Members mystixboi1 Posted January 11, 2005 Members Share Posted January 11, 2005 i'm thinking of getting a veritcal 2 x 12 for my bogner xtc... is this a good idea or no? what are people's experience with mesa cabs? please let me know. thanks!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mesa Paulcaster Posted January 11, 2005 Members Share Posted January 11, 2005 I got 2 4x12s and they are both very solidly built. I've cranked my head before, and they seem to be noise/rattle free, which is great for recording. Definitely road-worthy construction wise. Way more solid feeling than the Marshall cabs I've seen. In terms of options, I think they offer more sizes and custom colors and materials than most companies as well. Finally, according to the regional sales manager for the midwest, they are still using US (actually, British made I think) made Celestion speakers, and refused to substitute the Chinese ones. If this is still true, then it should be a pretty important factor to consider...this was as of 5 months ago when I ordered thou.... Sorry to sound like a fricken Mesa rep. I'm not I swear! It just happens to be the rig I own.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Nutter Posted January 11, 2005 Members Share Posted January 11, 2005 They are the heaviest thing. Ever. That said, they also sound wonderful. I run an El Diablo head through a Mesa 2x12 rectifier cab and the difference in sound compared with my Marshall 2x12 1936 is amazing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman967 Posted January 11, 2005 Members Share Posted January 11, 2005 Hello, I would agree with the other posts that MESA cabs are built well and they have a custom shop approach to all their instruments. I have put other makers cab's side to side with the MESA and usually there is no comparison with a few exceptions. The sound is good but not great. Versatile but not really good for anyone one style of music which is a bummer to me. If you want a really tight jackhammer metal tone look elsewhere. I'm not sure if it's the speakers or what but they just don't have the fast response. Cleans have alot of resonance however. For fast articulate palm mutes try VHT in my opinion. For alternative rock the mesa excels. Obviously this is only my opinion and maybe some haven't had these problems with the cabs but all I can say is I tried everything I could to tighten up my sound with them and it wouldn't happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Hell Bites Posted January 11, 2005 Members Share Posted January 11, 2005 Wha!? Mesa cabs not good for metal!? Are you serious? I always read elsewhere that they were perfect for metal, especially thrash.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mesa Paulcaster Posted January 11, 2005 Members Share Posted January 11, 2005 Originally posted by guitarman967 If you want a really tight jackhammer metal tone look elsewhere. I'm not sure if it's the speakers or what but they just don't have the fast response. . .I can say is I tried everything I could to tighten up my sound with them and it wouldn't happen. Which cab where you playing through? If it was a Roadking or Recto, those are oversized and tend to accentuate the low mids and bass. As I said before, they make smaller cabs that give a more traditional, high-mids sound which some people might prefer. This might not even matter so much in a 2x12 configuration, which is smaller to begin with. Also, how loud were you playing and where were you standing with respect to the speakers? The oversized cabs tighten up a lot as you get louder, and the only time I've noticed any muddiness was when I was off to the side of the speakers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman967 Posted January 12, 2005 Members Share Posted January 12, 2005 Hey Paulcaster I think everything you said is correct from what I've found. I am using the oversized and the tradional smaller cabs are tighter sounding and would be great cabs if they didn't have v30's in them. I hate those speakers. I didn't know that the cabs tighten up as you get louder and thank-you for the tip. I wasn't playing the cab at bedroom levels however as I would expect them not to perform up to snuff at that range. I have difinitely experienced the boomy-ness you describe when standing to the side of the cab. I hate this, not even my Marshall 1960 cab suffered from this. When your right in front of the cab it sounds defined and you can hear all the frequencies but as soon as you take a step or two to the side it sounds muffled and bass heavy. I assume that running in stereo would help if not eliminate this and I assume this is what the pro touring guys have going on. For the average guy who just spent $800+ for a cab though it's kinda dissapointing. I'm not saying this is a horrible cab I'm just comparing the cab to others in it's price range and I think MESA gets a free pass alot of the time because of the name and the range of artists that have used them. You don't hear alot about the Pittbull Fatbottom and it blows the MESA away for tightness and cutting through in a band. Just some thoughts I wanted to share for anyone that wants to buy MESA just a default move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman967 Posted January 12, 2005 Members Share Posted January 12, 2005 Yeah I'm not sure how they would tighten up either since it doesn't make sense logically, but it doesn't hurt to get it a whirl and I will leave some results. Hey paulcaster how loud we talking? Oh yeah mark me down for muddy in the bass also. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mesa Paulcaster Posted January 12, 2005 Members Share Posted January 12, 2005 Obviously, the comments about amount of bass have a lot to do with all the other equipment you are using and how you EQ everything. The room you play in has a huge effect as well. I've got the Roadking head which has a gain, channel volume, and master output. I use the channel volume maxed out on the clean channel, the channel volumes on the other 3 channels match channel 1 volume wise (so now everything is as loud as possible, but still balanced across the 4 channels) and then turned up the master volume at least 1/2 way up.....um, I have very forgiving neighbors.... The reason I suggested turning up is because with a lot of higher power heads, they sound really bassy at low volumes, and only start cutting at higher volumes....maybe it's the head that's tighening up and not the cab. But it seems to me the oversized Mesas were designed to produce more bass than the average cab at any volume, so if you don't like that sound, go with the traditional size. I'd love to eventually get a traditional 4x12 loaded with greenbacks. I'm not a metal player, so I'm not doing super fast, palm muted riffs or anything. I like a deep "whoomp" more than a metalic "chunk" if that makes any sense. As for farting out, I haven't noticed that at all... So you guys both think cabs get flubbier as the volume goes up? I've always felt speakers operate at an optimal volume, where all frequencies are coming through as best as they possibly can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman967 Posted January 12, 2005 Members Share Posted January 12, 2005 Very well said Paulcaster and again I would agree with everything you said. I liked my Mesa cab more when I wasn't trying to do the fast palm mutes. It does have whoop that's for sure. I think your right that it is indeed the head since the cab is really only translating that sound through the speakers. the 25watt greenbacks would probably contribute more to the sound than the V30's in this regard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SuperPA Posted January 12, 2005 Members Share Posted January 12, 2005 If you don't like v30's (which I don't) i think you can contact Mesa and order/sub Custom 90's for the 30's. 90's FWIW, RAWK!!! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tubebury/KT88 Posted January 12, 2005 Members Share Posted January 12, 2005 I only have had a Rectoverb widebody combo (great cab tone, but kinda so-so on amp tone there) and a Mesa 1 x 12" widebody 3/4 back cab with a Celestion Black Shadow 90 that just kills. I dumped the rectoverb, kept the widebody cab for small gigs, etc. With a 50 or 100 watt head, that thing sounds almost as good as a tight 4 x 12. Brian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarman967 Posted January 12, 2005 Members Share Posted January 12, 2005 Hey SuperPA I agree the 90's are the way to go. I don't know why MESA stopped using them in there 412's but I've heard conflicting reports. Most popular is that they decided to cash in on the v30's that were outselling everything else and the tone of the cabs have suffered a little since. Some people like the speakers but I think they're very mediocre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Hell Bites Posted January 17, 2005 Members Share Posted January 17, 2005 So is the general consensus that VHT's are the tightest sounding? Or is it pretty close between the VHT and Mesa traditional? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sordid1 Posted January 17, 2005 Members Share Posted January 17, 2005 Originally posted by PRMike The cabs don't tighten up with volume, unles you mean you'e barely running your amp (like volume 1 maybe) Than you need to turn it up. The over sized cabs tend to be muddy and will even fart with too much bass. I was a huge mesa cab fan until I got my Krank and their cabs make Mesa cabs laughable. I agree that the Krank cabs are great but they too are oversized so I don't think that is the reason they sound better than the Mesa's (if that is your opinion of course), it probably has more to do with the speakers they use which are emminence. I have never heard a Mesa cab fart out before, if one is it's probably becasue it needs tightening not becasue of cab design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sordid1 Posted January 18, 2005 Members Share Posted January 18, 2005 Prmike, I don't know why you even bother to post on here since everyone thinks you're an asshole and doesn't respect your opinion whatsoever. And I realize you say you don't work for Krank, but all signs seem to point to the fact that you do. Why don't you do us all a favor and eat {censored} and die mother{censored}er. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SFW Posted January 18, 2005 Members Share Posted January 18, 2005 VHT cabs kick ass. That said, I really like the Mesa cabs. If you are going the 2x12 route, you might consider the G-Flex. It cuts very well, as well as having some massive bottom end thump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sordid1 Posted January 18, 2005 Members Share Posted January 18, 2005 yeah because anyone that is busy doing this for a "living" has nothing but time on their hands so they could post on a board a lot. I guess if I thought where I was posting was just full of kids that didn't know what they were talking about and 30 year old burnouts I probably wouldn't waste my time posting there. As far as the solid wood thing I can see where that would make a little difference, but it wouldn't make a cab sound tighter and not fart out. The amount of resonance you would get from solid wood as opposed to plywood isn't huge and especially when you're talking about how much air is being pushed from these speakers. If your theory was correct than home speaker manufacturer's wouldn't use particle board or plywood and would use solid woods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PRMike Posted January 18, 2005 Members Share Posted January 18, 2005 not really...home theaters reproduce sound they don't look for tone..wood adds a tone. Companies also don't use it cause it costs them more...if there isn't a big deifference than why does everybody always search for the old cabs.. it's not cause they want 30 year old speakers. just to prove it that way though.. i'm 90% sure Bose uses solid wood and not particle board and they have the best home theater sound period.