Moderators daddymack Posted July 5, 2012 Moderators Share Posted July 5, 2012 http://www.standard.co.uk/olympics/olympic-news/olympic-musicians-told-work-for-free-7639875.html Then again, they apparently are not really in touch with reality: http://www.forbes.com/sites/johnclarke/2012/04/12/olympics-organizers-ask-dead-musician-to-play-closing-ceremonies/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Kreatorkind Posted July 6, 2012 Members Share Posted July 6, 2012 "It's great exposure!" Exposure to what? More people who will probably pirate your music? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators MrKnobs Posted July 6, 2012 Moderators Share Posted July 6, 2012 http://www.standard.co.uk/olympics/olympic-news/olympic-musicians-told-work-for-free-7639875.html Then again, they apparently are not really in touch with reality: http://www.forbes.com/sites/johnclarke/2012/04/12/olympics-organizers-ask-dead-musician-to-play-closing-ceremonies/ Well, not to put too fine a point on it, but the athletes aren't being paid. They're HOPING to do well and get corporate sponsorships, TV spots, endorsements, etc. In other words, they're working for exposure too... right? Terry D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members beatpoet Posted July 6, 2012 Members Share Posted July 6, 2012 It doesn't sound like anything new, you never get paid (or only get paid peanuts) in Britain unless you're a cover band or have a booking agent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Kramerguy Posted July 6, 2012 Members Share Posted July 6, 2012 Musicians are performers. Would anyone ask a clown to do a birthday party for free?Would anyone ask an actor to perform on Broadway for free? Next thing we know, congress will ask their hookers to perform for free.. just think of the exposure when the politician gets outed, right?! I do charity work for free. I still do some free non-charity gigs, but only what I want to do (doing MusikFest next month), but that's extremely rare, first and only one this year. What bothers me is not that places ask for it, but that they EXPECT it. As if we are obligated to be thrilled to be offered such a grand opportunity.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators daddymack Posted July 6, 2012 Author Moderators Share Posted July 6, 2012 Well, not to put too fine a point on it, but the athletes aren't being paid. They're HOPING to do well and get corporate sponsorships, TV spots, endorsements, etc. In other words, they're working for exposure too... right? Terry D. Which is what the Olympics are about...amateur sports. But are the food service people donating their food and time? Are the hotels donating their services? Did these amateurs fly to London for free? Are the cabs, buses and trains all going to provide free transport to the competitors? They should...great exposure, right? Hell no...why should the musicians? Lest we forget that the word amateur derived from the French, meaning one who does something for the love of it. If they engaged amateur musicians, okay, I'm fine with that, but do not expect professionals to play as amateurs... (but a big FU to Dwayne Wade for wanting to be paid to compete in London...frickin' spoiled millionaire jagoff! Frankly, we should never have sent NBA players to the Olympics, IMHO, except for exhibition purposes) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators MrKnobs Posted July 8, 2012 Moderators Share Posted July 8, 2012 Which is what the Olympics are about...amateur sports. Yes, and you know as well as I do that most of those "amateur" athletes are there hoping to win big so they can cash in on endorsements, ad spots, and maybe turn pro (depending on the sport). Many of them already have pro money behind their training. So why not add yet one MORE sport called "musician" and let some amateur musicians have a shot at money. God knows the media is making money off covering the Olympics. Terry D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Lee Knight Posted July 9, 2012 Moderators Share Posted July 9, 2012 Yes, and you know as well as I do that most of those "amateur" athletes are there hoping to win big so they can cash in on endorsements, ad spots, and maybe turn pro (depending on the sport). Many of them already have pro money behind their training.So why not add yet one MORE sport called "musician" and let some amateur musicians have a shot at money. God knows the media is making money off covering the Olympics.Terry D. What? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators MrKnobs Posted July 9, 2012 Moderators Share Posted July 9, 2012 What? I'm saying when a club owner suggests you play for "exposure" you should probably throw your beer in his face. When the Olympics suggests the same thing, well, that might actually be worth something. Terry D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted July 9, 2012 Members Share Posted July 9, 2012 http://www.standard.co.uk/olympics/olympic-news/olympic-musicians-told-work-for-free-7639875.html Locog said it stood by its commitment to the MU that it would not pay volunteers or headline acts but all other professional musicians will be paid. So who here wouldn't play for free if asked to be a headline act at the Olympics? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators daddymack Posted July 10, 2012 Author Moderators Share Posted July 10, 2012 Keith Moon for one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted July 10, 2012 Members Share Posted July 10, 2012 Keith Moon for one... Keith Moon is here? Cool! What's his username? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MDLMUSIC Posted July 11, 2012 Members Share Posted July 11, 2012 "It's great exposure!" Exposure to what? More people who will probably pirate your music? I said it before and I'll say it again. You can die from exposure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators MrKnobs Posted July 11, 2012 Moderators Share Posted July 11, 2012 I said it before and I'll say it again.You can die from exposure. That's why you have to choose your exposure carefully. I think almost anyone would benefit from Olympic exposure, provided your band has something impressive to expose. Terry D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Kreatorkind Posted July 11, 2012 Members Share Posted July 11, 2012 That's why you have to choose your exposure carefully. I think almost anyone would benefit from Olympic exposure, provided your band has something impressive to expose. Terry D. I'd probably do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dav1 Posted July 11, 2012 Members Share Posted July 11, 2012 Well, not to put too fine a point on it, but the athletes aren't being paid. Maybe not directly paid by the IOC, but here in Australia our government and sporting bodies financially prop up athletes who they think will qualify for the games. Athletes also get an all-expenses-paid trip to London, so I wouldn't exactly say they're "playing for free". