What's The Purpose Of Putting Strings Over The Tailpiece On A LP?

[Bbreaker]

Duane Allman did this.

Reasons?

[batotman]

Can't believe you of all people askin this!

Don't Billy Gibbons and Zakk Wylde do this too?

I've heard sustain but i'm pretty sure its superstition.

[Pepi]

Do a search. There are plenty posts on this.

[Fret Demon]

less stress on the bridge.

suposed more sustain aswell.

[Europa760]

Originally posted by Fret Demon less stress on the bridge. suposed more sustain aswell.

 

 

have bridges been breaking when strung normally?

[chubbycharles]

i dont know about the other guys, but in guitar world zack wylde says he does it bc it prevents string breakage. id also imagine a little more sustain.

[Bbreaker]

Originally posted by batotman Can't believe you of all people askin this! Don't Billy Gibbons and Zakk Wylde do this too? I've heard sustain but i'm pretty sure its superstition.

Why me??
I'm smart.
But not all knowing:rolleyes:

[Europa760]

and strings dont break because of any angle.

they break cuz theyre rubbing on something.

on les pauls, its the sharp edge of the saddle. string breakage has nothing to do with string angles.

[geddins81]

Originally posted by Bbreaker
Duane Allman did this.
Reasons? [/quote

It's been rumored to improve sustain (I can't tell it)...the main reason I do it on all my stoptail guitars is it makes the strings have a bit more of a "slinky" feel to me. I initially did it to check out the sustain theory, also on a particular LP I had at the time, the strings were touching the back side of the bridge. By lowering the tailpiece all the way down, and stringing over the top, I got the strings off the tailpiece (plus, I really like the way it gives my palm a place to rest!)

So basically for me, it's strictly taste and preference....pretty much like everthing.

[cloudnine]

To get the action lower, I would think as well.

[Fret Demon]

Originally posted by Europa760 have bridges been breaking when strung normally?

picture says all

[Bbreaker]

Originally posted by Fret Demon picture says all

Thanks.........I'll give it a go next time I restring one of my Les Pauls.

[Europa760]

interesting. never thought of that middle picture.

[JimboJ]

Those are nice pictures and all, but I just don't buy the increased sustain thing. The vibration from the strings gets transfered into the body of the guitar via the bridge, not the tailpiece.

To me this makes as much sense to me as the theory that a string-through body Tele has more sustain than one that's not string-through.

I really wish an engineer would come on here and put these myths to rest.

[one4rich]

Originally posted by JimboJ Those are nice pictures and all, but I just don't buy the increased sustain thing. The vibration from the strings gets transfered into the body of the guitar via the bridge, not the tailpiece. To me this makes as much sense to me as the theory that a string-through body Tele has more sustain than one that's not string-through. I really wish an engineer would come on here and put these myths to rest.

 

 

You're right about that...the sustain isn't lost by raising the tailpiece. That's a myth.

['56Goldtop]

It's not going to increase sustain, and may actually reduce it.

It will help to prevent the string from rubbing the back of the bridge and reduce string breakage, but you can accomplish the same thing by raising the tailpiece.

[Cackalacky]

I've messed with this considerably.....the only 2 neccesities are that the strings clear the back of the bridge(as per the previous stunning graphic representation ), and the break angle is not so sharp that it "caves in" the radius of the bridge. This happens over time, where a large break angle the bridge saddles start to cave in and/or the bridge assembly starts to tilt back towards the tailpiece. This is why it is important to examine the neck pitch, usually older(kalamazoo) Gibson and new CS's have 4 degrees of pitch consistently, and the tailpiece will *almost* never sit too low(even when screwed against the body to cave in the bridge. Wheras other models vary greatly. Something to look for.

Now in terms of tone and playablity, if you top wrap, you have less tension, and break angle, making it easier to bend. Some people believe that screwing the tailpiece posts flush with the body gives better "coupling" and sustain. This may or may not be true, but it goes to reason the combination of the flush tailpiece, and top wrap may be the best of both worlds.

A little tip if you're going to try this---use an extra loose ball end and thread each string through one. This way the extra ball end acts as a ferrule when coming from the opposite side of the tailpiece. If you don't use this "spacer" , the bend over the tailpiece tends to be right where the string ties into it's ball end, causing a potential breakage problem.

[500Hz]

without getting into who has a clue and who doesn't, the drawing posted above is a great visual that offers pertinent information

top-wrapping alone doesn't increase sustain over normal wrapping with the tailpiece tight to the body

however, having the tailpiece tight to the body might increase sustain over a tailpiece set higher (argument being that it reduces the moment arm of the studs and therefore reduces lateral motion)

...if you want to argue about sustain, use a common denominator


what the drawing indicates is that when the strings touch the back of the bridge, it's necessary to raise the string, which can be accomplished by either raising the tailpiece, or wrapping over the tailpiece

obviously, raising the tailpiece means it's no longer coupled to the body as well, which may or may not affect sustain

what the topwrap will do is provide a different feel due to the lesser break angle over the bridge, again illustrated nicely by the above drawing--my opinion, because i can feel it every time

it also places less downward and forward force on the bridge, the former of which can cause a bridge to fatigue and collapse over time, the latter of which can cause bent bridge posts (talk to some techs that have been around a while, they've usually dealt with this)


for anyone interested in the physics debate over sustain, there is an abundance of information on the internet that applies directly to the topic

[Cackalacky]

Dude 500Hz, were totally in sync.

[500Hz]

Originally posted by Cackalacky Dude 500Hz, were totally in sync.

yeah, it's like we actually tried things out and thought about it or something:D

i posted before seeing your response, or i would've just let yours speak for me

excellent advice with the extra ball-ends btw

[batotman]

Originally posted by Bbreaker Why me?? I'm smart. But not all knowing:rolleyes:

You're being modest!

[Europa760]

less tension eh?

so the guys who top wrap play in a different tuning?

sweet

[metalheadUK]

I top wrap on the guitar I use live. Why? Because I brealk less strings like that.

I have my tailpiece up off the body as well....I have the minimum string break angle over the bridge that I can for the way I play.

Does it feel different......not to me

Does it increase /decrease sustain.......no

What it does do is give me a fighting chance of getting through a gig without a string breaking.....and for me that is a major plus.

[tom_s252]

It does provide a nice place to rest your hand! I topwrap my Epi LP, feels good to me, which is all that matters. It also happens to look nice, I think.

[BootRoots]

like goldtop said, you can avoid rubbing by raising the tailpiece. In my expert opinion;) people do it because they think its cool and someone famous did it.