Members elctmist Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 It sometimes gets on my tits to hear people going on and on about what a great band Led Zeppelin were. This is one of those nights. If Zep were anything they were mainly a great cover band, so much of their first four albums were taken, uncredited from other artists. Yet somehow they got away with it. You want some examples? Sure. "Babe I'm Gonna Leave You" - A folk song by Anne Bredon, this was originally credited as "traditional, arranged by Jimmy Page," then "words and music by Jimmy Page," and then, following legal action, "Bredon/Page/Plant.""Black Mountain Side" - uncredited version of a traditional folk tune previously recorded by Bert Jansch."Bring It On Home" - the first section is an uncredited cover of the Willie Dixon tune."Communication Breakdown" - apparently derived from Eddie Cochran's "Nervous Breakdown.""Custard Pie" - uncredited cover of Bukka White's "Shake 'Em On Down," with lyrics from Sleepy John Estes's "Drop Down Daddy.""Dazed And Confused" - uncredited cover of the Jake Holmes song (see The Above Ground Sound Of Jake Holmes)."Hats Off To (Roy) Harper" - uncredited version of Bukka White's "Shake 'Em On Down.""How Many More Times" - Part one is an uncredited cover of the Howlin' Wolf song (available on numerous compilations). Part two is an uncredited cover of Albert King's "The Hunter.""In My Time Of Dying" - uncredited cover of the traditional song (as heard on Bob Dylan's debut)."The Lemon Song" - uncredited cover of Howlin' Wolf's "Killing Floor" - Wolf's publisher sued Zeppelin in the early 70s and settled out of court."Moby Dick" - written and first recorded by Sleepy John Estes under the title "The Girl I Love," and later covered by Bobby Parker."Nobody's Fault But Mine" - uncredited cover of the Blind Willie Johnson blues."Since I've Been Lovin' You" - lyrics are the same as Moby Grape's "Never," though the music isn't similar."Stairway To Heaven" - the main guitar line is apparently from "Taurus" by Spirit."White Summer" - uncredited cover of Davey Graham's "She Moved Through The Fair.""Whole Lotta Love" - lyrics are from the Willie Dixon blues "You Need Love." Source: http://www.warr.org/zep.html#Thieves Further reading: The strange saga of dazed and confused:http://www.turnmeondeadman.net/Zep/DazedAndConfused.html And a lengthy discourse on Page's plagarisms:http://www.furious.com/perfect/jimmypage.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bucket_brigadier Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 same thing could be said about the beatles and the stones. i must admit, however, that generally enjoy listening to their stuff more than what they ripped off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ginnboonmiller Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 You've got to admit, though -- they stole the hell out of those tunes. I never thought of Zep as a great songwriting band. Four really terrific musicians that really jived well together for a while, and apparently when on to suck royally without each other. Ask me again tomorrow, though, and I'll agree with you completely. Don't what it is with them, but I run hot and cold on a minute-by-minute basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members elctmist Posted October 14, 2005 Author Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by lou_weed same thing could be said about the beatles and the stones. i must admit, however, that generally enjoy listening to their stuff more than what they ripped off. Nah, cos the Beatles and the Stones (except for "Love In Vain") always credited their covers. Led Zep didn't. And if the idea of ripping off elderly bluesmen isn't offensive enough, how about Page's wholesale lift of "dazed and confused" from little known contemporary NYC songwriter Jake Holmes. How did George Harrison get nailed for "My Sweet Lord" and Zep get away largely scott-free? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bunnicula Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 First how do you credit a traditional song? Second they covered blues songs. Everyone does. Big deal. They made them better. Third. Jimmy asked the band who wrote the stairway intro if he could use it. They said yes. Many songs were leftover from the yardbirds. I don't expect too much originality from a session guitarist. But his influence cannot be overlooked. He doesn't care about lyrics apparently. Neither do I. He just wanted to rock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blaghaus Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Zep rock, I'll forgive them a lot of sins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members elctmist Posted October 14, 2005 Author Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by ginnboonmiller You've got to admit, though -- they stole the hell out of those tunes. Not debating how they played them, just that they should really be known as the world's greatest cover band. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Demented Avenger Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Last night you were pissing on Floyd, tonight Zep, WTF? