Overwound Strat Pickups.

[gardo]

Is more really better ? Not accordingto Roger Mayer,

Although Hendrix used a custom string gauge, Mayer certainly didn't mess with the stock pickups in his Strats. He didn't feel the need.

"When I was working for the government, we had access to certain kinds of equipment. We were encouraged to have a hobby, so I went through all the different number of turns you could have on a pickup very quickly, right from square one. I wound up a whole range of pickups.

"Basically, what became very apparent with pickups is exactly what I thought before we started: They really don't make much difference! I would say they're one of the most vastly overrated parts of the guitar itself. If you understand electronics, you understand that as the inductance of the pickup increases — that is, as the number of turns on the pickup increases — all that happens is you get a larger output, and you effectively get less high-frequency response due to the fact that the inductance of the pickups rises. It's a trade-off.

"And after making several experiments, which probably covered all the number of pickup turns that are available now, I came to the conclusion that Leo probably had it about right! There wasn't much to be gained by deviating from the 7,000 turns or so on a regular pickup."

 

here's the complete article if anyone is interested

http://www.guitarworld.com/node/11678

[WRGKMC]

Is more really better

 

Too many turns or two few turns can be bad. The key item here is targeting the amps input impedance to obtain the best fidelity vs signal strength. Having a wide frequency response and good signal strength used to be the focus of manufacturers when they first designed electric guitars and amps. Even Leo Fender designed his amps to have good fidelity, but that changed when the first guy pushed the amp and speaker into saturation on a recording and had a hit song with that sound.

 

Bad fidelity today is considered good tone so many people have become lost in the whole debate over science vs preference. Pickups are only one of the factors in the amplification chain and its up to the individual which pickups are ideal for their use.

 

Two main items in pickups are inductance vs magnetic strength. Both are responsible for signal strength and fidelity.

 

You can get a stringer output by increasing the magnet strength or by increasing the inductance adding winds.

You can also weaken the output by decreasing the magnet strength or the inductance.

 

The physical width of the pickup has an effect on tone. A wide pickup will pick up a wider cross section of the string vibration and have a stronger output then a more focused a narrow pickup. Magnet flux concentration is another item. Single poles stood upright vs a magnet laid on its side so the strings see the side flux of both poles will sound different.

 

The two big ones are the magnet strength and inductance though. More winds increases signal strength but the Q factor rises sharply in the process. Q is an EQ peak. If the Q is high the peak is sharp like a mountain in the midrange frequencies and has very little high and low frequency response, just midrange, like a wah pedal produces.

 

Low inductance pickups have less winds and lower gain. These pickups have a low Q peak. The response is more like a small hill in the mids and the pickups produce more high and lows. Many vintage pickups have a lower Q and produce higher fidelity.

 

For some reason either manufacturers have pushed the high Q pickups as being better or inexperienced players have thought this and manufacturers have responded by increased sales. Problem is with a High Q pickup, all you have left is the magnet strength to play with to maintain fidelity. Companies like Seymour and Duncan pretty much have it down to a science. They can increase winds for higher output, play with the permeability of the core and magnet strength to vary the Q to reduce mids and keep a high output.

 

An amp or pedals input impedance and gain staging is going to affect the fidelity too. If the pickup impedance is too high or too low for the amp its going to shift the volume gain and EQ ranges on the amp and you may loose the ability to dial up a wide range of tones and be severally limited to the tones you can get.

 

If I were to guess, 50% or more amateur guitarists sufferer for poor tone based on impedance mismatches. On top of that they are lead by other amateurs to think more is better and wind up making their problems worse installing hotter pickups, using hotter gain boxes and using hotter amps. In reality they are narrowing their gain/tone down to a very limited range.

 

 

[knotty]

 

Too many turns or two few turns can be bad. The key item here is targeting the amps input impedance to obtain the best fidelity vs signal strength. Having a wide frequency response and good signal strength used to be the focus of manufacturers when they first designed electric guitars and amps. Even Leo Fender designed his amps to have good fidelity, but that changed when the first guy pushed the amp and speaker into saturation on a recording and had a hit song with that sound.

 

Bad fidelity today is considered good tone so many people have become lost in the whole debate over science vs preference. Pickups are only one of the factors in the amplification chain and its up to the individual which pickups are ideal for their use.

 

Two main items in pickups are inductance vs magnetic strength. Both are responsible for signal strength and fidelity.

 

You can get a stringer output by increasing the magnet strength or by increasing the inductance adding winds.

You can also weaken the output by decreasing the magnet strength or the inductance.

 

The physical width of the pickup has an effect on tone. A wide pickup will pick up a wider cross section of the string vibration and have a stronger output then a more focused a narrow pickup. Magnet flux concentration is another item. Single poles stood upright vs a magnet laid on its side so the strings see the side flux of both poles will sound different.