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Eric the fish Posted January 18, 2005 Members Share Posted January 18, 2005 Originally posted by PRMike not really...home theaters reproduce sound they don't look for tone..wood adds a tone. Companies also don't use it cause it costs them more...if there isn't a big deifference than why does everybody always search for the old cabs.. it's not cause they want 30 year old speakers.just to prove it that way though.. i'm 90% sure Bose uses solid wood and not particle board and they have the best home theater sound period.. i hate BOSE, at least for home audio use (never critically listened to them for home theatre use, though) dude, why are you catching so much heat? and why the constant Krank plugs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PRMike Posted January 18, 2005 Members Share Posted January 18, 2005 i'm not even plugging them he just tried to say that cabs dont fart... google it and see for yourself.. if you havent hheard it before it's cause you probably don't have an oversized cab and if you do than you must play it with no bass or at bedroom level.Google Farting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sordid1 Posted January 18, 2005 Members Share Posted January 18, 2005 it's the same reason people will pay $200,000 for a 59 les paul. A lot of the guitar community live by the credo that anything older is better. In some cases that is true, but usually it is because that is what the bands they listened to growing up used and therefore that is what they percieve as being the "holy grail" of tone. I'm not saying you're completely wrong about the solid wood thing, i'm just saying that it doesn't make that big of a difference. I personally don't think the Mesa cabs are boomy, but I still think it would be more the speakers in the cabs and the amount of airspace they work better with if that is what you perceive. Just like subwoofers if you put a speaker that was designed to work in a foot qubic box. If you put it in a two cubic foot box the sound is going to be different and depending on your taste it could be a good change or a bad one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Sordid1 Posted January 18, 2005 Members Share Posted January 18, 2005 Originally posted by PRMike not really...home theaters reproduce sound they don't look for tone..wood adds a tone. Companies also don't use it cause it costs them more...if there isn't a big deifference than why does everybody always search for the old cabs.. it's not cause they want 30 year old speakers.just to prove it that way though.. i'm 90% sure Bose uses solid wood and not particle board and they have the best home theater sound period.. Ok, now i'm absolutely sure you have no idea what you're talking about. If you're on a limited budget than I guess bose speakers would do, but pretty much every audiophile I know wouldn't even have those speakers in their homes. Most people I know prefer paradigm, B & W, Definitive technologies, monitor audio or a lot of other brands that are a lot better than bose. And at their price point I do not believe that they use solid woods, but it wouldn't matter because like you said they just reproduce sound, not like a guitar cabinet that reproduces the sound coming from your head right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members PRMike Posted January 18, 2005 Members Share Posted January 18, 2005 Originally posted by Sordid1 it's the same reason people will pay $200,000 for a 59 les paul. A lot of the guitar community live by the credo that anything older is better. In some cases that is true, but usually it is because that is what the bands they listened to growing up used and therefore that is what they percieve as being the "holy grail" of tone. I'm not saying you're completely wrong about the solid wood thing, i'm just saying that it doesn't make that big of a difference. I personally don't think the Mesa cabs are boomy, but I still think it would be more the speakers in the cabs and the amount of airspace they work better with if that is what you perceive. Just like subwoofers if you put a speaker that was designed to work in a foot qubic box. If you put it in a two cubic foot box the sound is going to be different and depending on your taste it could be a good change or a bad one. And I say you still make no sense because if you take a Mesa Traditional Cab and a Mesa Standard cab the speakers are THE SAME. Therefore proving it's the oversized cab in their case which makes it fart out..but scientifically looking at it, it's the extra air space which doesn't allow for the response of a smaller cab, or resonance of a wooden cab so the speakers work to try and make that bass and fart out. The fact you've never played an original solid birch marshall compared to a new one just makes this pointless cause you have no understanding to the complete difference, but the Mesa cab example does show it's not the speakers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Eric the fish Posted January 18, 2005 Members Share Posted January 18, 2005 my thoughts: bigger box = more air volume = weaker air spring = less controlled bass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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