Members jacobcm Posted July 6, 2011 Members Share Posted July 6, 2011 Just to clarify, I can 'glide' up and down a 5 tone scale all the way up to male high c and even a bit further. However, when coming off a lip roll at A5, my voice seems to want to be placed into head. TO CLARIFY: I strike A5 on the piano, begin on a lip roll and flow into an "E" vowel. Why is it that I can go up to male high d on a five tone scale but I cannot simply begin at A5 in a mix without busting right into head voice? What are some things I can do to prevent this from happening? Thank you! Jacob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators davie Posted July 6, 2011 Moderators Share Posted July 6, 2011 Hey Jacob, welcome to the forum. Can you demonstrate these in a clip? There's no accurate way to assess this without hearing how you're producing your sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jacobcm Posted July 6, 2011 Author Members Share Posted July 6, 2011 I would love to but at the moment my onboard microphone is not functional and am out of town so don't have my recording gear handy. To further assist you, the way I was going about this specific excercise was, for example: Striking a A5 on the piano. Beginning the note on a lip roll then flowing into an "E" vowel. On G4 I can produce the tone in a mix, however when I do it on the lip roll, I feel like it's in mix but when I open my mouth to produce the tone I flip into head voice. Hope that helps. Jacob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators davie Posted July 6, 2011 Moderators Share Posted July 6, 2011 Do you mean A4, instead of A5 (that's soprano range) ? A4 is next note after G4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jacobcm Posted July 6, 2011 Author Members Share Posted July 6, 2011 Yes, my apologies. I am not piano savvy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators davie Posted July 6, 2011 Moderators Share Posted July 6, 2011 I'm not entirely sure, but I think notes G4 and upwards need to have mostly head voice. A4 is also a trouble note for me as well. I can sing A4 in full voice using exercises, but spontaneously jumping to that note is hard. Maybe if you start mixing earlier in the scale then it might be easier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jacobcm Posted July 6, 2011 Author Members Share Posted July 6, 2011 Like I said, the scale is the easy part, it's just striking that note alone and trying to hold it out that is giving me problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators davie Posted July 6, 2011 Moderators Share Posted July 6, 2011 I'm not really sure, but maybe I'll ask my teacher about it tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jacobcm Posted July 6, 2011 Author Members Share Posted July 6, 2011 That'd be really awesome man! Thank you. I've asked my own teacher about it and she really didn't have a phenomenal answer for me...I'll be going to train with Brett Manning in a few months but I would prefer not to wait to ask him that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members urca Posted July 7, 2011 Members Share Posted July 7, 2011 Hey Jake, Google "Schnerp Technique" it's a method taught by a guy named Russell Schnerpelli. He has a few exercises that deal with exactly what you're talking about..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Masklin Posted July 7, 2011 Members Share Posted July 7, 2011 Yes, the Schnerp is strong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators davie Posted July 7, 2011 Moderators Share Posted July 7, 2011 That'd be really awesome man! Thank you. I've asked my own teacher about it and she really didn't have a phenomenal answer for me...I'll be going to train with Brett Manning in a few months but I would prefer not to wait to ask him that Okay, I just asked my teacher. He said that you have let it flip into head voice. If you properly train your upper register then it will actually sound like full voice over time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members staticsound Posted July 7, 2011 Members Share Posted July 7, 2011 I'll be going to train with Brett Manning in a few months but I would prefer not to wait to ask him that Nooooooooooooooooooooo!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators davie Posted July 7, 2011 Moderators Share Posted July 7, 2011 Nooooooooooooooooooooo!!!! + 1 (for the record, Static and I aren't crazy about Brett) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jacobcm Posted July 8, 2011 Author Members Share Posted July 8, 2011 + 1 (for the record, Static and I aren't crazy about Brett) Why is that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DukeOfBoom Posted July 8, 2011 Members Share Posted July 8, 2011 eh, all vox teachers are more or less the same. the good ones are good, and the bad one's aren't good. just get a good local teacher, and it'll be 10% the price. u dont need any of that "star" {censored} Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members staticsound Posted July 8, 2011 Members Share Posted July 8, 2011 Why is that? He's overrated and overpriced. If you were to buy the Singing Success set, your basically getting the same thing for a cheaper price. If it were me, I wouldn't waste money on Manning himself. IMHO, the whole SS method will give you somewhat of a foundation to start with, but it stops there. From what I've heard they teach nothing as far as breath support...which is crucial! The techniques involved use muscle to "force" cord closure, instead of breath