 

The two big ones are the magnet strength and inductance though. More winds increases signal strength but the Q factor rises sharply in the process. Q is an EQ peak. If the Q is high the peak is sharp like a mountain in the midrange frequencies and has very little high and low frequency response, just midrange, like a wah pedal produces.

 

Low inductance pickups have less winds and lower gain. These pickups have a low Q peak. The response is more like a small hill in the mids and the pickups produce more high and lows. Many vintage pickups have a lower Q and produce higher fidelity.

 

For some reason either manufacturers have pushed the high Q pickups as being better or inexperienced players have thought this and manufacturers have responded by increased sales. Problem is with a High Q pickup, all you have left is the magnet strength to play with to maintain fidelity. Companies like Seymour and Duncan pretty much have it down to a science. They can increase winds for higher output, play with the permeability of the core and magnet strength to vary the Q to reduce mids and keep a high output.

 

An amp or pedals input impedance and gain staging is going to affect the fidelity too. If the pickup impedance is too high or too low for the amp its going to shift the volume gain and EQ ranges on the amp and you may loose the ability to dial up a wide range of tones and be severally limited to the tones you can get.

 

If I were to guess, 50% or more amateur guitarists sufferer for poor tone based on impedance mismatches. On top of that they are lead by other amateurs to think more is better and wind up making their problems worse installing hotter pickups, using hotter gain boxes and using hotter amps. In reality they are narrowing their gain/tone down to a very limited range.

 

 

You have stated on here before, quite categorically, that pickups can in NO way affect the tone of a guitar. So what gives, as apparently now they can?,

[AJ6stringsting]

I personally love a higher k ohms factor in the bridge position of traditional Strat. To some of us ( myself included), we enjoy more bass and mids in the bridge position. I like the bridge pickup to be some where between 9.5k ohms or 13.7k ohms.

Sometimes, having a pickup below 7k ohms in the bridge position, is too much treble.

[jtr654]

I like lower K pickups they start clean. Than you can through boost or preamp get the sustain you want. It's easier to get a clean pickup to sustain than get a powerful to clean up.

[Juicy Elk Man]

"If you understand electronics, you understand that as the inductance of the pickup increases — that is, as the number of turns on the pickup increases — all that happens is you get a larger output, and you effectively get less high-frequency response due to the fact that the inductance of the pickups rises. It's a trade-off."

 

A trade-off that worked out nicely for me. But I find you also get a pickup that doesn't sound so thin and lacking in the balls department - more lower mid-range and bass presence. When I switched from low output to high output/overwound pickups the musical testosterone levels went up in a good way, and I didn't have to spend so much time tweaking, trying to dial in certain qualities that the low output pickups lacked - that, in the end, sounded not quite there for my tastes.

[gardo]

I like lower K pickups they start clean. Than you can through boost or preamp get the sustain you want. It's easier to get a clean pickup to sustain than get a powerful to clean up.

 

I'm all about clean vintage tone so it makes sense to me

[WRGKMC]

As I said before, pickups are only one item in the amplification chain. In many cases you can go with hotter pickups and still have plenty of EQ range on the amp left to dial up what you need. You also mention, the target the pickup provides is the tone you want and you don't need the extra range. That mid hump suits your needs but there are other ways of achieving the same results. Gain can be boosted and frequency response shaped electronically. It just comes down to how much effort you want to put into shaping the response later in the chain.

[WRGKMC]

Yes. The guitar has its own tone, and that tone is resonated into the strings. This thread has nothing to do with instrument tone in any way. The pickup isn't even part of the instrument. Its part of the amplification gear that is mounted in a guitar for convenience.

[WRGKMC]

 

You have stated on here before, quite categorically, that pickups can in NO way affect the tone of a guitar. So what gives, as apparently now they can?,

 

 

You don't seem to understand the differences between the definition of mechanical acoustic tone and the slang term used in electronics.

Tone is a much older word that came about to describe acoustical sound many thousands of years before electronics were invented. The term was borrowed by a manufacturer to describe the effects of filtering. The problem is, like may words, Tone has various meanings and you have to keep words in context, not pull them out of context like you have to play gotcha. A game invented by trolls.

 

Tone tōn/ noun noun: tone; plural noun: tones; noun: whole tone; plural noun: wholes tone; noun: muscle tone; plural noun: muscles tone

 

1. 1.a musical or vocal sound with reference to its pitch, quality, and strength.
   "the piano tone appears monochrome or lacking in warmth"
   [TABLE=class: vk_gy vk_tbl]
   [TR]
   [TD]synonyms:[/TD]
   [TD]timbre, sound, sound quality, voice, voice quality, color, tonality "the tone of the tuba"
    
    
   [/TD]
   [/TR]
   [/TABLE]
   
   • a modulation of the voice expressing a particular feeling or mood.
     "a firm tone of voice"
     
   • a musical note, warble, or other sound used as a particular signal on a telephone or answering machine.
     [TABLE=class: vk_gy vk_tbl]
     [TR]
     [TD]synonyms:[/TD]
     [TD]note, signal, beep, bleep "a dial tone"
      
      
     [/TD]
     [/TR]
     [/TABLE]
     

[*] 2. the general character or attitude of a place, piece of writing, situation, etc.

