Members 9-Pin-Phoenix Posted November 4, 2012 Members Share Posted November 4, 2012 Lately we have been starting with the lighter stuff, and then getting heavier as the night goes on, but then I feel that our dance tunes are out of the way too early in the night. So, I'm working on refreshing our set list for an upcoming gig, and I see it referenced her that a particular song is a "First set song" or a "Third set song". What's the difference in your mind? How do you determine which songs go in which set? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Chicken Monkey Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 Depends on the venue. If it's a dinner-crowd thing, we'll put songs we want to try out but need to work on in the 3rd set. If it's a stay-to-the-bitter-end, type place, we put a lot of ravers at the end, and then close with a slow tune or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members martyr40 Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 We usually play from 9 pm to 1:30 (three hour + sets) and tI determine the pace of the set list like this; Set 1 - first two or three songs are for us to warm up and work out sound issues (don't take this the wrong way, we give our all - all night long, but at the start of the evening there's usually only the regular bar flies in attendance and our hardcore fans) Once we get past that, it's time to start grabbing the incoming patrons attention so that by the end of the first set, they want more. Set 2 - We pick up from the end of set 1 and deliver all the tunes the audience wants to hear along with the tunes we think they should be listening to - this set is usually our longest and has the highest concentration of crowd-pleasers. Set 3 - We pick up from set 2, but now it's time to wind things down and, but also don't forget - the folks staying till closing are your professional party animals and you need to cater to them too. So we always like to send them off with a big bang at the end. Since we've been doing this for a few years now, we have a higher concentration of crowd-pleasers to choose from and can rotate things between sets more freely. Another thing that we do to keep things fresh is we have three set-lists to choose from - they're all the same songs, but organized differently from set to set. Keeps things from getting stale since we only add new material to our set from October to May. From May through September we're usually swamped with gigs so we kind of forgo rehearsal unless we're writing new material of our own. Kind of vague, but hopefully you get the point Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members flanc Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 It depends on the crowd. We often find audiences are just ordering their drinks and settling-in during the first set. We don't want to hit them with our harder stuff or our dancier stuff when they are not in the spirits to enjoy either...so, we do "first set" material. For us, it's up-tempo but not necessarily "dancie". For us, it's stuff by Adele (Someone Like You, Rumor Has It) U2 - Streets Have No Name, Filter - Take a Picture, Gotye - somebody that I used to know, etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 9-Pin-Phoenix Posted November 5, 2012 Author Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 Thanks guys. This is helpful. Keep the tips coming. I should have mentioned that we are a rock band that focuses on 90's and newer music. We generally play small bars, say 100 or less people. Very rarely are we playing to a "dinner crowd". Though the one time we did was a great gig! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mstreck Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 I think it's all going to depend on your band and your typical crowd, but here is what we do... First set - 90's, head bopping stuff that lets people get settled in - some classic rock, some mild 80's, and we end the set with some current pop that Amy vocally knocks out of the park. Second set - people are relaxing and letting down their guards, so we open with current dance/pop and transition into 80's hair metal and sing-along stuff. Third set is full-blown party material, topped off with harder stuff from RATM, Metallica, Audioslave, etc. It's a drunken party at this point. Here's an example: SET ONE 1. VOLCANO GIRLS 2. JUST A GIRL 3. 1985 4. HIT ME 5. WALK THIS WAY 6. TUSH 7. I LOVE ROCK N ROLL 8. YOUR LOVE 9. 867-5309 10. ANY WAY YOU WANT IT 11. BOYS OF SUMMER 12. KEEP YOUR HANDS TO YOURSELF 13. HARD TO HANDLE 14. GRENADE 15. RAISE YOUR GLASS 16. ROLLIN THE DEEP/CRAZY SET TWO 1. EVERYBODY TALKS 2. DOMINO/I GOTTA FEELIN' 3. HOT & COLD 4. CALL ME MAYBE 5. PERFECT 6. 