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Chord based soloing


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I've been using this lately and it gives you a different approach.

 

Been doing it for a couple weeks now over jazz tunes and I'm getting some new lines from it. Can only play slowly so far but it sounds nice in a chord melody type way. Real purty. You need to think of several things at the same time.

 

I'm kind of meshing drop 2 chords, full jazz chords and underlying major scale notes and melody.

 

I have always admired guitarists who can seamlessly combine chords, melody, and improvisation while playing like Kenny Burrell or Joe Pass.

 

:D

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Damn, re-read my post and had some typos there. Oops! Fixed them hopefully.

 

Remember, Mos (Jon already knows this) when you play jazz you are allowed to make all kinds of musical typos and as long as you wear a cool hat and have a serious expression it's all good.

 

But you can't make typos when writing. If you do Sister Winifred will hit you over the head with a three sided ruler. Ouch!

 

But I am so disheartened by the lack of serious responses to my deeply sincere post. The hell with it. I quit. I will never play my guitar again and will now take up the harmonica.

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The master of this approach, of course, was Charlie Christian. If Knopfler is the Daddy, then CC was the great grandaddy. :-) Have you guys read through this resource? http://www.music-open-source.com/source/Charlie-Christian-guitar-method-eBook/fichier/%28ebook%29%20Charlie%20Christian%20-%20Legend%20of%20the%20Jaz%20Guitar.pdf

 

I use chord-shape soloing from time to time, and what I like about it is that it gives you intervals in your playing that you wouldn't typically use when basing your solo off of arpeggios or scale/scale fragments. Drop-2 shapes seem to work real well; because they are 4-note constructs, you can use any of a host of rhythmic motives to play those 4 notes and end strongly on a chord tone. Drop-3s also work, but I find that they are a bit too spread out for my taste.

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I do this a lot, but in blues rather than jazz. I'm not yet up to the mental task of (for example) coughing up an Eb11-5 chord in position 6 within the time allowed by 16th note triads...

 

But I'm starting to get fairly proficient at finding 7th & 9th chord inversions of any key in any position in that manner, which works well for blues.

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I do this a lot, but in blues rather than jazz. I'm not yet up to the mental task of (for example) coughing up an Eb11-5 chord in position 6 within the time allowed by 16th note triads...


But I'm starting to get fairly proficient at finding 7th & 9th chord inversions of any key in any position in that manner, which works well for blues.

 

 

That's pretty much all you need. The chord forms I use are simple, and unless the chart I'm playing on has a lot of specific chord alterations called out, I just simplify to one of {maj7, dom7, min7, min7b5, dim7} and use that shape. After I "state" the tonality with that shape, I just let my ear guide my fingers to other tones, with the aim of nicely connecting to the next chord.

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I wasn't quite sure what you meant to start with by "chord-based soloing". I thought at first you meant chord-melody style (like Joe Pass), playing 2 or more notes at the same time.

But now I'm guessing (from FatJeff's reply at least) that we're talking about basing your single-note lines off chords - chord tones and arps.

 

If so, I've always done this right from the beginning and considered it a no-brainer (no offence, virg! ;)). I never played "scales"; I'd begin by learning the chord progression (these would really simple in the early days of course!), and maybe the melody, and just work with that stuff: embellishing the chord tones with a few passing notes that sounded OK.

Typically I'd end up with what I later found - many years later! - was the major pent of the root (or minor pent if it was a minor chord), plus some bluesy chromatic approach notes - because that was what I heard people on records doing. (People like Chuck Berry, that is, not any of those fancy jazz dudes I'd never heard of back then. First jazz player I copied was Django Reinhardt, and whaddya know, he was doing the same thing.)

 

It wasn't hard, and it sounded right. Scales? Theory? Who needs that s***? :)

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Jon,

 

Chord based soloing is like this:

 

http://www.scribd.com/doc/387675/chord-based-solo

 

FatJeff's Christian site is about this too. Very cool site.

 

All these methods ultimately comeback to the same thing which is playing some combination of the 12 notes available in a melodically pleasing fashion. It's just a different mental approach to navigating.

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Chord based soloing is like this:


http://www.scribd.com/doc/387675/chord-based-solo

Yes, that looks pretty much as I understand it. More advanced than I was doing when I was copping from Chuck, of course :rolleyes: but pretty much the way I play now (and have done for some time now): embellishing chords, playing occasional double or triple stops, and adding passing notes.

Looks quite comforting to see the way I naturally play (after a few decades growing into it) plotted out neatly like that, as if it's a "method"! ;)

 

Damn, if only I'd copyrighted it....

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Dizzy has the style...

 

Yes I was thinking of Dizzy too. Unfortunately not many others can make berets look cool. Some jazz fans combined it with a (shudder) roll-neck jumper... Just missed the point.

 

Miles had the right attitude to fashion. Wayne Shorter tells a couple of stories. When he was first asked to join the band, Miles offered no musical advice; just "You got eyes? See my tailor."