"trust her to lower the tone of the conversation"

• informal
  an atmosphere of respectability or class.
  "they don't feel he gives the place tone"
  

[*] 3. Phonetics

(in some languages, such as Chinese) a particular pitch pattern on a syllable used to make semantic distinctions.

• Phonetics
  (in some languages, such as English) intonation on a word or phrase used to add functional meaning.
  

[*] 4. a basic interval in classical Western music, equal to two semitones and separating, for example, the first and second notes of an ordinary scale (such as C and D, or E and F sharp); a major second or whole step.

[*] 5. the particular quality of brightness, deepness, or hue of a tint or shade of a color.

"an attractive color that is even in tone and texture"

[TABLE=class: vk_gy vk_tbl]

[TR]

[TD]synonyms:[/TD]

[TD]shade, color, hue, tint, tinge "tones of burgundy and firebrick red"

 

 

[/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

• the general effect of color or of light and shade in a picture.
  
• a slight degree of difference in the intensity of a color.
  

[*] 6. the normal level of firmness or slight contraction in a resting muscle.

• Physiology
  the normal level of activity in a nerve fiber.
  

 

verb verb: tone; 3rd person present: tones; past tense: toned; past participle: toned; gerund or present participle: toning

 

1. 1. give greater strength or firmness to (the body or a part of it).
   "exercise tones up the muscles"
   
   • (of a muscle or bodily part) became stronger or firmer.
     

[*] 2. harmonize with (something) in terms of color.

"the rich orange color of the wood tones beautifully with the yellow roses"

 

 

Definition of Electronic tone controls.

 

A tone control circuit is an electronic circuit that consists of a network of filters which modify the signal before it is fed to speakers, headphones or recording devices by way of an amplifier.

 

 

 

 

 

Pickups do not synthesize instrument tone, as I've said a thousand time here before. All it can do is convert the string vibrations into an electrical signal. That's where you seem to get completely lost. A wire isnt hollow, it carries electrons. You can do things with those electrons that have nothing to do with the original tone of the instrument. The EQing effect of pickups can modify the original tone when you're putting them in context with others.

 

Unless you're going to use digital techniques and resampling, the one thing about pickups is they CAN NOT and DO NOT synthesize new string vibrations. They can only fail to produce a flat frequency response.

 

Because pickups are inductive they have built in frequency response curves. This is NOT instrument tone. This is Frequency filtering and shaping. People don't always understanding the difference between the two. What happens in the instrument is mechanical acoustics. What happens in a wire appears to be similar, and even many of the formulas used in the two different sciences are often used, but electrical energy and mechanical energy are not the same thing.

 

Once you convert mechanical energy to electrical energy you're dealing with a whole different set of variables. Unfortunately, many of the terms like "Tone" are also used to describe what occurs electronically. The problem is the term doesn't accurately describe what's actually happening any more then it does when you're talking about color tone in a painting.

 

You have to adapt your understanding of the term by understanding the context properly.

 

Tone in acoustics deals with resonance and overtones timber etc. Its something that affects the ears directly. Tone in electronics is normally used as a substitute word for Frequency response, frequency filtering, equalization. The term is actually improperly used ever since some guy stuck the word Tone on a low pass filter on some radio or amp.

 

The reason it was called tone is because it was something that gave people a mental image of what the knob did. It did not accurately describe what the control actually did. The knob doesn't change "tone" it changes frequency response.

 

What you have seem to have an issue understanding the difference between mechanical tone and electrical equalization. I don't blame you for this, I probably misuse the term just as much as anyone else does. We have limited words to describe many things that occur in these sciences. Tone covers some of the nebulous ideals involved.

 

If your misunderstanding leads you to think I've improperly used the word, that's my fault and I'd be happy to more accurately define the differences between the two. I do have a firm understanding in both sciences and believe I can help you with an honest misunderstanding on the differences.

 

I don't think this is the case however. Judging other posts you've made I think you do know the differences and are just looking to stir up an argument. I recognize when someone is trying to bait me into such an argument and given your history, I know it simply leads to you changing the subject and ending in personal assaults.

 

I will therefore leave you with what I've posted here for others to decide who is the aggressor and who is playing word games.

 

Again, pickups will shape the tonal response of the string based on the amount of inductance. Gain is based on magnetic strength. Pickups do not synthesize new frequencies that didn't exist in the string to begin with. If anything, they have inherent limitations and limited ability to reproduce a flat response.

