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NUGD!!! (WARNING: Fugly inside!!)


badpenguin

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Hey all,

As I am sure most of you know, I am a sucker for those sexy F holes on a hollow body. There is something alluring, classy, and just downright beautiful about them. Don't get me wrong, I love solids as much as anyone, but those damn F holes.....

 

So my wife and I went down to Orlando to celebrate our 10th anniversary. Ten years of wedded bliss for me, 10 years of dealing with a guitarded person for her. Knowing we would stop at my fav store, I brought 4 guitars to possibly trade. So we walk in, and during an hour or so, played a 67 SG Special, that wasn't special to me, a 95 ES135, a 73 paul Deluxe that, well, just wasn't right. Then sitting in the corner was this "beauty" I laughed at first, then strummed a chord, and that glorious "AAAAahhhhhhh" came from the heavens, along with a shaft of light. There it was! The "ONE". My beloved wife looked at it, cradled in my arms like a cherished child, and said..... "Are you F-ing kidding me? It's been run over by the truck that carries the ugly sticks!" So of course, after a few minutes (closer to an hour...) of negotiations, it came home with us.

 

This is a 1965 Gretsch Viking. Since it's been refinished, probably a 6187. (I assume since it's the most common color, sunburst.) the tuners are original, the Gretsch/Bigsby is original, and the 3 way switch and single volume pot is. Everything else has been replaced or removed. Yes, I said removed. Gretsch's were "infamous" for odd little things like a mechanical mute that operated by a toggle switch, a tone control that was a 3 way switch, and no tone pots, a switch that today is known as a kill switch, and the "Floating Sustain Unit". Think of it as a over/under/over saddle where the bridge is, with an A 440 tuning fork attached and hanging into the guitar body. Yeah, weird, and not successful in sales. Also, the ebony board is slightly "fanned in the higher registers past the 12th fret to allow for intonating it against the FSU. (God, I LOVE those thumbnail inlays!!)

 

All the holes have been filled, and a 3 way and single volume knob is all the electronics it has. That will change. I will be restoring it electrically to mostly factory, and eventually, refinishing it. (At least the top) the "human" who had it before me, changed the pickups to humbuckers. Not normally a bad thingy, but in this case, he cut thru the top supports. Again, something that will be repaired ASAP. I have on order another GFS Retrotron Nashville for the bridge. (Seriously, some GREAT sounding pickups for 40 bucks a pop!)

 

So prepare yourself, I did warn you about it FUGLY factor!

 

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you've got yourself a rockabilly rocket, there, bp.

I agree with you on the GFS Nashville Retro's...amazingly cool sounding p-up for minor cash outlay.

That refin, though, and the fact that so many holes were filled, and that the top was 'compromised' when they cut it to fit humbuckers would have probably resulted in a 'pass' from me...you must be made of sterner stuff. I've bought an occasional salvageable dog before[ the last one has yet to be salvaged, but the dang thing does play so purty...] but never one so far over the 'edge' as that. Best of luck and post it again when you have brought it back [from where ever it went] to reality ;)

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It's a few steps further from the edge then you may think. I know exactly where the original holes are, and have already begun the electrical part of the show. The bracing I will tackle when the GFS get's here. The refin, I can do over time, or just leave it in it's glittery glory. Besides, I think in the gear traded for it, I have about $400 USD in her. For a 52 year old Gretsch? Oh hell yea!

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agreed that for $400+ the $40 for the GFS [plus shipping], you will wind up with a great sounding guitar!

Enjoy! :thu:

 

My last 'pound puppy' is a circa 1971 [Norlin Era] SG. it has DiMarzio HBs where I believe originally it had P90s, and a botched refin, a brass nut...but it plays like buttah...

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You're a brave man to take on all that renovation, but I agree, that's the way one should buy a guitar, i.e. get one that speaks to you rather than the purdy images.

 

I've yet to buy any GFS Retrotrons but have been long contemplating that move to replace the mudbuckers in my Epi Wilshire Pro. I was thinking possibly the Liverpools (and possibly one or both "Hot" since it has coil split for both positions - not sure since I might be happier with the std models) but I'm wondering if you have any thoughts about the Liverpools vs the Nashvilles (seems like the Memphis versions get the least amount of chat).

 

This is the guitar I want to mod or just dump and the GFS Retrotrons would be the right level of investment for this $200 guitar.

 

Cherylsgraduation016.jpg

 

 

Not to hijack your thread, and I guess it fits in since this guitar also has its share of fugly.

 

But I think it'll look better with some Gretschy looking appointments like Retrotrons and Gretsch toggle knob.

 

But I'm curious about which GFS Retrotron you might suggest for a thin mahogany slab guitar.

 

Look forward to hearing about your upgrades.

 

Funny, my wife hates F-holes. She thinks they "F-up" the look, but me, I like them too, and long as the whole semi-hollow (or full hollow) design is a good match for the rest of the guitar's design. Some guitars IMO, just don't have enough depth of tone to handle that design (e.g. my Fender TC-90). My last NG is a Reverend Tricky Gomez and I like it's tone with the F-hole/semi-hollow build. For full on hollow bodies, I've got a Gretsch 6120 that gives me the "I'm not worthy" level of satisfaction with the tradition Gretsch design. I took that one to a jam session once and it got immediate thumbs up for its tone.

