Members chrisjardine12 Posted January 20, 2009 Members Share Posted January 20, 2009 Hey everyone,The title is pretty self-explanatory. I'm looking to wire some floodlights to a custom box with light switches or some other alternative (suggestions?) that can be activated/deactivated from the box.Same thing with strobe lights. I'd like to have a strobe light on both sides of the drum set activated with one switch, and then one flood light on each side of the drum set. Would it be possible to have both flood lights turn on with one switch but have two separate switches for each light? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bryan316 Posted January 21, 2009 Members Share Posted January 21, 2009 This is almost exactly the same thing I wanna achieve. First, before I ruin my train of thought, to do your A/B/both switches for your flood lights, we wire three switches. First switch comes from power source. From that switch, it goes to two separate switches. Those separate switches each control one flood light. This makes the first switch a Master switch, then the other two turn on each light ONLY when the Master switch is on. This way, you can turn off the Master, then turn on both A and B, then turn on the Master to have em both come on at the same time. Or, keep the Master on, and activate A and B whenever you need them. As for wiring things up, I wanna recommend you get these kind of switches: It lets you fit two or three switches close together so your control board doesn't get massive. But it'll get expensive. These guys are very easy and gentle to the touch, you can almost just tap em. Very feel-friendly if you don't want to look down at the board. But of course, the dirt-cheap $0.54 switch can't be beat... If you're mounting more than one lightswitch, I'd recommend overlapping that screw hole to get them as close as possible. Forget the typical outlet cover plates, go get a sheet of storm door acrylic window material, melt (notice how I don't say cut?) the holes, paint the underside, and screw it over the switches. For your wiring, I'd get LOTS of zip ties to bundle your wiring together. Think of building a power cable snake. Set up your lights where they'd be around the drummer, and lay down the wires. Start collecting them, and wrapping them. Bring em all back together. Of course, some cables will be longer than others. You can make a pseudo-fan with these: Cut off any excess, put the plug on, no need to have a mess on stage with one 15-foot cable and one 50-ft cable and partially coiled up at your box. Elegance of design also means ease of use. Build your box out of whatever. Run 12 gauge long-ass cable into the box. Run each switch down to an outlet at the back wall of the box. LABEL EVERYTHING. Hell, get a few cans of spray paint and color-code everything. Just plug the cables in, use a piece of cardboard as a divider, and spray the whole thing. Make it FOOLPROOF so even a drummer could plug em in the right way. HAHA YOU DRUMMERS! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tarzanalog Posted January 21, 2009 Members Share Posted January 21, 2009 As with anything, you don't always save money going the DIY route. There are other options you might want to look at: These FC-8 units have one switch/outlet with indicators to let you know what's on and can be had for well under $100, especially used. I've seen older units that incorporated dimming as well. For a little more money you get a little more control with the Chauvet Foot Master. gives you full on, blackout, and some chasing control. Basically an Eliminator ED15 and a Lite-Puter F-402. Available for Under $200 as a package, less if you buy individually and make your own connecting cables. Allows for turning individual dimmer pack channels on/off, setting scenes and switching between, and controlling chases. Dimmer packs can be chained so you can run them to other locations on stage and use the same foot controller. You can also toggle the channels for on/off vs. dimming... useful if you plan to control strobes or other fixtures and just want the power to come on. The second and third options cut down on your extension cable runs when going analog. The third uses dimmer packs that are also DMX ready if you make the transition. Of course, another option is to just go DMX. Although you're not really eliminating very many power cables, but they say it sure simplifies control. I'm leaning analog for the time being as well until I get enough DMX capable fixtures to justify the expense of the controllers. I've done the light switches under foot thing before... not fun to operate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members chrisjardine12 Posted January 21, 2009 Author Members Share Posted January 21, 2009 Thank you so much Bryan.However I'm having a tough time recalling how to go about wiring. I took a building trades class for a year and ended being the best person in the class at doing it but i havent done anything related to wiring in over a year and a half.I'll keep reading through your post until I can make some more sense of it haha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bryan316 Posted January 22, 2009 Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 Okay. Gimme a few minutes. I'm back at work instead of home puking and sneezing, so I've got access to CAD again. Lemme whip up a DIE-agram for ya! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members soundlight Posted January 22, 2009 Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 Okay. Gimme a few minutes. I'm back at work instead of home puking and sneezing, so I've got access to CAD again. Lemme whip up a DIE-agram for ya! You have CAD again. Elation has .dwg files, GlobalTruss has .dwg files, I'm waiting to see the dream lighting rig in .dwg or .dxf format! (Probably printed to a .pdf file 'cause not many people on here can open .dwg or .dxf files). If I get over to the VectorWorks lab in the theatre dept. tomorrow, maybe I can cook up some new symbols for ya with LED parcans, lower end movers, colorstrips, colorpalettes, what have you. Or maybe you'll beat me to it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bryan316 Posted January 22, 2009 Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 You have CAD again. Elation has .dwg files, GlobalTruss has .dwg files, I'm waiting to see the dream lighting rig in .dwg or .dxf format! (Probably printed to a .pdf file 'cause not many people on here can open .dwg or .dxf files). If I get over to the VectorWorks lab in the theatre dept. tomorrow, maybe I can cook up some new symbols for ya with LED parcans, lower end movers, colorstrips, colorpalettes, what have you. Or maybe you'll beat me to it... Dude.... you wanna prove to your boss that it's time for your machine to get upgraded? Just try turning on solid-shading when you have this much crazy {censored} going on! I can't even imagine once I start inserting light sources, coloring them, applying shadows, applying materials... it would take a week to render one image! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bryan316 Posted January 22, 2009 Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 Okay senor jardine, let's take a look. Your power supply is red. Your internal wiring and box assembly is all inside the gray phantom lines. Be careful to differentiate between the gray and the grey. Heh heh. One side of the stage is blue, the other yellow. YOU MUST USE THIS EXACT COLORING SCHEME! If not, a box of Crayolas will attack you in your sleep. Ever use one of those Brother P-Touch labelers? They're a genius invention for keeping your gear labeled and organized. Print out labels above each switch, at each plug, and print a looong one with the label twice, wrap it around the cables at each end, and stick em together to make a little flag. By the way, this works GREAT for drum mic cables. And for drum hardware. Especially if your drummer has a rack system. Now then, TO THE STAGE! Look at that stage. It's like 'Nam all over again. No it isn't. Can you see what I mean by setting your lights, running your cables, then bundling them together? It'll almost make it impossible for the wrong cable to get routed to the wrong location, cuz it just won't reach. I dunno how you plan to build your flood light fixtures, but include a dangly little female power plug. You don't want your snake attached to your fixtures. You wanna be able to unplug all fixtures and walk off with them, then get the snake after and bundle that up as you go. If you follow how the circuit works for your Master/FloodA/FloodB setup works, you COULD do the same for your strobes. Just needs one more separate run of power cable to the stage inside your snake. And trust me, after seeing DethkloK perform, having stereo strobes going off left to right ping-ponging is a MESMERIZING effect! Another thing. Have you considered getting some good switches from Radio Shack? They don't need to be toggle on-off switches. You could get momentary push-buttons so you hold the buttons down as you want the lights on. This way, as soon as you let go, they stop. Particularly effective if you want some dead-accurate strobes to go off in beat with the kick drum. Flicking switches aren't as accurate, but hey, it can still be done. Your choice. But going with those smaller, custom-designed switches makes for a tighter, more compact light control box. Again, your choice. Any questions, class? EDIT: Did I draw those plugs on the lights in reverse? Yes, I did draw those plugs on the lights in reverse. Because, you know of course, people manufacture lights with female plugs on them. To plug into male outlets in walls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members chrisjardine12 Posted January 22, 2009 Author Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 Sweet man! Thank you so much, I get it now, haha.But I do have a super-noob question that probably anyone could answer, but what is a lighting snake? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Nobody Told Me Posted January 22, 2009 Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 One side of the stage is blue, the other yellow. YOU MUST USE THIS EXACT COLORING SCHEME! Any questions, class? I have a question, sir. What if the stage I'm playing on isn't blue OR yellow? I don't want to be attacked by a box of crayons... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members chrisjardine12 Posted January 22, 2009 Author Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 I have a question, sir. What if the stage I'm playing on isn't blue OR yellow? I don't want to be attacked by a box of crayons... haha, that's why you always bring a bucket of paint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bryan316 Posted January 22, 2009 Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 A lighting snake is one of North America's fastest snakes. While not dangerous to man, their bite is quite painful and will.... Oh. 