 

They aren't the only transducers however. There many others like crystals, piezoelectric which use mechanical pressure to generate a voltage and optical transducers that use light to detect physical movement and can produce extremely flat signal responses. They aren't used as much on electric guitars because people have been conditioned to hearing poor quality electric guitar sound reproduction and artists have been conditioned to use a wide range of those low fidelity signals producing their art.

[knotty]

 

 

You don't seem to understand the differences between the definition of mechanical acoustic tone and the slang term used in electronics.

Tone is a much older word that came about to describe acoustical sound many thousands of years before electronics were invented. The term was borrowed by a manufacturer to describe the effects of filtering. The prob1lem is, like may words, Tone has various meanings and you have to keep words in context, not pull them out of context like you have to play gotcha. A game invented by trolls.

 

Tone tōn/ noun noun: tone; plural noun: tones; noun: whole tone; plural noun: wholes tone; noun: muscle tone; plural noun: muscles tone

1. 1.a musical or vocal sound with reference to its pitch, quality, and strength.
   "the piano tone appears monochrome or lacking in warmth" [TABLE=class: wysiwyg_table_vk_gy wysiwyg_table_vk_tbl]
   [TR]
   [TD]synonyms:[/TD]
   [TD]timbre, sound, sound quality, voice, voice quality, color, tonality "the tone of the tuba"
   [/TD]
   [/TR]
   [/TABLE]
   
   • a modulation of the voice expressing a particular feeling or mood.
     "a firm tone of voice"
     
   • a musical note, warble, or other sound used as a particular signal on a telephone or answering machine. [TABLE=class: wysiwyg_table_vk_gy wysiwyg_table_vk_tbl]
     [TR]
     [TD]synonyms:[/TD]
     [TD]note, signal, beep, bleep "a dial tone"
     [/TD]
     [/TR]
     [/TABLE]
     

[*]2. the general character or attitude of a place, piece of writing, situation, etc.

"trust her to lower the tone of the conversation"

• informal
  an atmosphere of respectability or class.
  "they don't feel he gives the place tone"
  

[*]3. Phonetics

(in some languages, such as Chinese) a particular pitch pattern on a syllable used to make semantic distinctions.

• Phonetics
  (in some languages, such as English) intonation on a word or phrase used to add functional meaning.
  

[*]4. a basic interval in classical Western music, equal to two semitones and separating, for example, the first and second notes of an ordinary scale (such as C and D, or E and F sharp); a major second or whole step.

[*]5. the particular quality of brightness, deepness, or hue of a tint or shade of a color.

"an attractive color that is even in tone and texture" [TABLE=class: wysiwyg_table_vk_gy wysiwyg_table_vk_tbl]

[TR]

[TD]synonyms:[/TD]

[TD]shade, color, hue, tint, tinge "tones of burgundy and firebrick red"

[/TD]

[/TR]

[/TABLE]

• the general effect of color or of light and shade in a picture.
  
• a slight degree of difference in the intensity of a color.
  

[*]6. the normal level of firmness or slight contraction in a resting muscle.

• Physiology
  the normal level of activity in a nerve fiber.
  

verb verb: tone; 3rd person present: tones; past tense: toned; past participle: toned; gerund or present participle: toning

1. 1. give greater strength or firmness to (the body or a part of it).
   "exercise tones up the muscles"
   
   • (of a muscle or bodily part) became stronger or firmer.
     

[*]2. harmonize with (something) in terms of color.

"the rich orange color of the wood tones beautifully with the yellow roses"

 

 

Definition of Electronic tone controls.

 

A tone control circuit is an electronic circuit that consists of a network of filters which modify the signal before it is fed to speakers, headphones or recording devices by way of an amplifier.

 

 

 

 

Pickups do not synthesize instrument tone, as I've said a thousand time here before. All it can do is convert the string vibrations into an electrical signal. That's where you seem to get completely lost. A wire isnt hollow, it carries electrons. You can do things with those electrons that have nothing to do with the original tone of the instrument. The EQing effect of pickups can modify the original tone when you're putting them in context with others.

 

Unless you're going to use digital techniques and resampling, the one thing about pickups is they CAN NOT and DO NOT synthesize new string vibrations. They can only fail to produce a flat frequency response.

 

Because pickups are inductive they have built in frequency response curves. This is NOT instrument tone. This is Frequency filtering and shaping. People don't always understanding the difference between the two. What happens in the instrument is mechanical acoustics. What happens in a wire appears to be similar, and even many of the formulas used in the two different sciences are often used, but electrical energy and mechanical energy are not the same thing.

 

Once you convert mechanical energy to electrical energy you're dealing with a whole different set of variables. Unfortunately, many of the terms like "Tone" are also used to describe what occurs electronically. The problem is the term doesn't accurately describe what's actually happening any more then it does when you're talking about color tone in a painting.

