Double balling strings ?

[gardo]

I'm sure this is an old subject,but my buddy told me that he double balls all his acoustic strings by removing the balls from an old set of strings and sliding them on to the new set . He claims it reduces slipping and saves the bridge plate from excessive damage. I don't know about that but it seems this would have to effct the tone .

Anyone ever tried this?

[Etienne Rambert]

It's possible that an eyelet slipped over a new string could present less wear to a bridge plate. It's also possible that an eyelet slipped over a new string could help a guitar with a worn or damaged bridge plate. I guess it would depend on how the bridge was slotted for the strings, and the wear on the bridge plate. It doesn't sound like it could hurt, but it likely would not help much. If the bridge plate is so bad that there is "slipping", then it's time to get it fixed.

 

Whatever mass those balls (eyelets) have will technically affect the tone. Whether it's noticeable, or even measurable, is another story.

 

In answer to your question, no, I've never tried it. And I likely won't be trying it.

 

 

I don't get it. Is this replacing the ball ends of new strings with old ball ends? Or is it adding another one to the new string? The goal is to prevent wear on the bridge plate?

 

How much wear and tear would this procedure prevent? I have no problems with slippage anyway.

But I have never heard of this procedure.

[garthman]

I suppose it's something I might try when I grow tired of watching the paint drying on my walls

[riffmeister lives]

Brass balls if you want the guitar to sound brassy.

 

Cannon balls if you want your guitar to be a cannon.

 

Tennis balls if you want to improve your serve.

[Freeman Keller]

I had heard of it but I don't think anyone regularly does it. If you properly seat the ball of the string up against the bridge plate (give the string a little bend right at the end of where the wrapped part ends) and pull them up tight against the plate while you insert the pin. Remember that the ball wedges sideways against the pin to hold it in place - you don't have to push it tightly into the hold. It helps to have the pin hole reamed to fit the pin (not all manufactures do that) and I think it helps to slot the bridge.

 

Also, I've changed my stringing technique slightly where I now put all six into the bridge before I start at the peg head - that lets me reach in the sound hole and make sure all the balls are seated well.

[katopp]

Yeah, I can prove it works. It also keeps away all the Elephants. There are no Elephants in Ireland, you say? Well, see ... it works!

[gardo]

I had heard of it but I don't think anyone regularly does it. If you properly seat the ball of the string up against the bridge plate (give the string a little bend right at the end of where the wrapped part ends) and pull them up tight against the plate while you insert the pin. Remember that the ball wedges sideways against the pin to hold it in place - you don't have to push it tightly into the hold. It helps to have the pin hole reamed to fit the pin (not all manufactures do that) and I think it helps to slot the bridge.

 

Also, I've changed my stringing technique slightly where I now put all six into the bridge before I start at the peg head - that lets me reach in the sound hole and make sure all the balls are seated well.

Well my buddy does this on a regular basis. He also puts all six strings in the bridge first to be able to reach in and check how the balls are seated. He has some good ideas but I think he's a little extreme at times.

[Freeman Keller]

Can't see where it hurts anything - just don't think it is necessary. Many people feel that slotting the bridge and using unslotted pins (or turning slotted ones around) helps seat the ball better and can reduce damage to the bridge plate. I routinely slot and ramp the bridges on my guitars - figure it can't hurt.

 

I do think its a good idea to make sure the balls are tight against the plate - sometimes they can get hung up and cause all sorts of nasty rattles

[Idunno]

There was this guy once....

 

Tim McKnight graciously fielded tech duties at a jam I attended once (with Neil). Tim was changing strings on this guy's Goodall but there were no bridge pins. The dood drilled a piece of solid brass rod and passed his strings through it, then up through their respective holes in the bridge. The ball ends rested on the piece of brass rod preventing any deformation to the bridge plate that normal pin retention would cause over time and repeated string changes. As Tim removed and replaced the strings he was subjected to a tonal dissertation from the dood about his great idea. Tim, being the closest thing to a secular saint as one can imagine, patiently listened with a Mona Lisa smile and obligatory nods of his head. Funny stuff.

