Members WynnD Posted December 7, 2015 Members Share Posted December 7, 2015 I've seen it time and time again. When a band has at least one lefty and a righty guitarist and bassist, why point both instruments away from the singer. Stage wise it seems to me that having the audience's eyes drawn to your lead vocalist should be a visual plus. If you had all the guitars aimed at your singer, the eyes would follow in that direction naturally. Properly done, there shouldn't be any adverse affect upon the sound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Drummer44 Posted December 7, 2015 Members Share Posted December 7, 2015 Maybe 'cause it might be slightly easier to share a mic? Although not so many fully-amplified groups do that, these days... -D44 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 1001gear Posted December 7, 2015 Members Share Posted December 7, 2015 I think pointing outwards frames the stage better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted December 7, 2015 Members Share Posted December 7, 2015 Safety issues. Less likely to bonk the singer in the head or headstocks to cross Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members moogerfooger Posted December 7, 2015 Members Share Posted December 7, 2015 vectors. how do they work? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WynnD Posted December 8, 2015 Author Members Share Posted December 8, 2015 I can understand on a crowded stage, but when space is available? I really like the visuals of pointing the audience towards the singer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted December 8, 2015 Members Share Posted December 8, 2015 I can understand on a crowded stage' date=' but when space is available? I really like the visuals of pointing the audience towards the singer.[/quote'] Even when space is available, the outside guitarists are always going to move towards each other and towards the singer at some point. Accidents will happen. I'm a right handed guitarist on stage right. So being conscious of where the singer is while I'm playing guitar is always a concern. I always have to make sure my moves aren't in the way. The guitarist on stage left doesn't have that concern. As far as "pointing the audience towards the singer"? Meh. I don't see it. And I agree that two outward-pointing necks are a better 'frame'. Besides, John and Paul always did it that way. Who's gonna argue with them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WynnD Posted December 8, 2015 Author Members Share Posted December 8, 2015 One of my former singer had a band that also did the splitting guitars. I've always found that distracting and in her case it took your eyes off a very pretty lady. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted December 8, 2015 Members Share Posted December 8, 2015 One of my former singer had a band that also did the splitting guitars. I've always found that distracting and in her case it took your eyes off a very pretty lady. If you're more interested in guitar necks and headstocks than the very pretty lady in the center, then I can't help you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WynnD Posted December 8, 2015 Author Members Share Posted December 8, 2015 Just looking for a natural flow of things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted December 8, 2015 Members Share Posted December 8, 2015 Guitars pointed out "flow" as naturally as those pointed the other way. You're the only person I've ever heard of whic was "distracted" by this. It's not an issue in the real world Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members 1001gear Posted December 9, 2015 Members Share Posted December 9, 2015 People are working on neckless guitars as we speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members t_e_l_e Posted December 9, 2015 Members Share Posted December 9, 2015 i don't want to bonk our singer into her hips when i move while playing.i don't want if i bonk her, to detune my guitarwhere my head stock is, i need some freedom to move, otherwise i feel myself restricted and uncomfortable.if there is a mic stand or anything else in the way, my comfort already suffers being a lefty guitarist and having a righty bassist, there was never a discussion, he is standing left i am standing right.only if the bands before or after us sharing the stage setup otherwise, we have our setup.if forced doing the opposite, i need much more space, or i am being uncomfortable always fearing to knock anything with my guitar neck. and being uncomfortable on stage results in a much worse performance than if the layout/framing you name it of the people of the stage looks wrong for the audience Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WynnD Posted December 9, 2015 Author Members Share Posted December 9, 2015 I like a large stage because then I don't have cymbals near my ears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted December 10, 2015 Members Share Posted December 10, 2015 I like a large stage because then I don't have cymbals near my ears. Most musicians like large stages, but they aren't always available, are they? Even for The Beatles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WynnD Posted December 10, 2015 Author Members Share Posted December 10, 2015 Very true. I like stage volume below 105 dbc. I always have enough PA to blast the audience without having to get myself blasted out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted December 10, 2015 Members Share Posted December 10, 2015 IEMs are the best answer. Run most instruments direct or at very low stage volume