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  • Mustang II 59 Bassman out of phase - any way to fix?

    Last week I snagged a Mustang II, for use as a practice amp, and for gigs in small venues. The price and weight is appealing (my Fender Pro Reverb is over 60lbs). I play a Gibson ES175D, and split the signal between the PA and the amp.

    Just used the Mustang last evening and noticed the 59 Bassman preset is out of phase with the PA signal; the other presets were fine.

    ? Is there a way to change the phase on that preset?

    Anyone else noticed this?
    <div class="signaturecontainer">mmm... Yes, that sounds good!</div>

  • #2
    Where and how do you split the signal?
    Maybe just mic the amp.

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    • #3
      Isn't that amp a modeler? How can one model be out of phase with the others (which is implied by your comments)? It seems more likely that your set up is the cause.
      <div class="signaturecontainer"><a href="http://www.youtube.com/user/12stringdreams" target="_blank">My YouTube Channel -- Videos From Shows I Have Attended</a></div>

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      • #4
        Yes, it's a modeler - hence, they can do anything with the 'circuitry' (if you can call it that) they want. It's really really obvious that preset is out of phase - the rest not. It is the best example I've ever experienced - would be great in a class situation: "this is what one speaker being out of phase with the others sounds like."

        Anyway... I wonder if the Bassman amps were 180 from natural phase, and they simply modeled it that way... hmmm...
        <div class="signaturecontainer">mmm... Yes, that sounds good!</div>

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        • #5
          Yes, it's a modeler - hence, they can do anything with the 'circuitry' (if you can call it that) they want. It's really really obvious that preset is out of phase - the rest not. It is the best example I've ever experienced - would be great in a class situation: "this is what one speaker being out of phase with the others sounds like."

          Anyway... I wonder if the Bassman amps were 180 from natural phase, and they simply modeled it that way... hmmm...

          If you go into Fuse the software that comes with the amp you can change everything , axis etc.
          If you dont have it you can dl it off Fenders site.
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          • #6
            Yes, it's a modeler - hence, they can do anything with the 'circuitry' (if you can call it that) they want. It's really really obvious that preset is out of phase - the rest not. It is the best example I've ever experienced - would be great in a class situation: "this is what one speaker being out of phase with the others sounds like."

            Anyway... I wonder if the Bassman amps were 180 from natural phase, and they simply modeled it that way... hmmm...

            Yeah, I understand -- I have a background in signal processing. I'm just having a hard time seeing why the presets would behave as described. I don't see why the amp sim designers would do something like that intentionally, particularly since an amp sim does not have to be - and usually are not - a literal simulation of the circuit to do its job. But there must be something going on in the model because your posts imply that the other presets do not exhibit this issue when run through the same hardware rig.

            At any rate, for something to be out of phase there must be a point of reference. Change one or the other. More details on how and where you are splitting the signal would interesting.
            <div class="signaturecontainer"><a href="http://www.youtube.com/user/12stringdreams" target="_blank">My YouTube Channel -- Videos From Shows I Have Attended</a></div>

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            • #7
              You should get teh klops
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              • #8
                You should get teh klops


                Beat me to it!
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                <img src="images/misc/quote_icon.png" alt="Quote" /> Originally Posted by <strong>nightflameauto</strong>
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                <img src="images/misc/quote_icon.png" alt="Quote" /> Originally Posted by <strong>nightflameauto</strong>
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                • #9


                  just for fun:

                  <div class="signaturecontainer"><a href="http://i1322.photobucket.com/albums/u561/sleewell/y-1.jpg" target="_blank">strat</a> <a href="http://i1322.photobucket.com/albums/u561/sleewell/adg.jpg" target="_blank">strat</a> <a href="http://i1322.photobucket.com/albums/u561/sleewell/photo-21.jpg" target="_blank">tele</a> <a href="http://i1322.photobucket.com/albums/u561/sleewell/prs.jpg" target="_blank">PRS</a> <a href="http://i1322.photobucket.com/albums/u561/sleewell/4asdfasd.jpg" target="_blank">agile</a> <a href="http://i1322.photobucket.com/albums/u561/sleewell/photo-11.jpg" target="_blank">gretsch</a> <a href="http://i1322.photobucket.com/albums/u561/sleewell/martin.jpg" target="_blank">martin</a><br />
                  <br />
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                  <br />
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                  <br />
                  Good Transactions: Dehumanize, Jimosity, Panther King, Vangkm, Ejendres, Killindux, Colejustesen, SDMFVan, twisty571, dolf</div>

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                  • #10
                    have you tried moving your amp?
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                    • #11
                      Perhaps I'm jumping the gun on the phasing issue, as I have not made any scientific measurements - would be very interesting to do, however; would let me know if I'm right on, or if someone's been slipping something in my coffee. That, combined with the fact I've only used this on 2 gigs: the first simply noticed the 59 setting didn't sound right - the second "seemed to me" like an obvious out of phase patch...

                      Wow, if it was an open back amp, I could turn it around - but it's not.

                      Signal chain? 58' 175D into Cutec Stereo Chorus - one leg to amp (Fender Pro Reverb since I bought it in 79 - 'till late) Other leg to AD202, then to mixer...

                      I've wondered about phasing in the chorus box (which I seldom turn on), but the fact remains: the patches on the mustang 'react' much like my PR, except the 59 preset: It sucks all life and tone right out of the space...

                      Well enough for now. It would be interesting to measure the phenomenon - as well as try some more 'hands on' experiments - If I discover anything of interest, I'll post
                      <div class="signaturecontainer">mmm... Yes, that sounds good!</div>

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                      • #12
                        It sounds like you're running the amp direct into the PA.
                        Why not just mic it, then the signal at the PA will always be in phase with the amp signal.

                        If you're already mic'ing the amp, then what you're describing is not possible, and the issue is coming from another source.
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                        • #13
                          I'm using the 'chorus box' as a splitter, and running one signal to the amp, and the other into a Ibanez AD202, then on to the mixer... Mostly solo act, so I enjoy the big bottom I get through the pa - the amp adds some bight and texture.
                          <div class="signaturecontainer">mmm... Yes, that sounds good!</div>

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