 

You have to adapt your understanding of the term by understanding the context properly.

 

Tone in acoustics deals with resonance and overtones timber etc. Its something that affects the ears directly. Tone in electronics is normally used as a substitute word for Frequency response, frequency filtering, equalization. The term is actually improperly used ever since some guy stuck the word Tone on a low pass filter on some radio or amp.

 

The reason it was called tone is because it was something that gave people a mental image of what the knob did. It did not accurately describe what the control actually did. The knob doesn't change "tone" it changes frequency response.

 

What you have seem to have an issue understanding the difference between mechanical tone and electrical equalization. I don't blame you for this, I probably misuse the term just as much as anyone else does. We have limited words to describe many things that occur in these sciences. Tone covers some of the nebulous ideals involved.

 

If your misunderstanding leads you to think I've improperly used the word, that's my fault and I'd be happy to more accurately define the differences between the two. I do have a firm understanding in both sciences and believe I can help you with an honest misunderstanding on the differences.

 

I don't think this is the case however. Judging other posts you've made I think you do know the differences and are just looking to stir up an argument. I recognize when someone is trying to bait me into such an argument and given your history, I know it simply leads to you changing the subject and ending in personal assaults.

 

I will therefore leave you with what I've posted here for others to decide who is the aggressor and who is playing word games.

 

Again, pickups will shape the tonal response of the string based on the amount of inductance. Gain is based on magnetic strength. Pickups do not synthesize new frequencies that didn't exist in the string to begin with. If anything, they have inherent limitations and limited ability to reproduce a flat response.

 

They aren't the only transducers however. There many others like crystals, piezoelectric which use mechanical pressure to generate a voltage and optical transducers that use light to detect physical movement and can produce extremely flat signal responses. They aren't used as much on electric guitars because people have been conditioned to hearing poor quality electric guitar sound reproduction and artists have been conditioned to use a wide range of those low fidelity signals producing their art.

 

I am only refering to your own use of the terminology "tone". In some threads you state that a pickup cannot change the tone but in others threads you say you have changed pickups to make one style of guitar give the same tone as another. This is what I dont understand, and your little lecture and dig above does nothing to explain it.

[gardo]

Now look ,the poor guy is so worked up over this he even posted twice

 

​

[WRGKMC]

 

I am only refering to your own use of the terminology "tone". In some threads you state that a pickup cannot change the tone but in others threads you say you have changed pickups to make one style of guitar give the same tone as another. This is what I dont understand, and your little lecture and dig above does nothing to explain it.

 

Go ahead and try and find a specific example. I guarantee you, you wont be able to find it "Guarantee"

 

You have a reading disability. You see everything from your warped perspective and have no aptitude for understanding facts on these topics. You memory is even tainted by your bias.

The worst part is you probably misunderstood those previous posts and actually think you have a valid point.

 

I do apologize to Gardo and others, for having to waste your time posting the obvious.

 

 

I "Know" knotty fails to comprehend half the stuff I post here. It must be embarrassing to be so ignorant and top it off by making phony accusations based on your false assumptions. Then try to convince others your false assumptions are true.

 

Man you've pulled this lame gag with me nearly a dozen time now and every single time you fail to understand your wrong and even when the facts are clearly pointed out it does no good.

 

You're living in an alternate reality based on hate man. The problem is you're "so" lame at playing that game and don't even come close to convincing others you have any basis for your opinion.

 

Part of the reason is you don't understand the technology, but its also because you have no facts to back up your accusations.

 

You know I actually wish you were right one of these days so I can apologize for being wrong. You "Always" pick the lamest, false arguments you can find when doing this crap. It doesn't even have a shadow of doubt of being false, yet you attempt it.

 

I do apologize for the fact "I" cant believe anyone can be as stupid as that. Not only from a technical comprehension point of view, but you cant even link to the other post you are talking about.

 

I know I can find hundreds of "real" reasons to stir up a debate with others I disagree with, including lame semantics like you have here. Its not that hard when you know something about the topic. But to take stuff out of context that isn't even on topic or close to being on topic just goes to show what kind of person you are.

 

I mean there isn't even any room for doubt, of being wrong in what I've posted and yet you try and link that to something I posted a years ago?

 

By the way I do know what I posted then and I'll stand on every word I posted sight unseen.

 

I posted three clips of three guitars with the same pickups. I pointed out, you can her differences between them with clean signals dialed up. I even posted the Frequency response charts so people could see it visually. Then I posted the same three guitars with driven signals.

 

People clearly heard a difference between clean signals. No one was able to identify the difference between the driven guitars. I even added a third set of clips that used a piezo sensor on the bodies themselves. By the way that was the third time I had done that comparison on this site over the past 10 years or so.

