Having trouble with two guitarists.... Tips?

[NinjaModder]

Well my band has hit a few bumps....

 

Everything was fine because my friend who also plays guitar in my band also is an AMAZING keyboardist since he has been playing since he was 9. But he won't perform live or really at all with his current keyboard since it isn't that great. A 90s or so Casio : Nothing too fancy. He is saving for a nice keyboard but that won't be for a while.

 

So now we will have two guitarists for ALL songs. Which puts a damper on our set list since a few songs relied on his keyboard skills (originals and hit covers such as born to be wild ).

 

Now we are having trouble with two guitarists. There are songs we like but he just doesn't get the second guitar parts down. He just doesn't seem to get into it as much. I am singing and he wants me to play lead. I think he is a much better guitarist than me so I don't feel its right for me to get the two main roles.

 

Now my options are dropping a bunch of songs including a few originals for songs that have two parts in them. OR letting him do the lead to songs and let myself improvise and stuff where he doesn't feel comfortable doing.

 

Any tips??? We have a "gig" coming up soon and we need to get this down quick! He offered to play bass on my basses and amp but I can't let him do that. It wouldn't feel right. He is too good and has too great of equipment to not play guitar! (70s Gibby SG and an ol' Ampeg 2x12)

 

I was originally going to play bass but I have too much guitar stuff and my drummer says I have to play guitar. So as of now we are out a bass player.

[hondro]

don't worry about hogging all the good parts! Do whats best for the song. If that calls for you playing lead and singing or not, whatever makes everyone comfortable and sounding good is most important. There's a lot of emotion in playing and if the other guy isn't comfortable, it'll be reflected in how you guys sound.

 

And have him get that fancy keyboard!

[StevenJM]

when its live and everything is loud, not many people are going to be able to tell between a 20 year old keyboard that only cost $75 and a new nice expensive keyboard.

 

99% of crowds don't know {censored} about gear... tell him to just rock out the casio.

[NinjaModder]

when its live and everything is loud, not many people are going to be able to tell between a 20 year old keyboard that only cost $75 and a new nice expensive keyboard. 99% of crowds don't know {censored} about gear... tell him to just rock out the casio.

 

 

That is what I said!!!! He won't budge from his position though... Practice with him is always a bummer. Me and the drummer gets lots done though. He just needs to believe in his keyboard! I mean it sounds like a carnival sometimes but it can get some semi decent noise.

[mnhhngbfs]

Just play bass yourself temporarily, as guitarists we should all know NEVER listen to the drummer.

[NinjaModder]

Just play bass yourself temporarily, as guitarists we should all know NEVER listen to the drummer.

I don't like to listen to him.... He made up a song in his head so he hummed it to me.... : Took me hours of doodling around to figure out what the hell he was wanting. His humming never changed pitch... Turns out it was an insanely simple scale that just went up and down the same two frets.... I added fuzz and flang and it made him happy... whatever keeps him drummin....


I would love to play bass but I still would like to play guitar. I've invested too much in my guitar stuff to just play bass

[Josh S]

Tell the your dude to pick up a Korg Triton. At this point they are cheap as beans used (we're talking $350-ish) and are still an excellent keyboard.

[Doctor49]

............. Now we are having trouble with two guitarists. There are songs we like but he just doesn't get the second guitar parts down. He just doesn't seem to get into it as much. I am singing and he wants me to play lead. I think he is a much better guitarist than me so I don't feel its right for me to get the two main roles. Now my options are dropping a bunch of songs including a few originals for songs that have two parts in them. OR letting him do the lead to songs and let myself improvise and stuff where he doesn't feel comfortable doing. Any tips??? We have a "gig" coming up soon and we need to get this down quick! He offered to play bass on my basses and amp but I can't let him do that . It wouldn't feel right. He is too good and has too great of equipment to not play guitar! (70s Gibby SG and an ol' Ampeg 2x12) I was originally going to play bass but I have too much guitar stuff and my drummer says I have to play guitar . So as of now we are out a bass player.