 

But I think that's a cool find. These days you can pay $3K or more for a comparable Gretsch and as you know, they no longer are even made in the US of A.

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I've used GFS in clients guitars for years, and have never been disappointed in the tone. I think the gold foils are wonderful, and have such a beautiful "ping" to the tone. The Nashville in the neck, the hot one, is one of the prettiest pickups I have heard in a while. I added a series/parallel switch, since I think the best Gretsch tones were the singles, and S/P gives you that option, without a major loss of power.

That being said about the wonders of GFS, I have had QC issues with them, and needed a replacement a few times. (AVOID the open box sales like the plague!) but they have always stood up, and replaced what needed replacement without question.

I don't find the Whilshire Fugly at all. but I agree about the knobs. And I don't know about your playing style, or gear, but maybe the Gold tones might be what you are looking for. Not too hot, not muddy what-so-ever, and have a cool look, that might make the Whilly look coolish, kinda... sorta.

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Thanks!

I recently bought a Supro Hampton that has 3 gold foil p'ups and they do indeed sound quite nice. Getting into a guitar with Gold Foil p'ups was a good move on my part (since I really enjoy their tone, clean or with OD for that swampy'/bluesy tone), but I still try to reconcile the price Supro wants for an Indonesian made guitar. I've thought about going more Gretsch-mod on that Wilshire, including maybe adding a B-50 Bigsby. And I like the idea of getting p'ups where I can use the existing push/pull pots for coil splitting, but indeed, I'll take another look at the GFS Goldfoils. I also have a Silvertone 1478 RI that I think would be stellar with the GFS Goldfoils, assuming I could find the right fit.

 

Before I picked up that Wilshire on a blowout deal, I'd also bought the Worn '66 Wilshire with the Epi Mini-hums, and it's possibly the best sounding stock Epi I've bought. Plenty of presence from that guitar. But of course the input jack failed. Seems like it's either that or toggle switches to go prematurely on Epi's. :-(

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" I laughed at first, then strummed a chord, and that glorious "AAAAahhhhhhh" came from the heavens,"

So I have to ask "Why change anything, why try to "improve" or restore it? I'd put on a truss rod cover and leave it as is. Sounds like it has mojo galore, and you can't buy that. Added bonus is that it would be easy to identify if ever stolen. If you restore it, it will look like all the rest of that model and you will lose opportunity to wonder about "hmm when did owner do this?".

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

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Very simple Emory: When I strummed, it wasn't plugged in. The "feel" the "mojo" is there within the guitar itself. And, as weird as it sounds, the guitar WANTS to be semi restored. it will never be factory spec, but it still will be custom. Already I added the missing volume controls, the tone switch, and the electrical mute. Yes, I know it's an imamate object, but it "feels" happier.

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Red pointy thing not something to play in your lap I reckon! Reminds me of some of those odd Ovations from back when. My bad, I thought sound was plugged in. I did forget about knobs.... maybe old wooden clothes pins? Easy to see where settings are (kidding). Personally, I'd keep the finish the same: things don't get that ugly overnight. It's takes time and attention to reach that level.

Slap some TV Jones in there, etc and you'll have a giant killer. Although I hear they are hard to find, let alone kill

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I wouldn't be in a hurry to re-do it either. Just like we tell a kid who buys a guitar and wants to upgrade everything right away,play it for a while . It has a story to tell maybe find out more about it? In a sik sort of way I like it.

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Phil and Emory: the red pointy thing is a 2007 Gary Kramer Simulator T. VERY comfy in the lap btw. Probably one of about 250 made in that configuration. Made in Korea by Samick. 2 versions were available when they came out. Hardtail, with rosewood fretboard, and Floyd with maple fretboard. Then a year later, came the F29 version with a 29 fret board, single coil in the neck, and a hum in the bridge. AND a 36 fret 7 string version. Pretty much, after 2011, the company went into hiatus. I wrote them a few months ago wondering if they were still in business, and the answer was "Kind of." Very reassuring, don't you think?

 

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The pickup going into the bridge is a GFS Hot Nashville Gold, to match the hot Nashville in the neck. The main work though, has been restoring the electronics to Gretsch-ish spec. Gretsch's electronics were/are WEIRD. No tone controls to speak of, 3 volumes, and a kill switch way back in 65! So.... the first switch is the typical 3 way pickup selector. the second 3 way next to it, is a capacitor switch that gives you either, full tone, (as if you turned your tone down to zero.) bypassed, then half tone (Say around 4 or 5 on your tone switch.) I personally thought it was an incredibly stupid idea. BUT... I play with my tone control constantly when playing. During a solo, I like the neck at about 4ish on tone, and the bridge around 7ish. With this setup, you can customize it to a single click for that tone. And of course, you can always change caps to tailor it to your own preferences.

 

Then there are the single volume controls themselves. (I added push/pulls to go from series to parallel.) Turn them down a bit, and you lose a little bit of brightness anyway, so there's a secondary bit of tone control. All of that goes to a Master vol control with a .001 cap added so you DON"T suffer that tone loss when you turn it down. The "kill" switch, I may never use, so I might turn that into a coil tap for both pickups.

 

 

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There is a structural issue to be dealt with too, but that will be addressed with the new pickup. As to a refin..... over time, maybe. I took it to a little gig/get together last night, and people loved the tone, but the looks.. some thought it was cool, others, well..... until they played it.

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