The Cheapest vs. The Most Expensive

[mikesr1963]

[YOUTUBE]FuHoEBoAoTM#t=562[/YOUTUBE]

[Bucksstudent]

Why?

 

Other than views, why compare the two? I'm not trying to be negative so much as ascertain what the point is.

[Emory]

Like almost every product, exponential increase in price for harder and harder increase in quality...

I would like them do same comparison, but this time with low price amps, say Fender Mustang 1. If can only afford Squire, where would money come from for spendy Marshall amp?

[1001gear]

Can or cannot play the damn thing is more relevant than inventing a number.

[soundcreation]

Price isn't a guarantee of quality, but it does tend to follow.

 

Quality is a product of company policy and standards as well as the people on the floor making them.

 

And there is more to it than just "cheap vs expensive".

 

For some of us, there are ethical factors that influence purchases. I personally feel better buying guitars that I can be sure are not made in sweatshop conditions. And that costs more. A price I'm more than willing to pay.

 

So yeah....maybe a MIM fender is a very nice instrument....completely playable, gigable etc....good quality, with a good finish etc.....but for me that's not enough.

 

I can't be sure that those mexican workers are being treated fairly. I can't be sure they're not on unreasonable quota based production systems or that their factories follow decent standards of safety and working conditions.

 

I also like companies that put building the best guitar they can, first and that's what they care about. Not selling me key chains or other "branded" merchandise.

 

[mikesr1963]

Has anyone come to the conclusion that maybe more thought should go into amp selection than anything else?

[Bucksstudent]

Has anyone come to the conclusion that maybe more thought should go into amp selection than anything else?

 

Yes. While a Squier Bullet may not sound as good as a Custom Shop Strat through a Fender Twin, they're going to sound pretty much the same through a practice amp with a small speaker.

[Ancient Mariner]

Why?

 

Other than views, why compare the two? I'm not trying to be negative so much as ascertain what the point is.

 

Because it generates controversy & views.

 

I very much enjoy the Andertons/Chappers videos, but as entertainment more than a source of useful information about what my next purchase should be.

[Phil O'Keefe]

 

Because it generates controversy & views.

 

 

Precisely. It's the same reason you see articles with titles like "the 100 greatest guitarists of all time" or "the top ten albums of the 1990s" - they attract eyeballs and the controversy helps spread the word and helps sales / web traffic.

 

 

[daddymack]

 

Precisely. It's the same reason you see articles with titles like "the 100 greatest guitarists of all time" or "the top ten albums of the 1990s" - they attract eyeballs and the controversy helps spread the word and helps sales / web traffic.

 

 

So why doesn't HC do that?

[Phil O'Keefe]

 

So why doesn't HC do that?

 

I'd like to think that we have more respect for our readers than to resort to something like that. We're certainly interested in giving readers content they're interested in reading about, but not vacuous non-articles designed solely to capture eyeballs and manipulate people into getting all worked up.

 

Like Ancient Mariner said, that sort of thing can be entertaining in a way, but I have limited time - I'd rather spend it on writing about stuff that will actually help people, and that will hopefully prove to be useful or educational for them.

[WRGKMC]

I think its rooted in pride. Many simply cant afford to be a top end guitar so they settle for less. Then they get on a band wagon to convince themselves the instrument is as good as a top end version, or maybe if they just mod the pickups it will sound as good as the best.

 

It gets even more difficult when they haven't played a played a top end instrument so they have some basis of comparison and you have a million different clones of the same instrument all of varying qualities, and there's no way to really grade them because some can in fact be as well made as the originals.

 

Back when I was growing up in the 60's you didn't have all the clones. You had maybe a handful of low end junk or major OEM stuff. The differences between the two were like night and day even for a beginner. The junk was pretty much toys sold to children as Christmas gifts, which as it should be. Parents didn't need to buy top end instruments to see if they're kids had a desire to play. Buy something cheap, if they can squeeze some notes out and wanted to stick with it, buy them something better and give them lessons.

 

Because there was a big price gap between the toy stuff and real instruments worth having, It made it harder to settle with something mediocre.

My first few instruments were used, often times with flaws, but definitely playable. You could sell or trade up for something better as you got more cash.

 

Once you became a teen, things changed,, because instruments are status symbols just like anything else. I worked an entire summer in a restaurant washing dishes for about $7 an hour back in the 70's order to save up enough to buy my first Les Paul. That was tough because I had to pay for a car to get there too. Makes you appreciate what you did to buy it too. It gives the instrument Mystical Mojo when you work your rear off to get something.

 

Today, I really don't care what an instruments costs any more. If a kid has some cheap piece of junk or even a second rate clone that plays and can simply smoke the instrument while sounding reasonably good, he's going to earn my respect from his playing, not from what he owns. in the end we are converting intangible emotions into intangible sounds through a physical object. That object may bottleneck some of that transfer, but how much is really lost by not owning the best?

 

Nobody cares what brand of paint brush an artist uses to paint a picture. That kind of stuff only matters to other artists as a status symbol, and if it does matter that much the opinions of those viewing the tools instead of the work really shouldn't mean much. The thing that matters is if the finished paintings. If they are great they could sell well. If that aren't, the tools used don't matter to anyone but the owner who hasn't learned to use them well enough to create fine art.

[mikesr1963]

 

Yes. While a Squier Bullet may not sound as good as a Custom Shop Strat through a Fender Twin, they're going to sound pretty much the same through a practice amp with a small speaker.

Well, in the video they're being played through a Marshall head and cab and a Hughes and Kettner head and cab.

