarez...-/141590717946 Too Ovationy for me Can't tell what type of wood makes up the b/s. Edit to add: thanks for trying to find the 'answer' for me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pocock Posted March 6, 2015 Author Members Share Posted March 6, 2015 So I ended up buying this DY-85 off ebay - http://www.ebay.com/itm/161611686591 WOW! I've owned dozens of guitars over the years and this is REALLY nice, barely played I presume. Sure there's some noticeable wear but if you were to guess, it looks like it's 5-10 years old NOT 40 years old. Plays and sounds like a dream. The low E buzzes up to the 5th fret, so I'll need to get that looked at but besides that, this guitar really sounds GREAT! This is probably the 6th guitar I've purchased from ebay and only 1 had to be returned. I've said it before and I'll reiterate here... if you see a guitar you like on ebay, pull the trigger. As long as the seller has a good history, there's really no risk. Most sellers offer a money back guarantee and returns. This one did not, so it was a bit of a gamble. I figured if I didn't like the tone, I would just re-sell on ebay. I paid $625 which is a really good deal on this model, so I knew, worst case scenario, I could get close to my money back. BUT, luckily I don't have to resort to that option because this geetar SINGS!!! Thanks to everyone for your valuable information and input. I appreciate it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DeepEnd Posted March 6, 2015 Members Share Posted March 6, 2015 Congratulations and Happy New Guitar Day. Glad you like it. I do note that there's very little saddle exposed. I hope you're in a position to start saving for a neck reset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pocock Posted March 6, 2015 Author Members Share Posted March 6, 2015 Congratulations and Happy New Guitar Day. Glad you like it. I do note that there's very little saddle exposed. I hope you're in a position to start saving for a neck reset. I'll agree that most guitars need a reset once it hits 30+ years. But I'll also argue that some guitars never need one. This might be one of those exceptions... or maybe not. I'm not sure how this guitar was stored but the pictures don't do it justice. This thing is in immaculate condition save the buzzing (I think I'm going to replace the nut and saddle). It has been maintained in near mint condition and I'm not exaggerating. I played it for a good 40 minutes and getting ready to pick it up now, this baby is far from a reset as far as I can tell. This is just another to my collection. I'm at 6 now as far as acoustic guitars. I told my wife I'd sell one to be square but I'm gonna stall her out on that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DeepEnd Posted March 6, 2015 Members Share Posted March 6, 2015 I'll agree that most guitars need a reset once it hits 30+ years. But I'll also argue that some guitars never need one. This might be one of those exceptions... or maybe not. . . . . . . It has been maintained in near mint condition and I'm not exaggerating. I played it for a good 40 minutes and getting ready to pick it up now, this baby is far from a reset as far as I can tell. . . . It isn't one of the exceptions, which don't exist, BTW. Sorry. I can tell by looking at the pics of the bridge. Cosmetic condition has little or nothing to do with it. It's easy to tell if it needs a neck reset: Take a straightedge, say 18", and lay it edgewise along the frets. Run it along so one end touches the bridge. The edge should hit the top of the bridge. I have a Norlin era (69-85) Epi that I originally bought for our daughter. A straightedge hits about 1/16" below the top of the bridge, which is excellent for a guitar that old. I paid $45 for it on eBay so it's not worth a reset. You should have 1/8" or more of saddle below the low E. Judging from the second (post repair) bridge pic, you've got maybe 1/16" and the high E is practically touching the top of the bridge, which means break angle is minimal. If you like the way your guitar sounds and plays, that's fine but it could be better. I've attached a screen capture so you can see what I mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pocock Posted March 8, 2015 Author Members Share Posted March 8, 2015 It isn't one of the exceptions, which don't exist, BTW. Sorry. I can tell by looking at the pics of the bridge. Cosmetic condition has little or nothing to do with it. It's easy to tell if it needs a neck reset: Take a straightedge, say 18", and lay it edgewise along the frets. Run it along so one end touches the bridge. The edge should hit the top of the bridge. I have a Norlin era (69-85) Epi that I originally bought for our daughter. A straightedge hits about 1/16" below the top of the bridge, which is excellent for a guitar that old. I paid $45 for it on eBay so it's not worth a reset. You should have 1/8" or more of saddle below the low E. Judging from the second (post repair) bridge pic, you've got maybe 1/16" and the high E is practically touching the top of the bridge, which means break angle is minimal. If you like the way your guitar sounds and plays, that's fine but it could be better. I've attached a screen capture so you can see what I mean. Took it in to my shop this weekend and as I suspected, neck is fine. No reset needed. It does need a new saddle as the current one was filed down in an odd way. I'm also getting the frets sealed and leveled. The filed down saddle is the source of the buzzing which is what I thought. So about $200 of work to get this in perfectly playing condition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DeepEnd Posted March 9, 2015 Members Share Posted March 9, 2015 You're quite fortunate that you have a 40 year old guitar that doesn't need a neck reset--yet. It's a rare guitar that old that isn't showing signs of structural deformation (poor neck angle, bridge pulling up, top bellying, neck joint separating, etc.) and any time it hasn't happened it will sooner or later. Typically, people who own guitars with bad neck angles file the saddle down to compensate for the higher action caused by improper neck angle. That's what I was going by in looking at yours, given that the action as described is about what it ought to be. Normally, you'd have to play it fairly hard to get buzzing at that height, assuming everything else is as it should be. Sounds like a higher saddle and some fret work will put things as close to right as possible. Your guitar ought to really sing with a new bone or TUSQ saddle and a proper setup. The initial purchase price plus shipping plus $200 worth of work gets you a very nice guitar in excellent cosmetic condition for a bit under $900. Not bad at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.