Members Meowy Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 I understand the objective pros and cons of each, but when it comes down to it, which set of trade-offs works best for you, and why? I have found that because I do more experimentation than anything with fuzz and boosters that perf gives me the most flexibility. Of course this makes for a very tedius build that is very difficult to alter. Sure, I could socket everything that has the potential to be changed out, but I think too many sockets looks clumsy and compromises reliability. Ideally, I would love to find pre-made PCBs that are laid out to use bias trimmers instead of fixed resistors. As a workaround I could use boards like these with an off-board pot, but sometimes I would prefer to have a set and forget option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members imbuedblue Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 I use solderless breadboard for experimentation, and then make the final circuits on veroboard or PCB. These days, though, I'm doing more vero than anything else so I can spend more quality time with my kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Meowy Posted October 15, 2010 Author Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 Yes, I should have mentioned I do my initial layout on a breadboard. But once I have the circuit, I still may want to take some time (a few weeks) to try different value components in a more permanent format. I find that keeping a build on a breadboard that long especially with offboard components hanging off is very awkward and is very subject to faults, shorts, etc from getting jiggled around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SnorkelMonkey Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 When I build effects pedals I usually breadboard an unknown first and then go about either making a PCB board or whatever options are best for my needs once I've found what works for me. I'm not constantly fiddling with values once its finished being tested on breadboard. If I were it would be counterproductive building a finished board only to add or remove part of a circuit or what have you? At that point you might as well throw the whole thing in the garbage unless you want to meticulously unsolder every part? Guitar amps are another story... I like to build using turret board construction. There are so many amps have similar design traits that it's cool to be able to swap in a few modifications to test drive what would then be a different amp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members joeyowen Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 i dont give a {censored} about the thread but i {censored}ing looove your avatar :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members macadood Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 sharcat! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members macadood Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 and speaking of which, wheres a good place to order perf board, veroboard or breadboard? and what exactly is the difference between the three? sorry i am a noob trying to get into pedal building more and want to order some but dont quite see how they are all different Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Meowy Posted October 15, 2010 Author Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 and speaking of which, wheres a good place to order perf board, veroboard or breadboard?and what exactly is the difference between the three?sorry i am a noob trying to get into pedal building more and want to order some but dont quite see how they are all different For the "what's the difference", question, here's a good place to start (don't miss the chart at the end of the article) http://geofex.com/Article_Folders/protostyles/proto_styles.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members soulsonic Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 strip board is nice for small simple circuits, but the layouts get ridiculously big when it's a complex circuit. I always preferred plain unclad perfboard for simple stuff that wasn't too crazy to hand-wire. The most complex thing I've done on perf board was probably my Noiseswash. Generally, I prefer an etched pcb most of the time, especially since I've been using alot of SMD lately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members macadood Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 sooo...wheres a good place to buy some strip/perf/vero board? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members soulsonic Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 Many of the online DIY shops like Smallbear have stripboard, and I've bought stripboard from Mouser before (Vector brand... nice stuff!). Plain perfboard, I've usually bought at Radio Shack because almost all of them carry it and it's cheap enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Meowy Posted October 15, 2010 Author Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 sooo...wheres a good place to buy some strip/perf/vero board? If you are impatient and don't mind paying a little more, Radio Shack If you want dirt cheap and can wait for a slloooow delivery http://www.futurlec.com/index.shtml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members IvIark Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 I bought some big sheets of vero from here and just cut it down to size. Their prices work out cheap even with the transatlantic postage. It took a while to get to the UK but should be quicker for the US customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ben_allison Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 p2p is a headache for anything more than a simple fuzz, and even then, things end up just looking like a hair ball. vero is OK if you have a good layout and are meticulous about cutting tracing/making sure there are no unintentional solder bridges, it can be just great. pcb all the way if you can. {censored} stays clean, and will probably be more reliable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Chugs Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 Perf is good for one off projects and prototypes as you can easily layout an idea, after bread boarding, out and modify it afterwards. With vero, once you done a layout it is more difficult to modify it afterwards. Vero is good if you are building more than though one as it faster than Perf. PCB would be good but my girlfriend doesn't like the idea of chemicals in the house... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members macadood Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 ok, so call me a noob but can someone explain to me this: say you got a stripboard like this, how does the signall pass through each of the components? do you simply solder 2 adjoint holes together? cuz from the top it appears like every component is separate and on an island... and i dont understand what the point of those just yellow lengths of wire going up and down the board. what the hell do they do?? they dont seem to be doing anything does someone have a pic of the bottome of a stripboard? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members IvIark Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 If it's vero, there's rows of copper behind each hole, if it's perf then you have to make the connections yourself with the component leads or wire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members IvIark Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 ... and that looks like a layout from a book called Audio Amplifier Projects. They're all laid out like that for some reason with vero about 5 times bigger than it needs to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nbabmf Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 I prefer PCBs for speed of assembly, but there is something Zen-like about building on perfboard. Vero is somewhere in between. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tape Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 a lot of people like stripboards, but they are noisy as hell. noise can jump all those tracks. same reason breadboards are noisy my projects are too complex for anything other than PCBs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members macadood Posted October 15, 2010 Members Share Posted October 15, 2010 your projects are siiiick i still gotta get something from a fellow canadian sometime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members IvIark Posted October 16, 2010 Members Share Posted October 16, 2010 Got to disagree with you there tape. There's nothing inherently noisy about stripboard that will give it a disadvantage compared to PCB tracks next to one another. And complex PCBs now tend to have tracks over the top of each other as well, not just side by side. A well designed stripboard layout can be just as quiet as a well designed PCB layout but without the advantage of complete control of where the tracks ultimately lie. But then it's a case of choosing the best form for the task at hand. I wouldn't use vero for a big circuit, especially some of the things you build, simply because you'd need a box like a paving slab to house it in. By the same token, I wouldn't want to use a compact PCB layout for a Fuzz Face. The reason breadboards are noisy is because the connections are poor. I've often breadboarded a circuit and got oscillation which I know won't be present when I've soldered it up on vero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Faldoe Posted October 16, 2010 Members Share Posted October 16, 2010 interesting. Most of the pedals I've built have been on Vero - cause the layouts I found were Vero layouts. Some turned out fine, many others never worked - I've botched quite a few. I built a few on perf and those always seemed to work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Saturnine10 Posted October 16, 2010 Members Share Posted October 16, 2010 I think it would be sweet to make a circular PTP fuzz or something Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members the_bleeding Posted October 16, 2010 Members Share Posted October 16, 2010 turrets, perf, pcb. Whatever man. I care more about the tradeoffs of cost between ease of use. PCBs are easy to use and organize but only if theyre cheap and easy to make and on the other hand, turrets are easy to use, but a bitch to construct and organize. In the end, all you want is ismplicity at a low cost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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