Members thestratomaster Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 Just wondering what makes an acoustic sound good. Is it the wood that makes the biggest difference or the bracing? Whats the deal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members masterbuilt Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 Good tone-wood, tight construction, attention to detail, and favorable design. Look at the care that goes into a nice Martin or other fine instrument. You will see design elements that have been used for almost a century. Combine that care with good wood and craftsmanship and that will be your answer. Take a tour of the Martin factory or talk with a luthier in your area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Samilyn Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 Yup - what he said ^^^ and to add a couple of things.... Different types of wood produce different tonal qualities. For instance, mahogany is warm, rosewood is complex, cedar is quieter and woodier than spruce, etc. Different types of internal bracing make a difference in how the wood vibrates and resonates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TN.Frank Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 And sometimes you get something that really shouldn't sound that good and it turns out to be a really great guitar. I'm still impressed at the Alvarez RD8 that I picked up. It's a $250 buck, laminated top entry level guitar and it just rings out like nothing else I've ever heard. I guess it's best to play what you want to buy to see if it sounds right to you. That way you know what you're getting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Fred Fartboski Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 What makes an acoustic sound good? It has alot to do with the player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members thestratomaster Posted November 10, 2008 Author Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 so would an acoustic with mahogany back and sides, spruce top, and rosewood bridge, nato neck with rosewood board sound good? in your opinion...im looking to build one is why i ask Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members TN.Frank Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 so would an acoustic with mahogany back and sides, spruce top, and rosewood bridge, nato neck with rosewood board sound good? in your opinion...im looking to build one is why i ask Add a bone nut and bridge and I'd say it's almost have to sound good but it's no garentee. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members thestratomaster Posted November 10, 2008 Author Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 i planned on doing that as well...thanks for your help Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Brokepick Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 so would an acoustic with mahogany back and sides, spruce top, and rosewood bridge, nato neck with rosewood board sound good? in your opinion...im looking to build one is why i ask What kinds of acoustic music do you like? Some kinds of music and playing are better suited to particular sizes of guitars and maybe the types of wood in them. IMO; Of the ingredients you mention, the top wood and the back and sides wood will make the most difference in sound. Solid woods would usually be more desirable than laminates. Mahogany will make for a louder sound with lots of midrange-- probably better suited for flatpicking and lead type stuff. Rosewood has a broader spectrum of sound and overtones-- good for strumming, rhythm and backup. Dreadnoughts or a jumbos will be louder and perhaps bassier and boomier because of their size. The smaller guitars might be better for fingerpicking. These are not rigid rules, just usual expectations, or at least my view of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Samilyn Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 Paging Freeman.......Paging Freeman......... Paging Bjorn........Paging Bjorn....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members thestratomaster Posted November 10, 2008 Author Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 Well...i play mostly every thing. I mix it up, mostly chords with an occasional fingerpicking. Do play leads but not very often. So would rosewood suit me better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 Well...i play mostly every thing. I mix it up, mostly chords with an occasional fingerpicking. Do play leads but not very often. So would rosewood suit me better? Strato, to try to answer your question will take hours of discussion - there are so many things that make a guitar sound the way it does. The choice of wood, body shape and depth, how the braces and top is voiced, scale length, strings, pins, mass of the bridge (and type of bridge), and some will argue the type of glue all have an affect on the sound of an accoustic. To best tell what different woods sound like pick two guitar where everything else is the same except the wood and listen to them - maybe a D18 (mahogany) and D28 (rosewood). Now to hear the difference in body shape and size take that D28 and compare it to an OM28, then to hear the effects of scale length, add an 00028 to the mix. Of course you want to make sure that each has the same scalloping, brace pattern and (duh) even the same strings. It sounds like you actually don't have a real good handle on acoustic guitars, yet you are ready to build one. My suggestion here is to pick something you really like from a commercial builder and try to duplicate it - I can assure you that your first build will be as good as the time, effort and research that you put into it, and you can only hope that it will sound close to what you are trying to emulate. My first home buld was to try to come close to an 00028VS - small bodied sitka over rose long scale finger picker. I'm pretty happy with it - there are clips at the annex. Next I built a classical for my son and tried to copy Segovia's 1937 Hauser - again sitka over rose. It is a decent sounding classical and I learned a lot about traditional building techniques. Next I built an F5 mandolin, sounds good but it sure isn't a Loar signed Gibbie (but I learned a lot about how Loar voiced the tops