 

The better your amp the better you will sound and plugging into a small practice amp there is more difference there than with a higher end amp and I can say that from experience. You can eq and higher end guitar to sound worse but you'll hit a wall with a a bullet that prevents you from taking it to higher sound quality. Playing in jam with distortion hides it even more because it will dissolve in the mix.

[mikesr1963]

 

I'd like to think that we have more respect for our readers than to resort to something like that. We're certainly interested in giving readers content they're interested in reading about, but not vacuous non-articles designed solely to capture eyeballs and manipulate people into getting all worked up.

 

Like Ancient Mariner said, that sort of thing can be entertaining in a way, but I have limited time - I'd rather spend it on writing about stuff that will actually help people, and that will hopefully prove to be useful or educational for them.

 

 

Actually, you would show me more respect if you were to plug one of each into a Fender Blues Jr. with no pedals and actually show me the difference with each pickup and each in each switch position and showing were pots actually start and stop working. Because in reality nothing is a bigger smack in the face than having someone say continuously you get what you pay for without an honest to goodness test. No where on the planet are demonstrations more biased than in the world of guitar equipment.

[ComingApart]

cheap guitars sell more than expensive ones, period. If it gets more people comfortable with lower end guitars, the more they sell. When I was young, any source of validation about my meager beginner gear boosted my confidence. My freind had an AM standard, i had a MIK Squier II, but see jeff healey on a magazine with his Squier logo visible on his headstock was a big deal for me and maybe me feel more confident about my gear. Childish thinking of course, but I was a child at the time.

[pekelnik]

I like their videos and I can imagine them being a great source of information and motivation to play for me 15 years ago. Sure, you can't make 1000 videos so informative you'll get a Pulitzer for each, but I find them very honest and truthful and their comparisons and blind-tests and so on seem very honest and often informative. (For instance see the 4 random strats blind test.) If you haven't had the opportunity to play tons of guitars, they definitely give you a lot of information.

[doublecross]

Well if you figure in these dorks need to make a living one way or another, and this pointless video paid their rent this month? I don't give a flying Rattsass, If you cant tell a good guitar from a bad one that's your problem

[Mikeo]

You would have made a fortune washing dishes at $7/ hr back the. Since the mini wage back them was probably about 2.50-3.00 dollars per hour.

 

My uncle got me a job on construction in 1980 and I was making about 6 bucks and hour.

 

I did get the point in full, all in all.

 

At the end of that summer, before heading out to college. I bought Gibson SG Standard. I still have the guitar. Later that fall I bought a used Fender Strat, which I also still have. I paid about $450 for the SG and $300 for the Strat.

 

Before the SG and the Strat I pretty much had junk, not fit to gig with.

 

 

The difference between a good guitar and junk back then, was night and day.

[hellion_213]

They did one with a low end guitar, high end amp vs a high end guitar and low end amp. They've also done several 'How to gig under.....' videos with budget line amps, guitars, and pedals.

[hellion_213]

Those are all worthwhile concerns, but not concerns that some of us can have and still be able to afford to play. I just simply cannot afford Japanese ESPs, USA Fenders/Gibson's, or what have you. My wallet says -MIK, MIM, MII, and MIC for guitars.

[hellion_213]

Depends on what you're doing. A player who never leaves the bedroom, and only jams at low volumes, and occasionally records into a PC doesn't really need an ENGL Powerball or Diezel. For that, a MG Marshall or Peavey Vypyr is perfectly acceptable.

[hellion_213]

Two quick thoughts

1. I have owned higher end guitars than I currently have, but actually preferred the ones I have now, hence why they're gone. And with a Decent pickup swap, no, there is no difference. I'm not arguing wood tone, but a AAAA Maple cap on a mahogany body doesn't do much to improve the tone over a veneer top Mahagony body - it only makes the price go up exponentially. And anymore, the necks on a higher endn import are every bit as nice as anything 'High-End', and that's whats Super Important to me. Other than that, tuners can also be swapped out for a whole lot less than that AAAA top.

2. The $$ you spend doesn't get you what it used to in the past, I.e. the differences aren't as extreme as what they used to be. The days of getting crap unless you hawked your car are over. The difference between a high end import and a higher end Domestic or Japanese (in some cases) are very minimal at best. I'm not going to say that the $125 SX will compete with a Fender Standard, but a Squier Vintage Modified sounds Exceptionally close. This is no different an argument than a Mercedes is better than a Chevrolet simply because it costs more. Well, a Bugatti is more than both, but won't make it a year without tens of thousands in maintenance, and a Corvette is/was faster than a Lamborghini -

[hellion_213]

Have to agree - Their videos are simply brilliant - informative, entertaining, and sometimes motivational.

[soundcreation]

There are always ways to work around that.

 

Used is the first and most obvious one. Buying used keeps you away from supporting stuff that might be in question.

 

And I'm not saying this is you but....

 

How many people who play MII or MIC have like 5 to 10 of them?

 

It's a choice right? People with multiple "cheap" guitars could have bought one MIA/MIJ guitar. Especially if they bought the MIA/MIJ used as well.

[hellion_213]

Yep, that is me right there, dead on the money. I could have the MIA/MIJ instead of the several MIKs, etc that I do. And I have had several, but the sale of one MIA can buy two or more of the other imports, hence why I no longer have said MIA product. But man it's hard to justify the difference in $$ when the tonal differences just aren't there anymore. The stuff coming out of Korea is just simply fantastic, even Indonesia and certain Chinese factories. I get what you're saying though, and can try and work that in to future decisions.