 

None of my statements or opinions in any of those posts has changed.

 

The thing I do remember is you misunderstood those posts and you attempted to pull the same garbage you're pulling today. I'm positive you misunderstood that post, the same way as you misunderstand what I've posted in this one. I suspect you are one of the many who have a false conception of how things work and are unwilling to modify that understanding or have it challenged.

 

That's a shame, because any tech who knows audio will laugh at you like I do. This is kindergarten stuff for guys in my trade. The big problem we have is trying to get guys like you to understand what we're talking about.

 

Sometimes you connect with people, and some times you don't. For those who do get it, they wind up having a little more knowledge to work with. For those you don't, you do the best you can and move on. I'm surely not being paid to train people in my trade.

 

Then there others like you intent on being an ignorant jackass that has no solid foundation for their beliefs. Then when someone does attempt to explain how things work, you get bent out of shape and accuse them of inaccuracies that don't exist.

 

The fact is I've spoken on this topic here at least a hundred times over the years, and never had anyone disagree with the facts, not one Moderator, Engineer, or Tech. You know why? Its because they understood the topic and you haven't got a clue.

 

The fact is, you lack ability to comprehension on the topics and jump to false conclusions.

I've told you this a dozen times now and you still don't get the message. I don't want to have a conversation, with you or about you.

 

Talking to you is like speaking into a dead phone. You aren't here to learn anything, you aren't here to share anything. That leaves us with only one conclusion and it fits you like a glove.

 

Definition: An Internet troll is someone who comes into a discussion and posts comments designed to upset or disrupt the conversation. Often, in fact, it seems like there is no real purpose behind their comments except to upset everyone else involved. Trolls will lie, exaggerate, and offend to get a response.

 

What kind of person would do this? Canadian researchers decided to find out. They conducted two online studies with over 1,200 people, giving personality tests to each subject along with a survey about their Internet commenting behavior. They found evidence that linked trolling personality traits to major psychological issues: Narcissism, Machiavellianism, Psychopathy, and Sadism.

 

Man if that doesn't fit you to a T I don't know what does. You attempt to accuse me of something and provide absolutely no evidence for that accusation?

 

[knotty]

 

Go ahead and try and find a specific example. I guarantee you, you wont be able to find it "Guarantee"

 

You have a reading disability. You see everything from your warped perspective and have no aptitude for understanding facts on these topics.

The worst part is you probably misunderstood my previous posts and actually think you have a valid point. I "Know" you fail to comprehend half the stuff I post here. Then you embarrass yourself making phony accusations based on your false assumptions. Then you try to convince others your false assumptions are true.

 

You know you've done this same thing to me nearly a dozen time now and every single time you have been dead wrong. I point the facts out and clearly point out where you're wrong and it does no good. You're living in an alternate reality based on hate. you never ever have anything good to say and you never ask for clarification. You immediate jump to play the gotcha game.

 

The problem is you're so lame at playing that game Its mainly because you don't understand the technology, but its also because you have no facts to back up your accusations. I actually wish you were right one of these days so I can apologize for being wrong, its just you pick the lamest false arguments you can find when doing this crap.

 

I do apologize for the fact I just cant believe anyone and be that stupid. I can find hundreds of reasons to stir up a debate with others I disagree with. Its not that hard when you know something about the topic. But to take stuff out of context, then lie to others about what someone said said? Then fail to provide any proof of those accusations? Man that really shows a people your true reflection?

 

So once again, I tag you what you are, and Internet Troll.

 

Definition: An Internet troll is someone who comes into a discussion and posts comments designed to upset or disrupt the conversation. Often, in fact, it seems like there is no real purpose behind their comments except to upset everyone else involved. Trolls will lie, exaggerate, and offend to get a response.

 

What kind of person would do this? Canadian researchers decided to find out. They conducted two online studies with over 1,200 people, giving personality tests to each subject along with a survey about their Internet commenting behavior. They found evidence that linked trolling personality traits to major psychological issues: Narcissism, Machiavellianism, Psychopathy, and Sadism.

 

Man if that doesn't fit you to a T I don't know what does. You attempt to accuse me of something and provide absolutely no evidence for that accusation?

 

 

I havent read all that crap but I will cut and paste the quotes i am referring to. In the meantime I suggest you take your pills and sit in a darkened room. Your selective memory is showing.

[knotty]

Wrkego 8 may 2015

 

The pickup is no more responsible for tone then a microphone is for the tone of the voice.

 

Wrkego 20 may 2015

 

The hollowness of the Casino is a much lighter, more touch sensitive sound. The Dot is much thicker tone but I have swapped pickups around in both enough times where I can pretty much match the tones and touch of both.

 

 

[WRGKMC]

Wrkego 8 may 2015

 

The pickup is no more responsible for tone then a microphone is for the tone of the voice.