of his mandos). I own a beautiful martin dread 12 string, but wanted something better for fingerstyle so I build a deep OM short scale 12 - again there are clips at the annex. Next one was a very small guitar for my daughter - I tried to emulate Joan Baez's 0-45 (again sitka over rose), and this winter I will be building a clone of Leadbellys famous Stella (adi over hog, ladder braced, huge scale). Here are three of my homebuilds - to my ears they sound good enough that I mostly play them - my Taylor and two Martins sit in the closet. If you tell me a little more about exactly what you have, what you have heard, what you play and what you want to do I'll try to help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members NEWYORK Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 Just wondering what makes an acoustic sound good. Is it the wood that makes the biggest difference or the bracing? Whats the deal? The addition of strings is what does it ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 so would an acoustic with mahogany back and sides, spruce top, and rosewood bridge, nato neck with rosewood board sound good? in your opinion...im looking to build one is why i ask Are you planning to build this from scratch or a kit? Maybe a Grizzly kit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Chris@AB Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 so would an acoustic with mahogany back and sides, spruce top, and rosewood bridge, nato neck with rosewood board sound good? in your opinion...im looking to build one is why i ask If you're planning to build from scratch - bending mahogany tends to be fairly difficult, whereas EI rosewood is rather easy to bend (e.g., the wood is much more forgiving). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 If you're planning to build from scratch - bending mahogany tends to be fairly difficult, whereas EI rosewood is rather easy to bend (e.g., the wood is much more forgiving). I'll add the nato is considered a "cheap" mahogany and is not as dimentionally stable as honduran, if you are building from scratch at least buy some good stock for your neck. My wood supplier (LMI) doesn't even sell nato. If you want a cheaper neck wood consider so called Spanish cedar. You can do as Taylor does and laminated the heel block and do a scarf joint at the headstock and save a lot of money on neck wood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members thestratomaster Posted November 10, 2008 Author Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 Are you planning to build this from scratch or a kit? Maybe a Grizzly kit? I would be using a kit...im just looking for a winter project and ive done quite a number of electrics so i thought id mix it up with an acoustic. Maybe thats a mistake? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 I would be using a kit...im just looking for a winter project and ive done quite a number of electrics so i thought id mix it up with an acoustic. Maybe thats a mistake? Absolutely not - in my opinion a kit is the way to go. It will eliminate the need for special tools (side bending, fretboard mitering, rough shaping the neck, thicknessing the plates, etc. All of mine have been built from kits - and there are many good ones out there (LMI, StewMac, John Hall, Steve Kovacik, even Martin). Your comment on the nato neck got my attention, however, since none of the good kits use it (most of them are mahogany) however I do remember reviews of someone who made kind of a partially completed kit and I think they used nato (and I think the review was somewhat negative). If you could send me the website or info about the one you want to build I'd take a look. Grizzly Tools also has a "kit" but it is mostly already built and is pretty low grade materials. Ironically they leave some of the trickiest parts undone (setting the neck, gluing the bridge) but they do all the bulding of the body. Again, the review I saw was not very flattering. If you truely want to build a quality guitar from a kit I would suggest getting Bill Cory's book on kit guitars (it is available at the kit guitar website, hosted by Bill or at luthier supply houses like LMI or Stew Mac). I would also suggest downloading the free instruction pdf on StewMac's kits - it will give you some idea of what you are getting into. And if you really want to see the whole bloody process type "lets build a little guitar" into the HCAG acoustic forum search box - you will get 15 or so threads showing how I built the little one in the picture. Good luck, it is tremendous fun and very rewarding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members panhandler Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 Just wondering what makes an acoustic sound good. Is it the wood that makes the biggest difference or the bracing? Whats the deal? Your hands and your ears. (each his own) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members seagullplayer77 Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 Asking what makes a guitar sound good is like asking someone why they liked a movie. Each person's opinion is going to be based on a number of factors and each person's opinion'll be different. Heck--some people might not like the movie at all. The same thing goes for a guitar, IMO. It really all depends on what kind of sound you're looking for. If you want something that sounds bright and edgy, then a guitar with a cedar top is going to sound lousy to you. If you want something warm and mellow, though, then you'll probably love the cedar guitar. It's really a pretty subjective thing...what makes a guitar sound good is whatever makes it sound good to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DeepEnd Posted November 10, 2008 Members Share Posted November 10, 2008 It has alot to do with the player. +1000! A good enough player can make a bad guitar sound significantly less bad or a bad player can make a great guitar sound like crap. Personally, I'm pretty much stuck in mediocrity (hmm, think I smell a song title--anyone willing to give it a shot?) regardless of the guitar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members thestratomaster Posted November 11, 2008 Author Members Share Posted November 11, 2008 Absolutely not - in my opinion a kit