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Pls. Help with routing Ableton Live to Notation software using MIDI-Yoke OR Rewire!

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  • Pls. Help with routing Ableton Live to Notation software using MIDI-Yoke OR Rewire!

    Dear Anyone.

    If what I wanna do isn't possible, just tell me why and I'll shurrup - I'm a brand new hatched noob at this.

    I'm disabled, have to use a notation program and put in all the notes with a mouse. I use Quick Score Elite Level 2, prob. the best notation program out there today - apart from a few small problemos it has. One of them is you can only put effects on the FRONT END of VSTs, so it's one VST, one instrument even if the VST is theoretically multitimbral. The second one is you only get holes for 8 vsts so you're limited to 8 tracks. (In theory you get more but as you can't effrect individual sounds from one instance of a VST, after 8 youi're royally stuffed.)

    As you DO GET loadsa staves, I wanted to hook it up to something that can hold loadsa VSTs and I've got Ableton Live (AND Cubase, but that's an everliving nightmare and Ableton looks friendlier!) So I got MIDI-Yoke. Each of MIDI-Yoke's 8 virtual cables can hold 16 instruments (1.1......1.16, then 2.1....2.16 etc) But I can't make Ableton Live see the sub-cables, as far as I can see it's just seeing cables 1-8 and not the decimal point bits. So I'm still limited to 8 tracks and am no better off! That's part 1 of this prob.

    Part 2, directly associated, is Proteus VX. If you got 2 instances of that going and they find out about eachother, your computer will become a doorstop until you restart it. Sometimes you get away with 2 (or more) instances but it's a disaster waiting to happen, usually 10 seconds before you bounce down the final version of your track. What I wanna be able to do, in a nutshell, is this:-

    First. Find out if there's any way to make Ableton Live recognise the decimal point parts of the cable settings so I can have up to 16 instruments per cable going at once (instruments = tracks, really. I just want - for arguments sake - to have 4 tracks of strings so I can EQ each track differently (and add other effrects to each track individually)) Secondly. Proteus VX has many bus lines, you can set as many as you want within limits. How do I use them to route the output from each instrument I've chosen from a single instance of Proteus VX to its own channel so again I can add different effects to each instrument from the same, single instance of Proteus VX?

    I promise you the prob's NOT QSE even though everyone laughs at it cos it looks simple - QSE's finding the sub-tracks like a dream. Sonar used to find them but Sonar's a processor pig so I can't use it - it munches computers! Ableton I don't know if it's seeing them or not, it doesn't seem to be. And I don't think Ableton can use Rewire, if I'm wrong, tell me.

    If I couild get this routing thing sorted, I could do far better music cos I wouldn't have to be cheating with effects just to make something sound half-assed good all the time.

    Yours hopefully - if someone here can solve this with me it'll beat every other forum out there -


  • #2
    I do some midi work but I'm not sure I can be allot of help to you.
    Most of what you're involved with there is heavily into midi. From what I can read it looks like Ableton isn't up to the job.
    I'm not surprised because DAWs vary greatly when it comes to handling midi. Some just add some basic stuff as an after thought
    and aren't designed to support the kind of stuff you're wanting to do.

    What I'd do is post this under the keyboard forum. You have allot more knowledgeable keyboard players there who use allot of midi stuff and may
    have better suggestions on getting this stuff working.

    I'm surprised Cubase doesnt do the job for you. I found it to work the best for midi out of all the DAW programs I have, Cakewalk on the other hand
    is a whole different architecture and after many hours trying to make it work well, I gave up on it.

    You can download a fully functional version of Reaper and its a very inexpensive daw program to buy if you find it does work for you.
    From what I understand the plugins are track based and the program has the lightest CPU consumption using plugins. It will of course have a learning curve
    that you'll have to deal with but all wind up doing the same thing once you're past the basics. Most people love it because they find it very simple to use.

    I'm not familiar with Quick Score Elite Level 2. I do know Avid Sibelius and Finale are considered to be the best composition programs and they both support
    ​midi. I couldn't tell you what benefits they have over other notation software but I'm sure its related to the cost of the programs that make them the leaders.


    • #3
      Dear WRGKMC.

      It's not Cubase isn't up to the job of helping me, I'm not up to the job of understanding Cubase well enough to know how to make it do what I want it to do - and I've tried, believe me. I've read books, watched untold videos - and I don't see WHERE they get half the menus that suddenly pop up from nowhere on their Cubase screens (not even on hyper-slow rewind - the frame that shows the mouse pointing to where the menu comes from flat isn't there) and I don't see how to link out a bunch of instruments from one instance of Proteus VX to different channels.... Cubase is totally up to the task, I just don't see how to make it DO it!

      If you know how to make Cubase do it, just talk me through it and I'll learn....

      I could do it with Sonar easily but Sonar just munches processors - three VSTs and bye-bye computer. I'd bought the max. memory possible for a 32 bit system, the fastest possible processor for my motherboard and Sonar was STILL munching the whole thing for using 3 VSTs. I just couldn't get any more computer for it to use so reluctantly it had to go!

      The main reason for doing all of this is so I get more tracks to use. As you know, DAWs think musicians can't use notation by default and use this ridiculous piano roll - ridiculous because I challenge anyone to line up chords on different instruments in piano roll - it can't be done because you can't see two instruments' piano roll on the screen at once - the screen is not big enough. I was taking days using piano roll to write a piece I couild write in QSE in about a couple of hours (not mix, just write). So I made a deal with myself - no more piano roll nightmare. (You try it. If you got 3 instruments, you can't see 3 piano rolls on the screen at once, how the hell are you supposed to line the chords up!?! That's a serious question, if there's an answer to it I've missed then tell me.)

      I know Cubase has got its own notation but it's not good. Not after using QSE. Why do I prefer that over Sibelius, say? Because of its master manu. Select a bunch of notes and a menu pops up with everything you can do to notes in one long instant list. No hunting through menus/submenus. Hog heaven. And you can use the tab key to nudge notes along the stave, loadsa other reasons. It makes music writing FUN! If only it had more routers/holes for VSTs.

      OK. In your opinion, could CUBASE do what I want (let me Rewire/MIDI-Yoke QSE to it so I can set up the instruments in Cubase and have a bunch of extra tracks to use?) If yes - could you, pretty please with cherries on top, talk me through how the hell to make it happen? I've been trying for nearly 8 years, still can't make it work (apart from Sonar. Such a SHAME Sonar's so badly written apart from that - I mean QSE uses 8 virtual instruments and the processor doesn't even wake up. Sonar uses THREE and kills the computer! Which is the better written of the two? And don't say because Sonar's got loadsa effects - you can put 4 effects on each instrument in QSE and STILL the processor looks bored!)

      Over to you and whoever else reads this - if you think you could show me how to set up QSE with MIDI-Yoke/Rewire and your pet DAW (Not Logic, that's Applemacs only and I've only got a PC, but it's a pretty good one) then I'll happily use whichever one you throw at me - as long as it ends up giving me a bunch of extra tracks to put extra VSTs/instruments from multitimbrals on.

      Yours respectfully