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members beatpoet Posted July 11, 2012 Members Share Posted July 11, 2012 That's why you have to choose your exposure carefully. I think almost anyone would benefit from Olympic exposure, provided your band has something impressive to expose.Terry D. Muse have rightly been slated for writing a song for the Olympics, they've well and truly sold out now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members ckoehler Posted July 12, 2012 Members Share Posted July 12, 2012 The other day, I had a bar owner asking me to play for free because his bar was hosting a benefit. I asked him if there was going to be open bar and whether or not his bartenders were working for free that day. He said no. Then I asked him why he thinks my lead man and I should work for free. We agreed on a fee - lower than usual because I am sympathetic to the reason for the benefit - and we will be playing. It is a tricky situation when it is a benefit and there is money to be raised for a good cause but I feel that there is a cost of doing business for us musicians just like there is a cost of doing business for him serving food and drink (which I guarantee he will profit on at the end of the day). Also, this reminds of an article a saw a few months back where a musician in LA took this "exposure" topic on my asking if there were any restaurant that would come over to his house and cook a meal for him and all his friends. He wouldn't be able to pay but it would be great exposure. I can't find the link otherwise I would post it for you. It was a great read. If feels as though musicians always get crapped on or are expected to play for free all the time. If we don't we are assholes. Why is that? Hell, I can't think of any other occupations where this is the. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators daddymack Posted July 12, 2012 Author Moderators Share Posted July 12, 2012 because we 'play' instruments, not 'work instruments'... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members beatpoet Posted July 12, 2012 Members Share Posted July 12, 2012 If feels as though musicians always get crapped on or are expected to play for free all the time. If we don't we are assholes. Why is that? Hell, I can't think of any other occupations where this is the. Yeah I know, in the live scene there's this whole culture of failed snobs who will say "who the hell do you think you are?" if you expect petrol money at the minimum for doing a gig outside your hometown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators MrKnobs Posted July 13, 2012 Moderators Share Posted July 13, 2012 It is a tricky situation when it is a benefit and there is money to be raised for a good cause but I feel that there is a cost of doing business for us musicians just like there is a cost of doing business for him serving food and drink (which I guarantee he will profit on at the end of the day).. That's a good point but that cost of doing business can range quite a bit. No way I'm doing a benefit bringing my own huge PA and several hired side men, but showing up with just an acoustic and plugging into their stuff is pretty low cost. Funny you should bring this up. J & I have been asked to do a HIV benefit downtown later this month which we are happy to do as long as we can just bring ourselves and instruments and play though their backline and PA. They want our full band, though, which is asking a lot given a 30 min slot and the fact we'd have to shell out a couple hundred for our sidemen to show up and play. Maybe Bono could do that, but we can't. Another puzzling situation we recently played was a benefit in a very popular bar downtown. It was absolutely packed, the liquor was flowing, and the cash registers were ringing (well beeping these days but you know what I mean). Neither the opening act nor us were being paid a cent, yet the openers, after laying down an AMAZING peformance were BOOED when they announced they had a CD for sale. We'd have made the same mistake, but with the benefit of seeing their result we announced at the end of our set we had CDs available with $2 of each sale going to the charity the benefit was supporting. We got applause and cheers, how messed up is that? Terry D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators daddymack Posted July 15, 2012 Author Moderators Share Posted July 15, 2012 Marketing 101... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members A. Einstein Posted July 15, 2012 Members Share Posted July 15, 2012 it is possibly everywhere the same. the mayor propagates an event, tells the population that the event generates 2 billion £ for the city, at the end the tax payer pays the whole event, a few hotels have more overnight, the Dutch sleep on the camping grounds and the whole city smells like piss and must be desinfected Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members HotSir Posted July 15, 2012 Members Share Posted July 15, 2012 Look, I don't expect to be payed for playing anywhere - it's likely that I'll be playing with people I like playing with, so if anything, I should be paying THEM for the opportunity to play with good friends and musicians in front of an audience. What I DO expect to be payed for is the trouble of getting the band there, which means packing some big instruments into tiny cars and paying for petrol, toll roads, lunch AND/OR dinner, PLUS the fact that I'm giving the bar/hotel/casino profit from the people buying tickets/drinks/food. That's how I see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SusieP Posted July 15, 2012 Members Share Posted July 15, 2012 Regarding Musicians playing for free at the London Olympics, the Musicians Union here ran a feature on it in last month's journal. They warned people about being conned into playing for free.They warned about the usual promises 'its good exposure' etc. They advise potential performers to check who exactly is attending this free gig, therefore what exposure exactly will they get. if there are no venue bookers, booking agents or record label people attending - then there's no point doing the freebie.If it's for a charity event, then the caterers, barstaff etc will still get paid. Only the musicians are expected to play for free. So the M.U advice is, play for a fee and then it is up to you whether to donate to the charity. The guy writing the article is a professional sax player. He told a story about why he never plays for free anywhere anymore. Years ago, a guy he knew wanted session musicians to play on an album he was making. The guy was trying to get a record company deal and was making a demo album to try and get noticed. He was broke and couldn't afford to pay musicians so he asked the guy writing the M.U. article if he would play the sax on the album for him for free.He agreed.Some time later, the album maker got a deal and was making an album for his label.The sax player guy asked if him if he wanted him to play for him on this album.But the guy said,"no thanks. I'm going to use a proper sax player this time, because anyone who plays for free isn't a proper musician." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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