99 RED BALLOONS 7. ROCK YOU LIKE A HURRICANE 8. REBEL YELL 9. YOU SHOOK ME 10. I WANT YOU TO WANT ME 11. SWEET CHILD 12. DON'T STOP BELIEVIN' SET THREE 1. FORGET YOU 2. PRETTY FLY (FOR A WHITE GUY) 3. SMALL THINGS 4. FIGHT FOR RIGHT 5. SONG 2 6. THE JEFFERSONS 7. SHE HATES ME 8. ZOMBIE 9. YOU OUGHTA KNOW 10. SUPER BASS 11. ENTER SANDMAN 12. BULLS ON PARADE 13. COCHISE 14. HIGHER GROUND 15. ROCK AND ROLL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WynnD Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 Originally Posted by 9-Pin-Phoenix Lately we have been starting with the lighter stuff, and then getting heavier as the night goes on, but then I feel that our dance tunes are out of the way too early in the night. So, I'm working on refreshing our set list for an upcoming gig, and I see it referenced her that a particular song is a "First set song" or a "Third set song". What's the difference in your mind? How do you determine which songs go in which set?Thanks! I have a few trumpet songs that can't be in the first set and can't be the first trumpet piece I play. Understand that I only play 20 songs on trumpet. (About 1/5 th of the material.) I just need a good warmup to get ready for the high notes on that instrument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 9-Pin-Phoenix Posted November 5, 2012 Author Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 Originally Posted by WynnD I have a few trumpet songs that can't be in the first set and can't be the first trumpet piece I play. Understand that I only play 20 songs on trumpet. (About 1/5 th of the material.) I just need a good warmup to get ready for the high notes on that instrument. I can understand that. I played trumpet in high school. There are also a few songs that our singer prefers to be in the set earlier (You Oughta Know - Alannis Morisette) or later (The Pretender - Foo Fighters). We have been doing the Alannis in the first set, but I think we get too good of a reaction for it to be wasted there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 Depends on the venue, the gig, and the crowd. When playing clubs, unless the venue/gig/crowd specifically calls for a lighter/softer first set (i.e. people still eating dinner) then I see no reason to not rock 'em as hard in the first set as in the third. If fact, it sometimes better to do so if you're going to have a good-sized crowd early on and you're trying to keep people in the venue. The first set/third set stuff comes from the idea that there aren't going to be many people around early in the night so you can use the first set to blow through some weaker tunes or more "listening" type material as opposed to hard rockers or dance-floor fillers. But a weak song is a weak song. If you're looking for spots in your set to play certain songs so that they cause the least amount of damage to the flow of the set, then it's probably best to just find a better song. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members guitarguy19 Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 Originally Posted by guido61 a weak song is a weak song. If you're looking for spots in your set to play certain songs so that they cause the least amount of damage to the flow of the set, then it's probably best to just find a better song. ^^ THIS. We're FINALLY getting to the point where there are very few songs we can only play in certain places. The ones that are "stuck" somewhere...like if we play them in the middle of our danceist set they'll clear the floor...are slowly but surely going buh bye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mrcpro Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 Originally Posted by 9-Pin-Phoenix How do you determine which songs go in which set? Put the ones with the "F" bombs later in the night Seriously if you're finding yourself running out of good material too early in the evening you just need more good material. If your set list is spanning two decades (1990s to present) there's a ton of stuff out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 9-Pin-Phoenix Posted November 5, 2012 Author Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 Originally Posted by mrcpro Put the ones with the "F" bombs later in the night Seriously if you're finding yourself running out of good material too early in the evening you just need more good material. If your set list is spanning two decades (1990s to present) there's a ton of stuff out there. I'm not sure that we are running out of good material, I just want to make sure that we have the good material in the right spot.I think as a band we waffle a little bit regarding dancing. We play a show where we get some good dancing and then we want to focus on that, but then the singer, and or bass player tend to want to only play the songs they want to play. We are trying to find a nice balance of songs that they like, are danceable, and can be covered with our instrumentation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SeniorBlues Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 Originally Posted by 9-Pin-Phoenix . . . but then the singer, and or bass player tend to want to only play the songs they want to play. Ah . . . NOW we've got a thread! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nchangin Posted November 5, 2012 Members Share Posted November 5, 2012 Originally Posted by 9-Pin-Phoenix I think as a band we waffle a little bit regarding dancing. We play a show where we get some good dancing and then we want to focus on that, but then the singer, and or bass player tend to want to only play the songs they want to play. We are trying to find a nice balance of songs that they like, are danceable, and can be covered with our instrumentation. Are these the songs that are clearing the dance floor by chance? What song titles do you speak of specifically? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SpaceNorman Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 Unless you're getting hired strictly to play your show (which I'm guessing is where Grant's NIAB band is at...) - you need to have the ability to tailor your set list a bit. If everything is drop dead killer dance stuff - you're going to overpower rooms that have you playing during the dinner transition. If you're light on crunchy rock stuff ... and you find yourself playing to a roomfull of guys ... all that Katy Perry stuff that killed with last night's dance crowd simply goes "poof". If all you've got is crunchy rock stuff ... well, all you got is crunchy rock stuff. If you're an event band playing "all ages" crowds - you need to be able to assess the room and have depth and breadth of playlist to go in any direction for at least a set or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SeniorBlues Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 Originally Posted by SpaceNorman If you're an event band playing "all ages" crowds - you need to be able to assess the room and have depth and breadth of playlist to go in any direction for at least a set or two. I don't mean to pick on you personally, but I keep asking band leaders on this forum exactly what it is they are "reading" which prompts them to feel the need to change their set list. No one has ever tried to break this down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SpaceNorman Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 Originally Posted by SeniorBlues I don't mean to pick on you personally, but I keep asking band leaders on this forum exactly what it is they are "reading" which prompts them to feel the need to change their set list. No one has ever tried to break this down. I don't think there's any "science" to it - but rather a gut feel. Things that jump out at me when I'm looking at what the set list says and deciding whether or not changes are needed include the following:Ratio of available seats to seats already filled Percentage of tables with food on them Age of the room Gender makeup of the room Nature of the conversation The start of the ngiht for a room full of 40-50 somethings gets pitched differently than a room full of 20-30 somethings. A room full of folks who are still eating sees a different pitch than a room that's primary drinking. A room that's predominantly guys drinking gets a different opening than a room full of couples ... and both of those get a different opening from a room full of with "guys" tables and "ladies" tables. Once we get past the first couple of songs - it's sorta like fishing .... you keep showing 'em different lures until you figure out what they're biting on today ... and then keep casting with what they respond to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SusieP Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 Hit them with some of your most awesome stuff early on to make 'em sit up take notice and know that you are fabulous. Opening number has to get their attention. Has to make 'em think.....wow! At the very end of the night, hopefully they will have had such a good time and drunk enough alcohol to lose their artistic criticism ability and will be so blootered that as long as they hear a beat they can dance to it doesn't matter what you play! Then in the middle, give 'em a nice mix of stuff. I'd only do the slow, ease them into the show kind of music to open with if they are having dinner when you start. No dinner, no need to ease them in slowly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jeff42 Posted November 6, 2012 Members Share Posted November 6, 2012 we have certain medleys that are usually 2nd or early 3rd set medleys. They are the ones that have (or could have) crowd participation. The main thing is to get your show to have NO filler-ALL killer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 9-Pin-Phoenix Posted November 10, 2012 Author Members Share Posted November 10, 2012 Ok, so without learning any new tunes, here is what I came up for our setlist next week. I'd be interested in your thoughts overall. Set 1 Banditos - The Refreshments Hey Jealousy - The Gin Blossoms Little Miss Can't Be Wrong - The Spin Dr's Good - Better Than Ezra Creep - Radiohead Interstate Love Song - STP Comedown - Bush Saving Grace - Tom Petty Hemorrhage - Fuel Santa Monica - Everclear Low - Cracker Mekong - The Refreshments Crossraods - Cream/John Mayer Set 2 Are you Gonna Be My Girl - Jet Ain't No REst for the Wicked - Cage the Elephant Bitch - Meredith Brooks Bring Me Some Water - Melissa Ethridge Mary Jane's Last Dance - Tom Petty 3 AM - Matchbox 20 Jeremy - Pearl Jam Kryptonite - 3 Doors Down Harder to Breathe - Maroon 5 If You Could Only See - Tonic You Wreck Me - Tom Petty Say It Ain't So - Weezer Strage Face of Love - Tito and Tarantula Set 3 You Oughta Know - Alannis Inside Out - Eve 6 Next 2 You - Buckcherry Hard to Handle - The Black Crowes Give Me One