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ginnboonmiller Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by Jakeowen Last night you were pissing on Floyd, tonight Zep, WTF? While I'll defend Zep as another fine example of racist cultural imperialism (Original Dixieland Jazz Band and Paul Simon round out the trinity), I have to say, it's a lot of fun watching classic rock heads squirm when their idols get killed. That's why I keep these bumped, anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members elctmist Posted October 14, 2005 Author Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by bunnicula Second they covered blues songs. Everyone does. Big deal. They made them better. I'm sure some of the money might have come in handy for the elderly people that wrote them, or their families. Or what about the guy that wrote "Dazed and Confused?" This is what I mean. Why should Zep get a pass on this? They were English rock artistocracy that used their legal might to keep these cases out of court. Is it any wonder that Page was happy to work with P.Diddy? He knew what sampling was, he'd been doing it for years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members elctmist Posted October 14, 2005 Author Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by Jakeowen Last night you were pissing on Floyd, tonight Zep, WTF? I'm cranky. And why the hell not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members elctmist Posted October 14, 2005 Author Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by blaghaus Zep rock, I'll forgive them a lot of sins. How would you feel if they had been your songs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bunnicula Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by elctmist I'm sure some of the money might have come in handy for the elderly people that wrote them, or their families. Or what about the guy that wrote "Dazed and Confused?"This is what I mean. Why should Zep get a pass on this? They were English rock artistocracy that used their legal might to keep these cases out of court.Is it any wonder that Page was happy to work with P.Diddy? He knew what sampling was, he'd been doing it for years. Good point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blaghaus Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by elctmist How would you feel if they had been your songs? if they did one of my songs and it made me want to shag the nearest thing with a pulse, I'd thank them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members elctmist Posted October 14, 2005 Author Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by bunnicula First how do you credit a traditional song Evidently written and arranged by Page/Plant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members elctmist Posted October 14, 2005 Author Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by blaghaus if they did one of my songs and it made me want to shag the nearest thing with a pulse, I'd thank them. Even though it would have been credited to them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ginnboonmiller Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by blaghaus if they did one of my songs and it made me want to shag the nearest thing with a pulse, I'd thank them. See, I'd sue them first; then I'd thank them. Then I'd buy dinner with the royalties I had earned and had to sue for. Then I'd get on the phone, call them, and thank them again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blaghaus Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by elctmist Even though it would have been credited to them? I'd have spewed my load, why would I worry about credit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blaghaus Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by ginnboonmiller See, I'd sue them first; then I'd thank them. Then I'd buy dinner with the royalties I had earned and had to sue for. Then I'd get on the phone, call them, and thank them again. I'd sue them, then thank them, then put on the version of my tune, then shag the nearest thing with a pulse, then thank them, then have a smoke, then sleep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members elctmist Posted October 14, 2005 Author Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by ginnboonmiller See, I'd sue them first; then I'd thank them. Then I'd buy dinner with the royalties I had earned and had to sue for. Then I'd get on the phone, call them, and thank them again. People tried this throughout the seventies and eighties, they got crushed by monster lawyers. Dazed and Confused still isn't credited to its proper author. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Demented Avenger Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Artists of all kinds have been borrowing from each otherforever. It is not like Zep invented it. Rock was still pretty new at the time, they just took it in the direction they did, and it opened doors for a lot of other artists, who in turn borrow from them. You better not be sayin' anything bad about Jerry tommorrow! CAAAAAAAN YOOOOOOU DIIIIIG IIIIIIIT! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members blaghaus Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by elctmist People tried this throughout the seventies and eighties, they got crushed by monster lawyers.Dazed and Confused still isn't credited to its proper author. I'd shag the monster lawyer. Then sleep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ginnboonmiller Posted October 14, 2005 Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by Jakeowen You better not be sayin' anything bad about Jerry tommorrow! I'll take this one tomorrow if you don't want it, Dan. I've got lots of practice at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members elctmist Posted October 14, 2005 Author Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by Jakeowen Artists of all kinds have been borrowing from each otherforever. It is not like Zep invented it. They perfected it though. "When The Leeve Breaks" was written by Memphis Minnie in the early 30s, so why was it credited solely to them until later CD issues of their albums? I'm not saying they're a terrible band, it just seems somewhat distasteful that they made so much money off their arrangements of other people's song. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members elctmist Posted October 14, 2005 Author Members Share Posted October 14, 2005 Originally posted by ginnboonmiller I'll take this one tomorrow if you don't want it, Dan. I've got lots of practice at it. You go for it... I wouldn't be on solid footing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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