'scuse me. A snake is a simple term to regard any bundling of cables. Ever see those boxes on stage where the sound guy plugs {censored}-tons of microphones into? That box is connected to a snake. It's got a whooole bunch of wires inside it, running all the way back to the sound board. You could have a pedal snake, consisting of a cable running from a guitar amp's Effects Send, to a wah distortion chorus and maybe a delay, a power cable to power all those pedals so no batteries are needed, and another cable to go back to the Effects Return of the amp. If you bundle the send, power and return cables, you've snaked em together. There's 1.27 billion ways to create a snake. Audio, video, power, speaker level, line level, instrument level, bubble level, anything. The purpose of creating/building/buying a snake is to keep a whole bunch of lines cleanly packed together neat and tidy and easy to manage. How you wrap em together is all up to you. Here's a few examples of materials you can use: Cable Wrap It's just corkscrewed plastic. Wrap it around your cables. Flexible, easy, durable, cheap, non-permanent. Gets messy and dirty, takes a bitchin' long time to do the wrapping. Braided Cable Wrap Professional stuff. Very easy, very fast. EXPENSIVE. Good for short runs or custom work where appearance is key. Rigid Wire Loom Very abrasion-resistant, very cost-effective. Loud and crackly when flexed, needs zip ties to keep closed. Of course, there's the ol' electric tape method. But that's messy as hell. Since this is your first attempt and not exactly a detrimental executive-grade installation, just get the corkscrew wrap. Any hardware store sells it for cheap, or order it online in big 50-ft rolls to have plenty extra for future use. I recommend getting yellow. It's bright and will stand out on stage so performers see it and don't roll their ankle as they step on it. When you wrap it, stretch it a bit to leave a gap, and you'll get a cool hazard construction barrier effect as the black/yellow/black/yellow pattern shows. Oh, forgot to mention. I said to use 12 gauge for your control box's supply power line. Everything else after that you're good using 16 gauge, you're not pushing 1500 watts through every fixture, so using lighter thinner extension cords will make the wiring snake lighter and more flexible, and easier to carry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members chrisjardine12 Posted January 22, 2009 Author Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 A lighting snake is one of North America's fastest snakes. While not dangerous to man, their bite is quite painful and will.... Oh. 'scuse me. A snake is a simple term to regard any bundling of cables. Ever see those boxes on stage where the sound guy plugs {censored}-tons of microphones into? That box is connected to a snake. It's got a whooole bunch of wires inside it, running all the way back to the sound board. You could have a pedal snake, consisting of a cable running from a guitar amp's Effects Send, to a wah distortion chorus and maybe a delay, a power cable to power all those pedals so no batteries are needed, and another cable to go back to the Effects Return of the amp. If you bundle the send, power and return cables, you've snaked em together. There's 1.27 billion ways to create a snake. Audio, video, power, speaker level, line level, instrument level, bubble level, anything. The purpose of creating/building/buying a snake is to keep a whole bunch of lines cleanly packed together neat and tidy and easy to manage. How you wrap em together is all up to you. Here's a few examples of materials you can use: Cable Wrap It's just corkscrewed plastic. Wrap it around your cables. Flexible, easy, durable, cheap, non-permanent. Gets messy and dirty, takes a bitchin' long time to do the wrapping. Braided Cable Wrap Professional stuff. Very easy, very fast. EXPENSIVE. Good for short runs or custom work where appearance is key. Rigid Wire Loom Very abrasion-resistant, very cost-effective. Loud and crackly when flexed, needs zip ties to keep closed. Of course, there's the ol' electric tape method. But that's messy as hell. Since this is your first attempt and not exactly a detrimental executive-grade installation, just get the corkscrew wrap. Any hardware store sells it for cheap, or order it online in big 50-ft rolls to have plenty extra for future use. I recommend getting yellow. It's bright and will stand out on stage so performers see it and don't roll their ankle as they step on it. When you wrap it, stretch it a bit to leave a gap, and you'll get a cool hazard construction barrier effect as the black/yellow/black/yellow pattern shows. Oh, forgot to mention. I said to use 12 gauge for your control box's supply power line. Everything else after that you're good using 16 gauge, you're not pushing 1500 watts through every fixture, so using lighter thinner extension cords will make the wiring snake lighter and more flexible, and easier to carry. Ok cool man, thank you so much I really appreciate it. I'll post the results! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bryan316 Posted January 22, 2009 Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 In case you wanna buy it in bulk: http://www.cabletiesandmore.com/SpiralWrap.php SPW-250SP for 3/16" to 2" thick bundles, 100 ft roll, $13.60. That's a better price than when we did my lead guitarist's pedalboard snake. Was $25 for 50 feet! This website is getting BOOKMARKED!