[DeepEnd]

You have a nice guitar that appears to be in good condition. I don't think your friend's idea is necessary. Remember over in Electric Guitars someone came up with the idea of putting washers on the ends of the strings on a Strat so they wouldn't sink into the trem block and potentially get stuck? At least some people figured the washers would vibrate and rattle and produce nasty artifacts. Probably the same here.

[gardo]

You have a nice guitar that appears to be in good condition. I don't think your friend's idea is necessary. Remember over in Electric Guitars someone came up with the idea of putting washers on the ends of the strings on a Strat so they wouldn't sink into the trem block and potentially get stuck? At least some people figured the washers would vibrate and rattle and produce nasty artifacts. Probably the same here.

This is exactly what I'm concerned about.

 

[gardo]

There was this guy once....

 

Tim McKnight graciously fielded tech duties at a jam I attended once (with Neil). Tim was changing strings on this guy's Goodall but there were no bridge pins. The dood drilled a piece of solid brass rod and passed his strings through it, then up through their respective holes in the bridge. The ball ends rested on the piece of brass rod preventing any deformation to the bridge plate that normal pin retention would cause over time and repeated string changes. As Tim removed and replaced the strings he was subjected to a tonal dissertation from the dood about his great idea. Tim, being the closest thing to a secular saint as one can imagine, patiently listened with a Mona Lisa smile and obligatory nods of his head. Funny stuff.

That would take some patiece for sure. So how did it sound with that brass rod inside ?

[Freeman Keller]

That would take some patiece for sure. So how did it sound with that brass rod inside ?

 

Can't comment on that but there is a brass plate that is sold to put on the inside of your guitar up against the bridge plate - you can buy them with the correct hole spacing for different guitars. I think it is called the "Plate Mate" or something like that. The general feeling over at UMGF was that it was a "tone killer". Ideally the builder selects a thin hard wood, maple is commonly used altho Martin and some others have used rosewood. Remember that taken together the bridge and bridge plate is the largest "brace" on the entire guitar - most people feel that is should be kept as light as possible.

[Grant Harding]

At least a few electric players solder the ball-end and wraps of their strings to make them tune up faster and prevent breakage. I've never had an issue with it so have never tried it.

[gardo]

At least a few electric players solder the ball-end and wraps of their strings to make them tune up faster and prevent breakage. I've never had an issue with it so have never tried it.

I've also heard of people using a drop of superglue on the wraps. I've only ever had one string come unwrapped so I don't worry about it

[Grant Harding]

Yeah - I don't think I've ever had a failure at the ball end (get yer minds out of the gutter) in the hundreds of sets I've used over the years.

[katopp]

I've had two strings where the ballend end unwrapped itself. Two strings in ... 26 six stringers, 4 twelve stringers times four sets a year - minimum - times 10'ish years that I remember ... well, a LOT of strings, methinks. And two unwrapped themselves. Both by the same brand in the same multi-set pack, btw. I've never ever bought another string made by this brand. Not worth the fuzz of soldering or wasting superglue.

[WRGKMC]

I've done that on a few electrics where the stop tail was worn. It was done for mechanical issues, not tone. The additional ball end acts like a small washer which suspended the string better because the contact point was flat.

 

The only thing I could see it benefiting an acoustic is as others said. If the bridge is worn and the strings tend to pop the pins out, having a different shape at the end of the string may prevent that problem.

 

I cant see it changing the tone "unless" the end wrapping is really long and its affecting the downward pressure on the saddle. The ball would act as a spacer and pull more of the string down inside the guitar keeping the thicker end wrap further down inside, away from the holes break away point which could affect the downward pressure on the saddle.

 

For most acoustics and strings I've seen the body is thick enough, and the wrapping short enough, that extra wrap end wrap is below the tops surface. The brass itself isn't going to make any noticeable tonal difference with such a small increase in mass.

[Grant Harding]

Good point WRGKMC. I once fixed up a cheap acoustic for a friend and there were no brands of string that I had that didn't end up with the windings on the bridge saddle on the 6th string. This would have been the answer. Next time!