 

Wrkego 20 may 2015

 

The hollowness of the Casino is a much lighter, more touch sensitive sound. The Dot is much thicker tone but I have swapped pickups around in both enough times where I can pretty much match the tones and touch of both.

 

 

This is the proof? Post links you jackass.

 

Both of these statements are 100% accurate when read within context.

 

The first I'm talking about acoustic tone generation. Pickups don't generate acoustic tone. They can color it when improperly wound and their inductance modifies the frequency response. That's the exact same thing I'm talking about in this thread you dim whit.

 

The second case is even a better example. It talks about coloring the acoustic tone using pickup equalization. Again that's the exact same thing I'm talking about in this thread.

 

You obviously don't understand the difference between acoustic tone "generation" and frequency tone "coloration". They are "not" the same thing but the same word can be substituted to describe both.

 

You truly don't know the word can have dual meanings. You have to understand both uses of the word to be able to understand when one or the other is being used within context.

 

You must have a horrible handicap with your vocabulary if its so limited you cant understand when a person is using the term in one context or the other. That's not my problem however, its yours. I cant help you if you don't understand words can have multiple meanings, especially slang terms you don't find in the dictionary.

 

You obviously seem to think tone generation and tone coloration are the same thing. That's your reading comprehension issue, not my failure to associate the terms correctly.

 

The components that "Generate acoustic tone" are mainly wood, plastic, steel, glue and finishes.

The components that "convert acoustic tone" into electronic waves are Transducers

The components that "modify wave frequencies" are tagged as "tone circuits" made of Coils and Caps

(They don't actually change acoustic tone. They change the amplitude of the frequency responses)

 

Pickups have a dual effect on the signal. They transform mechanical energy into electrical energy AND their coils can color the frequencies if they are improperly wound to do that.

 

I have no idea where your lack of comprehension is, nor do I care why it exists.

 

You're an ignorant man and you shouldn't be using my words to confirm that to others. Its not my fault you cant understand proper uses of words and I don't enjoy exposing your ignorance to others so just leave my posts alone in the future.

[gardo]

 

[knotty]

 

This is the proof? Man this truly shows you haven't got a clue to what you're talking about.

 

First off, You're pulling words out of context. Post links you jackass.

 

Second, If you're going to use "My" words to make a point. You better be dam sure you're able to explain why those statements are wrong.

 

Both of these are accurate statements when read within context.

 

I can describe things in unlimited ways using different words and still end up making the exact same point. In fact I rarely ever use the same words twice, to explain the exact same concepts. You find this confusing for some reason.

 

What I'm describing doesn't change. How I describe it is never the same. You see I understand the concepts and can choose to use any words at my disposal to describe the same thing from hundreds of different angles. I do this not only to break the monotony of repeating myself but to also enlighten others to understand those concepts from more then one view.

 

I learned this long ago when I was a teacher. I'd describe things by the book and get that dead phone thing happening. So I'd explain it using different analogies, different words and different views. Eventually students would find one of those descriptions that made sense to them understand the point I was making.

 

I was never once in those 6 years of teaching of intentionally misleading others to false conclusions. That kind of makes you have to provide the burden or proof I have and you failed terribly at your first attempt. I'll explain why

 

By the way, If anyone else here can understands this guys beef, could you please intercede and attempt to explain it to me. He's unable to explain his point technically and I'm having to guess what he's actually trying to say.

 

There's nothing wrong with the way I used those words, nor is there anything contradictory. You obviously don't understand that. I know you don't or you wouldn't be making yourself to look like such a fool. You don't understand the word "tone" can have both a specific meaning and a very broad meaning depending on the context the word is being used in.

 

I'd really love to meet the teaches you had growing up because they surely failed teaching you modern English and Science. This isn't your fault, but don't keep making yourself look like an ass blaming your lack of comprehension on others.

 

Again Pickups can color tone that already exists in the strings. They are not the source of musical tone, they mirror it in varying degrees.

 

The pickups can be changed to modify the strings frequency response. What part of that statement don't you understand? What part of it is contradictory? I already know you wont answer that because you don't understand whet I'm talking about.

 

The "slang term" for frequency modification is often called Tone Shaping. Its not accurate by any means. Its a term manufacturers misused coined decades ago just for people like you who don't understand how a low pass filter works. It just became so popular you have to use it with people to be understood. You don't get that but most do.

 

Pickups generate a mirror image of the strings vibrations. This is called trans conductance.

 

The specific issue with inductive pickups their response can vary with inductance from being nearly a perfect 1:1 mirror image of the string vibration, (Tone) to having boosted and and/or attenuated amplitudes at specific frequencies. (Boosted tones)

 

You need to separate the differences here between musical Tone and Frequency shaping (Electronic tone) You may think they are the same but are not. You also need to understand the topic well enough to know when people are using the term loosely and when they are being specific. This seems to be one of your biggest problems. You have a really big hang up expanding your vocabulary. Electronics is relatively new science and uses allot of slang by amateurs to describe things.