support. There's an article about speech level singing floating around somewhere, debunking a lot of the stuff it claims to do. Anyways, different strokes for different folks.....end rant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jacobcm Posted July 8, 2011 Author Members Share Posted July 8, 2011 He's overrated and overpriced. If you were to buy the Singing Success set, your basically getting the same thing for a cheaper price. If it were me, I wouldn't waste money on Manning himself. IMHO, the whole SS method will give you somewhat of a foundation to start with, but it stops there. From what I've heard they teach nothing as far as breath support...which is crucial! The techniques involved use muscle to "force" cord closure, instead of breath support. There's an article about speech level singing floating around somewhere, debunking a lot of the stuff it claims to do. Anyways, different strokes for different folks.....end rant Is there anyone you would recommend that is a professional in the same realm as brett? I'm from Ohio and here we have nothing but teachers with nothing but performance degrees and a lack of real knowledge. So anywhere within an 8-9 hours would be awesome...I'm from Cleveland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members DukeOfBoom Posted July 8, 2011 Members Share Posted July 8, 2011 what the hell is a 2nd break anyway? there's a break from chest to head/falsetto. that's the only one i know of. there's a 2nd one somewhere? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members staticsound Posted July 8, 2011 Members Share Posted July 8, 2011 Is there anyone you would recommend that is a professional in the same realm as brett? I'm from Ohio and here we have nothing but teachers with nothing but performance degrees and a lack of real knowledge. So anywhere within an 8-9 hours would be awesome...I'm from Cleveland. Any good teacher can show you the fundamentals. As far as teachers, IMO it really depends on the style of music you want to sing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members urca Posted July 8, 2011 Members Share Posted July 8, 2011 + 1 (for the record, Static and I aren't crazy about Brett) Unless you're talking about Brett Weir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Consume Posted July 9, 2011 Members Share Posted July 9, 2011 eh, all vox teachers are more or less the same. the good ones are good, and the bad one's aren't good.just get a good local teacher, and it'll be 10% the price.u dont need any of that "star" {censored} That's not true. There are a whole lot of people out there teaching - especially in colleges - who don't know their @$$ from a hole in the ground when it comes to vocal training. I'd much rather pay for voice lessons with a known instructor, or one of their students than some body who doesn't know what they are doing. If a vocal instructor can't actually sing - GET AWAY FROM THEM. Unlike guitar or other instruments - this is one thing I can't stress enough - if they don't have a good, clean, bright, resonant sounding voice, look for somebody else! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Consume Posted July 9, 2011 Members Share Posted July 9, 2011 Okay, I just asked my teacher. He said that you have let it flip into head voice. If you properly train your upper register then it will actually sound like full voice over time. Hi Davie, Let me ask you a question: would you define "head voice" for me as you are using it? Normally, you would flip into Falsetto when you break, not head voice. In Flasetto, the vocal cords aren't actually touching, they are stretched, wide apart, and you are pushing a lot of air which just vibrates the edges of the cords - which is why i is so light/airy sounding.Head voice is the full voice range above the Passagio (typically E4 to C5 in men), where the vocal cords adduct and "zip" up and the opening between the edges of the vocal cords and the gap between them shortens, and the resonance takes place in the head, rather than in the chest. Typically, this takes place around E4 and above in men. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Consume Posted July 9, 2011 Members Share Posted July 9, 2011 There is nothing wrong with Brett Manning - his training method is solid. Granted, I prefer more of a Bel Canto styled program, since I am one of those people who sings with an expanded rib cage, while holding my diaphragm down... (Heavy Metal, all the way! lol) Yeah, he's making money, but so what? His techniques work. My own personal thinking, is I would go with Jaime Vendera, but that is just me. Instead of putting $200 in Brett Manning's pocket, I'd buy: Jaime Vendera's "Raise Your Voice 2", Robert Lunte's "Pillars of Singing 2"and if you can still find one, buy a PTD-1 training device - that thing kicks butt for breath support training. I don't know if Jaime Vendera's store still has them, but it is a great idea and training program. You could get all of that for less than Brett Manning's program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators davie Posted July 9, 2011 Moderators Share Posted July 9, 2011 The main difference between head voice and falsetto, is that in head voice the vocal cords are together, whereas in falsetto the vocal cords are apart. Falsetto is generally breathy sounding and you can't support it properly whereas head voice actually has a ringing tone and you're using the thin edges of the vocal cords. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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