Years later, after Shorter had left Miles and was with Weather Report, he bumped into Miles backstage at a 70s gig. WS (who was wearing the hipster flares of the time) greeted his old friend warmly. All Miles said was "Pull your pants up, mother{censored}er."

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Virg,


What book in particular are you studying from?

 

 

I'm not studying from a book. I'm just taking the chord grips I use normally and combining them with underlying major scale notes. But I already know the chords and scales so that is not a problem.

 

So if the progression is a 2-5-1 I take m7, V7 and M7 grips or subs and just keep messing around playing the chords and notes making good sounds. I use a standard jazz tune and improvise over it or play off the melody. Anything to make good sounds.

 

Chords I use are lots of Drop 2 and some full jazz chords.

 

I use the major scale and also passing tones.

 

A good book for Drop 2 is Chapman's "Drop 2 Concept For Guitar" but of course you can find much on Drop 2 chords on the interwebs.

 

http://www.amazon.com/Mel-Bay-Drop-Concept-Guitar/dp/0786644834?tag=duckduckgo-d-20

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Two things rong with this picture. And what's that hat called? That is the correct jazz hat. Sadly it has come to mean, "The wearer thinks he's THERE and actually sucks."

 

 

The hat is called a beret of course. It has since been adopted by the military of many lands.

 

The combination of beret and hair growth under the lower lip is a standard for jazz hipness and no one was hipper than the Diz.

 

When I was a kid they were known as "beatniks". This was before the term "hippie" was invented.

 

I never understood what "beatnik" meant at the time. B-E-A-T-nik. The "beat". Interesting.

 

I recommend reading Dizzy Gillespies autobiography. He was a unique individual who grew up in some rapidly changing times.

 

Gillespie was known for his excellent music reading ability. He was also a tough hombre in a fight.

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That is a beret! lol. Soldiers wear it sideways - the correct way.

Well, "correct" for soldiers, where the fashion seems to be a lop-sided look: not sideways exactly but flopping over one side.

 

Anyway, since when were soldiers "cool" or "hip"??

 

Unless you count this guy, who did for berets in the 60s what Diz did in the 40s/50s...

15324571815641439.jpg

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The master of this approach, of course, was Charlie Christian. If Knopfler is the Daddy, then CC was the great grandaddy. :-) Have you guys read through this resource?

 

 

Awesome stuff!

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I saw the illustration in the link for chord soloing. It looks on paper nearly identical - in my primitive understanding of paper representations - of what I do. Now I'm confused about the differences between chord-melody and this (new to me ) chord-soloing.

 

If I hold and embellish a chord to produce a melody, then I understand that to be chord-melody. If I hold and embellish the same chords to produce a solo, am I right to call that chord soloing? Is it that simple?

 

I'm an ear-trained player. I'm not a musician. I consider musicians players who can sight read and write scores. I can't do that. So, I imagine what I want to hear and then play it. I really wish I could score what I do if for nothing more than to have it on paper. Old dog, new tricks....there's hope.

 

Anyway, the link is something I recorded (poorly) and if I'm guessing right it's chord-melody and maybe a bit of soloing as well? I'd like to know what description I can best label it because I am genuinely ignorant of all things theoretically and/or conventionally understood by bonafide musicians. Thanks.

 

https://www.box.com/s/bacaa3c9c5a34ac22c0f

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I saw the illustration in the link for chord soloing. It looks on paper nearly identical - in my primitive understanding of paper representations - of what I do. Now I'm confused about the differences between chord-melody and this (new to me ) chord-soloing.


If I hold and embellish a chord to produce a melody, then I understand that to be chord-melody. If I hold and embellish the same chords to produce a solo, am I right to call that chord soloing? Is it that simple?


I'm an ear-trained player. I'm not a musician. I consider musicians players who can sight read and write scores. I can't do that. So, I imagine what I want to hear and then play it. I really wish I could score what I do if for nothing more than to have it on paper. Old dog, new tricks....there's hope.


Anyway, the link is something I recorded (poorly) and if I'm guessing right it's chord-melody and maybe a bit of soloing as well? I'd like to know what description I can best label it because I am genuinely ignorant of all things theoretically and/or conventionally understood by bonafide musicians. Thanks.


 

 

I liked your playing!

 

Chord melody generally features chords played on strong beats with the melody note as the highest note in the voicing. Not always though. Chord based soloing could be based around the melody or depart completely from it and might not include playing any chords, just chord tones, arpeggios and other notes.

 

So chord melody definitely includes the playing of chords. Chord based soloing may or may not include playing of chords.

 

I don't think Hendrix could read music notation. Would you consider him a "musician"? I would. I doubt Louie Armstrong could read music notation either. Was he a musician? I think so.

 

Chord based soloing is just basing your improvisation around chord shapes as opposed to a scale centered approach mainly used by rock and blues guitarists. Of course it is never purely one or the other. There are only 12 notes! It is a kind of mental gymnastics. You visualize the chords shape on the fretboard and play notes of the chord and non-chord notes.

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