 

People are inventing new words to describe how things work in technology all the time, especially in digital and computing. Dictionaries are slow to incorporate those new words and meanings. They want to be sure its not just a passing phase and the slang terms have become permanent. Tone isn't exactly new. Its been used since at least the 30's to describe a low pass filter. Tone is not a correct term for that but its been abused so long people get a general understanding of its use. Its still not listed in most dictionaries that way I been using it for over 50 years and its still not spelled out in most dictionaries as a high pass filter

 

Words like tone can be used in multiple contexts and mean different things based on that context. Only a complete ignoramus would blame others for their own lack of comprehension and poor command of the English language. .

 

The word tone can have both as specific meaning and a very broad meaning. It all depends on the context you're using that word. It can also be used as a verb like "Adding Tone or Tone shaping"

 

When its used that way, in respect to electronics, its strictly a matter of attenuating existing frequency responses. And yes, You can EQ one guitar to sound very much like another one, something you pulled out of context and failed to understand. You aren't changing the harmonics and other unique details one generates over another. That's all stuff that's in the strings already. you can only filter or boost what's in the strings.

 

Again, pickups cannot invent frequencies that don't occur in the strings. If you don't understand that then you have no business hanging around here bothering people like me who do understand. Pickups are simply a transducer which convert mechanical energy into electrical energy. They do not synthesize waves that don't exist. Nor can they produce frequencies that don't already exist in the strings.

 

That statement right there is where you're missing it all man. "I" don't know how to say it any simpler then that. Its beyond my skill to explain it any clearer to you. Maybe someone else can get through to you but I cant.

 

Yea I probably do need medications for attempting to explain it to a troll but I'm doing it. Where you fail is in your attempt to show others why you fail to understand. You cant do that by attempting to use other peoples words.

 

All your disagreement and misconceptions aren't going to change how things actually work. Granted I may not be the best at explaining it to your satisfaction, but have you ever once asked for clarification of something you didn't understand clearly?

 

Have you ever posted your own interpretation of how things work so others can judge how clear your own understanding on the topic is?. Not that I've ever seen.

 

Your main problem is YOU DONT UNDERSTAND THE DIRFFERENCE BETWEEN MUSICAL TONE AND SIGNAL FREQUENCY MODIFICATION. You lump the two together and think they are the same thing. You can do that in some general statements like I did, but there was no intent there of going beyond a generalized point.

 

On top of that, those statements were directed at someone who understood the difference and understood the point.

 

Fact is you see the pickup as a black box and you project what "You think" it does. You haven't got a clue of how inductance works which only compounds your comprehension issues. I wouldn't even begin to explain it to you. You don't have the aptitude and most of the stuff you're reading and in turn you blame others for that misinterpretation.

 

You blame me because "you" don't understand what I'm talking about when everyone else does? Screw you man. I'm not here to be your teacher. You got a problem with modern English language, don't cry at me because you don't understand what others do.

 

 

 

 

Is there an english version of this nonsense?

 

 

[knotty]

I can describe things in unlimited ways using different words and still end up making the exact same point. In fact I rarely ever use the same words twice, to explain the exact same concepts. You find this confusing for some reason.

 

[knotty]

 

I'd really love to meet the teaches you had growing up because they surely failed teaching you modern English and Science.

 

Read this again and mark yourself out of 10!

[mikesr1963]

I both types and get great sounds from both so shut up and play your {censored}ing guitar man.

[AlamoJoe]

WRGKMC and Knotty. I gotta tell you two, most of the time you guys are talking way over my head. And you argue a LOT. But frankly watching you guys argue, cross swords, and dance around and sometimes right into absolute insult is entertainment money can't buy.

[Juicy Elk Man]

[*BLEEP*]

Is more really better ? Not accordingto Roger Mayer

 

 

Hendrix was a big effects user, so, tweaking the number of winds in his single coils wasn't going to do much for Jimi's fuzz and other effect unit's tones. Actually, Jimi could have benefited THE MOST from a true 5-way pickup selector switch, instead of having to deal with the so-called in-between settings on his standard 3-way pickup selector switch. 5-way blade pickup selector switches for the Strat did not exist until a few years later.

 

 

 

There wasn't much to be gained by deviating from the 7,000 turns or so on a regular pickup."

 

 

The one thing it sounds like he didn't try was a different gauge of magnet wire than the standard 43 gauge. He could of gotten a more bass-y tone from using thicker gauge (lower gauge number) wire in a rewind, using something like 42 gauge, and using close to the same number of winds as 43 gauge.

 

 

 

[gardo]

There may be something to this?