Reason - Tracy Chapman Santeria - Sublime When I'm Gone - 3 Doors Down Just a Girl - No Doubt Blister in the Sun - The Violent Femmes Smooth Criminal - Alien Ant Farm Peaches - POTUS 7 Nation Army - The White Stripes No One Knows - Queens of the Stone Age Set 4 The Middle - Jimmy Eat World My Own Worst Enemy - LIT Flagpole Sitta - Dammit - Blink 182 Ruby Soho - Rancid Hitchin a Ride - Green Day (S)He Hates Me - Machine Head - Bush Cumbersome - Seven Mary Three Possum Kingdom - Toadies Breed - Nirvana Killing In The Name - Rage Sober - Tool Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted November 10, 2012 Members Share Posted November 10, 2012 I don't mean to pick on you personally, but I keep asking band leaders on this forum exactly what it is they are "reading" which prompts them to feel the need to change their set list. No one has ever tried to break this down. For us, it's about age, gender and as much as it can be determined, cultural preferences. If there are a lot of 20-30 something females in the audience, we're going to play a much different setlist than we would if it's a lot of 40-50 something males. And you can often tell by how people dress and other cues whether they look to be more of a 'rock' crowd than a 'dance' crowd. And if you can't judge them by how they look, you can usually suss that after a few songs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members wades_keys Posted November 11, 2012 Members Share Posted November 11, 2012 I don't mean to pick on you personally, but I keep asking band leaders on this forum exactly what it is they are "reading" which prompts them to feel the need to change their set list. No one has ever tried to break this down. Pretty easy in my view. The guy that shows no situational awareness on stage is the last guy you want to listen to about what "works" and what "doesn't work". Pretty much that simple. Converseley, the guy(s)/gal(s) that ARE in tune with the crowd: the ones getting the shots brought up, the ones getting tips, the ones that talk to the patrons between sets. Those are the ones that know what's up. Pretty simple really. If you're in a band that doesn't have at least one guy pulling that off, you're doomed anyway. Stop staring at your shoes and engage would be my advice. You need at least ONE person with his finger on the pulse. I tell ya man: my eyes opened when I started on that road of actually making eye contact, getting to know people one by one. It's liberating. Do that and you'll know what "works" and what "doesn't", and you'll be fighting stupid dead air from the guys that are in their little bubble up there. Break the bubble. Engage. Play with confidence. The questions you are asking will answer themselves in real time when you do that,. There's no formula, somethign you can concoct beforehand. This is real time {censored}. So: read your audience in real time, react in real time. Keep the beat going, in real time. Engage. Situational awareness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members SeniorBlues Posted November 11, 2012 Members Share Posted November 11, 2012 Seems to me that the variables that have been discussed are going to be known ahead of time, right? The question wasn't whether set lists should be the same for every gig. More about why you would be unaware of who you're going to play for to the point where you'd have to change things up once you get there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members wades_keys Posted November 11, 2012 Members Share Posted November 11, 2012 Seems to me that the variables that have been discussed are going to be known ahead of time, right? The question wasn't whether set lists should be the same for every gig. More about why you would be unaware of who you're going to play for to the point where you'd have to change things up once you get there. Why ask why? Just be aware and be ready to change it up. Or put your head down and get in a bubble and convince yourself you're in touch. It's whatever. I'm not trying to run your life, the choice is up to to you! Seems to me that the best approach is to be flexible, but I'm in a place where I've got nothing to prove. Do what you want. In fact, I'd rather that other bands suck. Gives me more opportunities. So I ain't dying on a hill to convince anyone to do what's right. Hell, do what's wrong. Stink up the joint. I like to see that. Opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members kmart Posted November 11, 2012 Members Share Posted November 11, 2012 Seems to me that the variables that have been discussed are going to be known ahead of time, right? The question wasn't whether set lists should be the same for every gig. More about why you would be unaware of who you're going to play for to the point where you'd have to change things up once you get there. So you're saying you know what the audience will be comprised of and what they will like/react to for every single show you play...ALL THE TIME? I can assure you: you are in the minority on that, regardless if you're playing bars or privates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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