is the way to go. It will eliminate the need for special tools (side bending, fretboard mitering, rough shaping the neck, thicknessing the plates, etc. All of mine have been built from kits - and there are many good ones out there (LMI, StewMac, John Hall, Steve Kovacik, even Martin). Your comment on the nato neck got my attention, however, since none of the good kits use it (most of them are mahogany) however I do remember reviews of someone who made kind of a partially completed kit and I think they used nato (and I think the review was somewhat negative). If you could send me the website or info about the one you want to build I'd take a look. Grizzly Tools also has a "kit" but it is mostly already built and is pretty low grade materials. Ironically they leave some of the trickiest parts undone (setting the neck, gluing the bridge) but they do all the bulding of the body. Again, the review I saw was not very flattering. If you truely want to build a quality guitar from a kit I would suggest getting Bill Cory's book on kit guitars (it is available at the kit guitar website, hosted by Bill or at luthier supply houses like LMI or Stew Mac). I would also suggest downloading the free instruction pdf on StewMac's kits - it will give you some idea of what you are getting into. And if you really want to see the whole bloody process type "lets build a little guitar" into the HCAG acoustic forum search box - you will get 15 or so threads showing how I built the little one in the picture. Good luck, it is tremendous fun and very rewarding. Its an Ebay special kit so i really wasnt expecting much, but the woods used seem decent so i had to do a little more research. Im sure its not all that great but the price is! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=260301605840 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members notjoeaverage Posted November 11, 2008 Members Share Posted November 11, 2008 Its an Ebay special kit so i really wasnt expecting much, but the woods used seem decent so i had to do a little more research. Im sure its not all that great but the price is! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=260301605840 He has as many as a dozen kits for sale at any one time, usually auctions and the ones I've watched go between $50 and $75 . Do more research there are better quaility kits available from other makers. Like Freeman said get Bill Cory's book, or go to your local library or bookstore. If you want to have guitar to enjoy for as long as you want you need a quality kit. If you just want a DIY beater with some potential this would work, but find one of his auctions and pay half the buy it now. some links that may help http://www.kitguitarbuilder.com/ http://www.kitguitarmanuals.com/ http://www.projectguitar.chttp://www.stewmac.com/shop/Books,_plans/Building_and_repair:_Guitar,_acoustic.htmlom/ http://www.mimf.com/ http://buildyourguitar.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members alex2008 Posted November 11, 2008 Members Share Posted November 11, 2008 The best guitar-playing I ever heard was a busker with a battered cheap model with a steel plate with holes in that he had placed over the sound hole. However, if he played on a beautiful sounding guitar, I suppose he'd sound infinitely better.I believe a good solid top (I love cedar). The bracing is meant to make a difference, but I am left-handed, and play with the strings the opposite way around, and it still sounds fine to me, despite what I have read to the contrary.Oh, some strings that are not too old and thus encased in grime and sweat would be handy, as I'm sure you are aware.And, like seagullplayer77 wisely says, everyone has their own opinion on what sounds good.The best thing to do is go and try an assortment of guitars.Lastly, there are plenty of great-sounding guitars that aren't thousands of pounds. My guitar is a Simon and Patrick that cost just Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Freeman Keller Posted November 11, 2008 Members Share Posted November 11, 2008 Its an Ebay special kit so i really wasnt expecting much, but the woods used seem decent so i had to do a little more research. Im sure its not all that great but the price is! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=260301605840 OK so this is very similar to what Grizzly sells and may or may not be a good deal depending on what you want. IMHO this is not really a kit - the body and neck are completely made, all you are doing is setting the neck, gluing on the bridge, applying some finish and doing the setup. You will learn nothing about building the box or the neck, fretting, or any of the other parts of "building" a guitar. Ironically two of the most critical tasks are setting the neck angle and positioning the bridge - if those aren't dead on your new git will be basically unplayable. In your first post you ask about what makes a guitar sound good and I talk about the different woods, bracing, shape of the body, size of the air volume, etc. You will have no control over these things - they are all determined for you. I'm not sure the body is solid wood (and I guessing that at least the back and sides are not) - in that case the selection of wood is purely cosmetic. If it is solid then the selection of rosewood or mahogany will color the sound of the guitar. I also said that nato is usually thought of as a cheap substitute for honduran mahogany that is used on most necks. If you use his price of $135 as an indicator of the quality of the materials I'll just say that the materials for each of may builds generally runs around $400-500, plus tuners (50-100) and finish (another 100). That is good quality solid spruce and solid rosewood or mahogany, either a preshaped neck or mahogany blanks to make my own out of, and all the other pieces to make a nice, quality good sounding guitar. I'll add that to build a true kit (LMI, StewMac, etc) you should also figure on $500 or so for special luthier tools - router bits, fretting files, lots of clamps, etc - assuming that you have the usual hand tools in a small wood shop. Once again, get Bill Cory's book and build a good quality guitar that you will be proud of. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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