 

 

So he wants to play bass, you are telling him he has to play guitar and the drummer is telling you to play guitar? ?

 

Stop it.

 

Play the guitar, let him make what he can out of bass and tell the drummer to play his drums or let him play guitar and you play bass.

[mnhhngbfs]

I would love to play bass but I still would like to play guitar. I've invested too much in my guitar stuff to just play bass

I'm saying just play bass for that upcoming gig, or until you find a bass player, or until your friend gets better keys (i'm assuming he can play bass lines with his left hand a la ray manzarek), not permanently become the bass player of the band.

[NinjaModder]

I'm saying just play bass for that upcoming gig, or until you find a bass player, or until your friend gets better keys (i'm assuming he can play bass lines with his left hand a la ray manzarek), not permanently become the bass player of the band.

 

 

I might just do this. At least until he picks up keys again. He was planning on splitting the keys to play "bass" on some songs. I do have a few bass guitars I would love to show off. I may just pull a McCartney and play bass/acoustic when necessary.

[DaleH]

Tell the drummer if you have to play guitar and not bass, then he has to sing.

[Strenge]

I'm not sure what he considers a "nice keyboard" is, or what his budget is, but here's what I did (I play mostly keys). I had a laptop+softsynths but wanted to use hardware for playing live, but I didn't want to spend tons on hardware when at home I used a laptop--plus I didn't want to drag a super-expensive board into a bar.

 

I first got a used Yamaha Motif (6) for around $600--this alone could cover everything I do, it can do 4-part splits and has acceptable piano/epiano/organ sounds. Synth sounds are a bit limited in number but the ones it has are nice. The action is very good. To beef up my synth power I found a used Virus KB for $620 including a case...and that sucker has one of the nicest keybeds I've ever played, with very very nice sounds. Point being, both these boards are 7-10 years old, but honestly I didn't hear that much from the newer ones that blew me away by comparison--ESPECIALLY considering the price. And, the build quality on many of the new boards just seemed shoddy to me. Of course, while they are quite sturdy the two I bought are quite heavy. That is actually a plus while they are on the stand, but carrying them in their cases (you will want to get cases don't forget) is a bit of a workout for an older back

 

Hope this helps.

[WRGKMC]

Tab everything out, all the part in a score. Then make the players pick a part and stick with it. If they are goung to switch parts mark it down so all know exactly where the changes are going to occur.

 

If you cant get things nailed down that tight, you'll have no chance in pro circuits and will be blown away by the first tight band you come up against. This is not to say you cant jam or have fun mixing it up, theres always time for that later after you're tight and can read each others minds.

 

If you dont get things tight and predictable right up front with hard work and hole eachother accountable for your parts, then theres always going to be unpredictability which makes the band weak and lacking confidence. Mistakes stumbleing over eachother will wind up causing the band to fail and fall appart as soon as youre under pressure.

 

I suggest you have a sit down and have a deep discussion on this. Make notes and have an adjenda and agree on some ground rules. If you want to be competitive you got to have your {censored} wrapped tight. If you're venurable, its a piece of cake for preditors to find that out and make you look like amature goofballs on stage.

 

I Know I can easily blow away any band that isnt tight and doesnt play like a single unit. Its so too easy when you got a supper tight band to give another band the willies. Then they wind up loosing concentration on the audience and start overly focusing on parts they dont have down tight.

[StratGuy22]

Rent a keyboard for gigs, use his for practice.

 

 

[Special J]

Tab everything out, all the part in a score. Then make the players pick a part and stick with it. If they are goung to switch parts mark it down so all know exactly where the changes are going to occur. If you cant get things nailed down that tight, you'll have no chance in pro circuits and will be blown away by the first tight band you come up against. This is not to say you cant jam or have fun mixing it up, theres always time for that later after you're tight and can read each others minds. If you dont get things tight and predictable right up front with hard work and hole eachother accountable for your parts, then theres always going to be unpredictability which makes the band weak and lacking confidence. Mistakes stumbleing over eachother will wind up causing the band to fail and fall appart as soon as youre under pressure. I suggest you have a sit down and have a deep discussion on this. Make notes and have an adjenda and agree on some ground rules. If you want to be competitive you got to have your {censored} wrapped tight. If you're venurable, its a piece of cake for preditors to find that out and make you look like amature goofballs on stage. I Know I can easily blow away any band that isnt tight and doesnt play like a single unit. Its so too easy when you got a supper tight band to give another band the willies. Then they wind up loosing concentration on the audience and start overly focusing on parts they dont have down tight.

