Need Advice on Possibly Shady Deal

[SonicExplorer]

Hi,

 

I just purchased a Kemper Profiler Amp from a big online retailer and from the start the sales person tried to sell me on a demo unit. By the end of the call I made it clear I wanted nothing to do with a demo and wanted factory sealed new. He agreed to a price, not far from where he was trying to hook me on the demo, and I made it very clear again (and also in email) that this sale is for factory new sealed item. Well, the very day my order shipped the demo unit suddenly disappears from their web site. So as you can imagine, given the facts and circumstances there is a very good likelihood I am getting that demo unit. The sad part is, the return policy states they will deduct ALL shipping charges from the refund. We can bet if they did try and dupe me they will continue to insist the item is new no matter how much evidence may be to the contrary.

 

What is the suggested strategy in a situation like this? I paid with a credit card, and the item is still in transit. Delivery refusal is still an option.

 

Thanks for any help,

 

Sonic

[WRGKMC]

You have a virgin gear syndrome haunting you. You need to understand what's causing it and get over it. This syndrome is the result of having grown up in a capitalistic society. Salesmen earn a living by making people dependent on that syndrome, and it takes some redirection of thought to break out of its grip.

 

Just because you get a piece of gear is in a factory sealed box doesn't mean its superior in any way, nor is it untouched by human hands.

 

There's nothing magical or mystical that occurs in a factory, in fact many who build the gear are unskilled laborers in foreign lands. You need to look past the box wrapper and focus on what's in the box. So long as the gear is 100% functional and has no wear of any kind, its still 100% new. With many products like car dealers, they in fact need to check the vehicle when it comes in from the factory and do many things to prep it for sale. In my business selling office equipment, we have to unbox everything and assemble all the individual components, install software, and test the equipment's functionality before it can be delivered. That surely doesn't make the gear less virgin.

 

On small stuff we ship it boxed and let the customer unbox it. That doesn't make the gear better or worse. In fact we have a higher failure rate with those then we do when we unbox and check the gear because it weeds out the duds coming in from the factory.

 

I realize there's a possibility you may have gotten something that's been opened, but you have no reason to be alarmed unless you actually find some fault with the gear. If you do have a dud you can call them a give them an ear full. That risk can occur whether the gear is factory sealed or not. Rough transportation is where most damage to electronic gear occurs. You should see what UPS, FedEx and the US mail does to packages. I suggest you wait till you get the gear and check it before drumming up a conspiracy theory. So long as the gear works like it should you should be fine.

 

The dealer may have dropped the product like because its not being manufactured any more this year, or simply has too few sales to keep them in stock. One of the last things you should worry about is store employees being allowed to use new stock. I been in the electronic business for 40 years and its just not tolerated by companies exactly for the reason you've posted. Customers are hung up on the virgin syndrome and pay top dollar to maintain that false illusion in their minds. Man there is nothing virgin in this world. Its all been touched by man in one way or another so get over it.

[SonicExplorer]

This isn't virgin gear syndrome and we aren't talking about a $300 guitar. This is a $2K piece of recording gear. Who knows if it was sold and then returned (subjected to shipping abuse both direction) or dropped or tweaked by hundreds of hands on a sales floor and then cleaned up, etc. There is no telling what it has been subjected to and IMO nobody should buy something like that unless they have money to burn and can afford having it crap out randomly. Especially on a piece of recording gear that is not easily serviceable (so to speak) here in the US. If I was a spoiled wealthy brat tweaking around in his bedroom for fun it may not matter so much but I can't afford to drop nearly $2K on something that I will be relying upon only to later run into issues.

 

[1001gear]

[uSER=103821]WRGKMC[/uSER]

 

True but used aint new. Matter of trust/paranoia/claivoyance/paranoia/ and trust. 'Sides maybe since he was all warmed up pushing the demo, maybe he sold it. ?