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bryan316 Posted January 22, 2009 Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 Ooooh... just found this stuff... If you finish the job, everyone keeps it, and it makes it through a couple gigs no problems, this would be a helluva upgrade for protection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members chrisjardine12 Posted January 22, 2009 Author Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 Ooooh... just found this stuff... If you finish the job, everyone keeps it, and it makes it through a couple gigs no problems, this would be a helluva upgrade for protection. yeah thats good stuff haha thank you for the other site =] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bryan316 Posted January 22, 2009 Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 No problem. Remember... Pics, or you didn't build it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members chrisjardine12 Posted January 22, 2009 Author Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 No problem.Remember...Pics, or you didn't build it! haha ill get some pics ASAP oh yeah, and do i just use 14/3 or 12/3 wire? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members soundlight Posted January 22, 2009 Members Share Posted January 22, 2009 Dude.... you wanna prove to your boss that it's time for your machine to get upgraded? Just try turning on solid-shading when you have this much crazy {censored} going on! I can't even imagine once I start inserting light sources, coloring them, applying shadows, applying materials... it would take a week to render one image! Yeah, our lab has brand new last year Apple machines - whatever the latest and greatest was then. I don't like working on macs, but damn those things are fast! 8 of 'em in the lab. Ahh, the joys of college. (Damn, the loans for college.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bryan316 Posted January 23, 2009 Members Share Posted January 23, 2009 My machine's about 2-1/2 years old. It smokes. Until I start processing a LOT of fine detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bryan316 Posted January 23, 2009 Members Share Posted January 23, 2009 haha ill get some pics ASAPoh yeah, and do i just use 14/3 or 12/3 wire? Be careful, when you say 14/3, you're asking for 14-gauge conductors, 3 leads AND a ground per cord, when you're looking at the rigid Romex-style stuff. I'd say normal grounded 14-ga cords will do nicely. Those lights aren't an entire bass rig. If you've got two floods at 250 watts each per run of cord, a 14-ga cord will be just fine. Heck, even 16 gauge would be good enough for a simple 500-watt draw. But you want trustworthiness. So stick with 14-ga stuff. You also don't really need that super-duper thick insulated stuff like contractor-grade cables. Go normal-duty so they're flexible and easy to manage. Cuz once you have four cables wrapped together, BULK! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members twostone Posted January 23, 2009 Members Share Posted January 23, 2009 As with anything, you don't always save money going the DIY route. There are other options you might want to look at: These FC-8 units have one switch/outlet with indicators to let you know what's on and can be had for well under $100, especially used. I've seen older units that incorporated dimming as well. For a little more money you get a little more control with the Chauvet Foot Master. gives you full on, blackout, and some chasing control. Basically an Eliminator ED15 and a Lite-Puter F-402. Available for Under $200 as a package, less if you buy individually and make your own connecting cables. Allows for turning individual dimmer pack channels on/off, setting scenes and switching between, and controlling chases. Dimmer packs can be chained so you can run them to other locations on stage and use the same foot controller. You can also toggle the channels for on/off vs. dimming... useful if you plan to control strobes or other fixtures and just want the power to come on. The second and third options cut down on your extension cable runs when going analog. The third uses dimmer packs that are also DMX ready if you make the transition. Of course, another option is to just go DMX. Although you're not really eliminating very many power cables, but they say it sure simplifies control. I'm leaning analog for the time being as well until I get enough DMX capable fixtures to justify the expense of the controllers. I've done the light switches under foot thing before... not fun to operate. The top is lot easier just plug your floods and strobes in the back of it and step on the button to turn on and off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bryan316 Posted January 23, 2009 Members Share Posted January 23, 2009 I was hoping someone would post more info about it or a link, cuz I have NO IDEA what it is. Trust me, I WAS interested... but I love building {censored} instead of buying it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members twostone Posted January 23, 2009 Members Share Posted January 23, 2009 Bryan just type in MTB 8 channel foot controller for some reason my PC ain't copying and pasting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bryan316 Posted January 23, 2009 Members Share Posted January 23, 2009 That provided me jack-squat. I'm getting tons of Marshall amp footswitches. That's it. Even tracing back to that Silverflight website doesn't tell say who makes that controller, just offers it for sale. I need DATA. Legit STATS. Maybe a PDF manual. I THINK it's made by American DJ. Will hunt through their goofy-bastard website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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