and let everyone choose their own mix to their own liking. Then you don't have to argue about stage volumes or db levels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WynnD Posted December 10, 2015 Author Members Share Posted December 10, 2015 I'd rather work with someone who didn't have to be told to turn down. There almost isn't such a thing as too low a volume for small to moderate clubs. I've played R&R at volumes where you could hear the people talking. Funny thing is, people would come in the club and not leave until we were done. Place always ended up being packed by night's end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted December 10, 2015 Members Share Posted December 10, 2015 I'd rather work with someone who didn't have to be told to turn down. And others would probably rather work with someone who isn't telling them to turn down all the time. One of the issues with working with a band is you have multiple persons who all have different needs, desires, and their own ideas of what works best for them. IEMs give you the best option to do as you please within your own environment. And it reduces the need for any individual member to feel he needs an overly loud stage volume. I used to have a problem with my bass player constantly being way too loud on stage. But he insisted he needed to "feel" it to a certain degree. I get that but...still....too loud is too loud and everyone else turns up to match his level. Volume wars. We switched to IEMs. He runs direct into the board via a pre-amp. Keyboards are now run direct. Guitarist plays very quietly through a small amp. Only stage volume, really, is drums and cymbals which no longer destroy my ears because my ears are protected. Everyone turns up as loud as they want or not. My bass player still complains of his ears ringing after a gig sometime. Mine don't. He still wants everything blasting in his ears? That's HIS choice. Not to mention we're no longer dragging around a buttload of heavy stage amps, speakers and monitors anymore. At my age, the less gear the better. Not a perfect solution, but nothing is ever going to be. Considering all the time you've spent complaining about other musicians playing louder than you prefer, it's something you really ought to consider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WynnD Posted December 11, 2015 Author Members Share Posted December 11, 2015 I've got IEMs, but have barely used them. I might use them this Saturday for solo channel monitoring. (Done that before.) I think one of the things that really bugs me is when a guitarist who plays too loud won't aim that damn amp at their own head. And also drummers who refuse to learn how to play softly and sound good. (That is a great skill to add to a person's toolbox.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted December 11, 2015 Members Share Posted December 11, 2015 Yeah that's a great plan. Just use your IEMs for "solos monitoring"'and keep bitching about how loud the guitarist and drummer are. That's really working out well for you it seems... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members WynnD Posted December 11, 2015 Author Members Share Posted December 11, 2015 Apparently I didn't make myself clear. Told you I don't like working with loud musicians. Don't have any interest in it at any level and I personally think that more bands have lost gigs because of being TOO LOUD than have lost gigs for just not being very good. But I have seen it time and time again where a guitarist who is too loud won't aim the God Damn Amp at his own head. (And not even in a band I'm playing in.) They apparently have been told somewhere along the line that they needed to be louder and they don't understand how sound works enough to figure out what that actually means so they turn up to screaming level. (And that might not even cure the problem.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted December 11, 2015 Members Share Posted December 11, 2015 Apparently I didn't make myself clear. Consider using IEMSs and run instruments direct. Thereby eliminating stage volume altogether. honestly I think you enjoy complaining more than finding solutions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Drummer44 Posted December 12, 2015 Members Share Posted December 12, 2015 Apparently I didn't make myself clear. Consider using IEMSs and run instruments direct. Thereby eliminating stage volume altogether. Or a variation, with or without "loud" guys, doesn't matter: run instruments direct, even without IEMs. Pedals or similar for effects, if necessary. Monitors can face whomever... Load-in/out gets easier, too, and transport vehicle can get smaller. -D44 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Vito Corleone Posted December 12, 2015 Members Share Posted December 12, 2015 Or a variation, with or without "loud" guys, doesn't matter: run instruments direct, even without IEMs. Pedals or similar for effects, if necessary. Monitors can face whomever... Load-in/out gets easier, too, and transport vehicle can get smaller. -D44 Yep. With the quality of processors available today, there's really no reason for big loud amps on stage anymore. Let the PA do the work. That's what it is for. If you need to somehow be enveloped in sound and volume, then go to IEMs or, like you say, have a monitor pushing back against your face. But no reason to subject the rest of the band to it. Or the audience. Plus it only makes the out-front sound worse and more work for the sound guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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