[daddymack]

I would contact them before the unit arrives. I would state in no uncertain terms that you paid for a brand new, unopened amp and have written back-up. If they can't verify that you have a new unit, you demand that they ship you one immediately and issue a call tag at their expense for the unit in question. If they are a reputable retailer, they will do this, and likely reprimand or fire the salesperson who tried to bait and switch you, if indeed that is what happened.

 

I often use the Google 'guaranty' for online orders if it is offered, so if there is anything at all in question, they stand behind me.

 

To WRGKMC, I have to say, WRONG. He ordered a new unit, and he deserves a new unit. This is an expensive 'boutique' amp and he wants to get what he paid for. Demos can have damage and likely have been stressed by ignorant fools who want to push units to the max, knowing they aren't going to do that to the one they ultimately buy.

I buy used and demo amps, and I know what I am getting, and I accept that there may be flaws...but the units are 'broken' in, and as long as they still sound good, I like getting the lower price.

[t_e_l_e]

why did you order there if the saleperson seemed shady you? did he offer a to good to be true price for it?

there is not only one online dealer which has kemper amps, i would have gone somewhere else

[Radar-Love]

I just purchased a Kemper Profiler Amp from a big online retailer and from the start the sales person tried to sell me on a demo unit.

 

 

 

In this situation, I would be a bit more paranoid if I was dealing with small retailer than a large retailer.

 

As for the demo unit disappearing from the website, it is entirely possible someone else bought the demo unit. Aren't these Kemper amps still a hot commodity? Getting "a deal" on one of these units -- even if it's a demo unit -- is a fairly uncommon occurrence. Correct?

 

 

 

[SonicExplorer]

The larger online retailers would actually be more prone to having demos due to their return policies that people sometimes abuse. When I initially looked around a few of the major online retailers had demo units for sale. So based on that narrow experience I can only conclude that availability of demo units is somewhat common. And they are only discounted $150 or so. Which is why they maybe sit around? Anyway, I have no idea who in their right mind would pay nearly $2K for something that was used (possible abused) just to save 5 or 10 percent.

[Chris Loeffler]

I wouldn't stress it. If it arrives and looks like it was opened, you can call them and complain and they will make it right. Maybe it will be obviously sealed and virgin... someone could have purchased it around the same time.

 

Point is, you have a right (and the backing) to expect what you requested, but right now you're worrying about something that could happen, when you will actually be able to verify once it arrives.

 

[Tomm Williams]

I wouldn't stress it. If it arrives and looks like it was opened, you can call them and complain and they will make it right. Maybe it will be obviously sealed and virgin... someone could have purchased it around the same time.

 

Point is, you have a right (and the backing) to expect what you requested, but right now you're worrying about something that could happen, when you will actually be able to verify once it arrives.

 

Correct...... You're worried about something that hasn't happened yet and might not. Deal with it as the facts become clear to you.

[Phil O'Keefe]

I wouldn't stress it. If it arrives and looks like it was opened, you can call them and complain and they will make it right. Maybe it will be obviously sealed and virgin... someone could have purchased it around the same time.

 

Point is, you have a right (and the backing) to expect what you requested, but right now you're worrying about something that could happen, when you will actually be able to verify once it arrives.

 

This.

 

Just the same, make sure you take lots of pics (or a video) as you're opening the box so you can show that it was previously opened, if indeed that turns out to be the case.

 

 

[SonicExplorer]

It finally arrived and there's a number of potential warning signs.

 

The box has slightly smaller staples on top than bottom, meaning it could have been re-boxed. The mfr sticker with serial# on the end of the box is peeling away quite a bit on one corner. Only one power cable was included (US). The laminated cover of the manual has signs of wear in the lower right front corner (which is exactly where it sits in the left palm of your hand when reading) to the point where it is even separating. And the chicken head knob on the front of the unit is black (which seems to have been replaced in production by a silver knob about a year ago?)

 

Still trying to research things but slow progress getting answers.

 

It would be quite helpful if anybody still has their original Kemper box handy and is willing to check something. Please PM me. (The lunchbox style not the rack)

 

Many thanks,

 

Sonic