 

 

You make gigging sound like a freaking MMA fight. I bet you're no fun to be in a band with.

[benzem]

Unless you like being in a band that kicks ass.

[D Carroll]

Be a cramps cover band.

[WRGKMC]

You make gigging sound like a freaking MMA fight. I bet you're no fun to be in a band with.

 

I dont play out for fun I play out to earn cash. There has to be better reasons that guide you than having fun. What happens when you arent having fun that day, do you play like crap or walk out on gigs lined up? Bad foundation to build a band on in nearly every case because you're building on emotions that change daily. Its not that you have to be an ass, a good attitude is a must in any business where you deal with people and you have to be able to put on a good front even when you arent having a good day. I'm not being paid to entertain my bandmates though, I'm paid to entertain the audience.

 

 

In the first 10 years I did plenty of that as a kid. Anyone who matures like they should eventually turn pro and work with pros. Some dont because they get to that point and see its actually a business that requires you to take on responsibilities towards your coworkers and customers. Then its a simple choice weather you dick around the rest of your life or get serious about your career.

 

After the first 10 years learning the ropes and having fun I spent the following 35 playing and a pro with pros. Its a hard way to earn a living and not a whole lot of time for goofing around. The guys who say they do it to have fun are usually playing as a form of escape, not as a profession. The escapeism usually includes personal problems of law, family, drinking, drugs etc. Any of those can make a player unrelyable and bad for the band at nearly every level.

 

Like any business, and employer pays way better for professionals. My last cover band we earned between $1500-2500 night. You want to play with the pros you have to have your sh!t wrapped tight or forget it. You'll be eaten alive. If the other bands dont push you out of the circuit employers who hire who are usually rough charecters will get the best of you and if you dont have a contract theres nothing stopping them from ripping you off. Pros nail down their parts. Amatures wish they could. Theres enough bozos out there who dont know sh!t from shinola.

 

If you play to have fun, thats absolutely fine, and theres absolutely nothing wrong with that. I just been doing it long enough that its become a lame reason for playing in general because alot of it is just hard ballbusting work and a crowds applayse doesnt pay the bill, and it doesnt haul your equipment and set it up for you every night.

 

Its not like you learn 40 songs and thats it either. You need to learn at least 2~3 songs a month and rotate them through your sets to keep your patrons interested. After you been with a band long enough, you go home do your homework, come back, play it once or twice if you're luckey enough to have some nights off to rehurse, then play them out the next night having it sound as good as anything else. Otherwise its played the first time on the job.

 

In my opinion, you can have just as much fun in a pro band walking home with a wadd of cash in your pocket than you can with pocket change.

 

I realise not everyone has any desire to play pro, so if not speakeing to them. If I come across as asshole for telling you how things really are I apollogize. Its not intentional, its just what happens to you after playing as long as I have. If you want to make it a career, you got to wake up and treat the music business like any other professional business. Have fun when its time for fun, and work when its time to work.

[metallica_00]

If I was in a band where guys didn't have the gear necessary to play their instrument and people were having a hard time figuring out what instrument they even were going to play, I'd probably find a new band.

 

I think the first thing you need is clearly defined roles. It's the most fundamental thing.

[Hubert Stumblin]

So, this guy plays keys, guitar and bass. And he seems to be flexible with the guitar/bass part even if he isn't on keys.

You guys are muscians first and instrumentalists second. So he's a great guitar player. So what? That doesn't preclude him form playing bass and you the guitar. If he's willing to step into the role of bass player for the sake of the band I'd say that's a pretty good idea.

Seems to be the obvious solution.