Members Rocinante Posted July 18, 2003 Members Share Posted July 18, 2003 I'm getting to the stage where I'm thinking of investing in a second-hand P.A. system for my newly-formed band. Now I have never owned a P.A. before in my life, and I'm finding the whole gamut of brands and models of gear available quite bewildering. I know Peavey are a good place to start, but I haven't got much else to measure them against. What I need is: a powered mixer for a small group - only requiring 3 channels for vocals and maybe a couple of channels to spare for miking/acoustic guitars, etc., a pair of main speakers, and one pair of suitable floor wedge monitors. Right now I only need something powerful enough for pubs and small clubs; I've no idea what that translates to in terms of power, but I want to make sure I've enough headroom for all the inputs without distortion. What about the monitors? I presume they only need to be rated for a fraction of the output of the main speakers? I'm hoping to pick all this stuff up on eBay, but I gotta make sure I'm getting stuff that's compatible. Any gear I should avoid? I'd really appreciate any advice and recommendations you guys can give me, so my band can get off to a good start. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rocinante Posted July 19, 2003 Author Members Share Posted July 19, 2003 Thanks muchly. How would you rate Carlsbro mixers? I ask because there's one on eBay right now that looks interesting. How common is it for mixers to have more than one monitor output? I envisaged using at least two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rocinante Posted July 19, 2003 Author Members Share Posted July 19, 2003 Originally posted by Audiopile I don't know of any powered mixers with multiple channels of monitor power... usually there's one (or none). I think Mackie has a three amplifier model with one dedicated monitor and two dedicated mains... and maybe one of the mains could be assigned to additional monitor duty... I dunno. OK, I'll take your advice re. eBay purchasing. Is it common for bands to use just one monitor then, or can you chain them together in series? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dirtyragamuffin Posted July 19, 2003 Members Share Posted July 19, 2003 I've used a Mackie 808S many, many times. Those things get pretty hot under a 2ohm load. I'd stop at two monitors if you can help it and see how things are. If it stays cool, add another one and see how it does. Use effeicient cabs if you can. You'll only get one monitor mix, but that's no different than most powered mixers. The 808 is a pretty decent box for what it is, I'd recommend it. I think Audiopile is talking sense about ebay. If you can get the gear locally, try that first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members OneEng Posted July 20, 2003 Members Share Posted July 20, 2003 I own an 808M and used it giging for 2 years a few years ago. It is a good little unit, but the 2 Ohm rating is pure marketing BS as is the 1600W rating it has at that impedance. The unit has 2 amps in it. The unit can be used as a seperate monitor amp and mains, or just mains with an amp for each side. When used in this "Main and Monitor" mode, I have found that 4 Ohm (generally 2 speakers) is as much as it can take. Additionally, you will lose some power when you do it. When I started micing drums and performing as a 5 piece, I had really overtaxed the poor thing. I have played quite large rooms with it though. It does a fine job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members groove.77 Posted July 20, 2003 Members Share Posted July 20, 2003 Originally posted by Audiopile Chain as many monitors as you want until you reach the ohm loading capacity of the amplifier. The Mackie 808 is rated down to 2 ohms, so in theory you could chain 4 ea. 8 ohm monitors on one output channel, although in practice you might find that not loading the amp beyond 2 or 3 monitors works better. PLEASE correct me if I'm wrong, but 4 8 ohm loads equals less than 2 ohms, I think. Doesn't 3 - 8 ohm speakers equal 2 ohms? One cab being 8 ohms, two being 4 ohms, three being 2 ohms? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members J. Posted July 20, 2003 Members Share Posted July 20, 2003 No, four 8 ohm cabs paralleled will give you a nominal impedence rating of 2 ohms. Three 8 ohm cabs will put you at approximately 2.67 ohms. Since I have a mathmatically weak mind, I have the equation mutated into this: 1/8+1/8+1/8+1/8=4/8. Flip the result and reduce to 2/1... or 2 ohms. Basically I take each 8 ohm speaker and turn it into a fraction (8/1). Then I take the reciprocal (is that right?) of each fraction and add them together. Flip the result and reduce to get your impedence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members groove.77 Posted July 20, 2003 Members Share Posted July 20, 2003 Thanks for the clarification. I hope I'm not sounding too newbyish here, but would I be able to run three monitors off of one side of my Behringer powered mixer? I'm thinking no, but if it's possible, it'd be a great help to my band. I've been trying to find a way to get a monitor back by my drummer for a while now. What about adding a 16 ohm speaker paralleled with two 8 ohm monitors? Would that be 3 ohms, or 6 ohms? All very confusing stuff...I suppose I should do a search and read up on ohmage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tlbonehead Posted July 20, 2003 Members Share Posted July 20, 2003 Originally posted by SoundtechSD Thanks for the clarification.I hope I'm not sounding too newbyish here, but would I be able to run three monitors off of one side of my Behringer powered mixer? I'm thinking no, but if it's possible, it'd be a great help to my band. I've been trying to find a way to get a monitor back by my drummer for a while now.What about adding a 16 ohm speaker paralleled with two 8 ohm monitors? Would that be 3 ohms, or 6 ohms? All very confusing stuff...I suppose I should do a search and read up on ohmage. It would be somewhere in the 3 ohm range,but the 8 ohm speakers would be louder than the 16 ohm model,assuming similar efficiencies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members groove.77 Posted July 21, 2003 Members Share Posted July 21, 2003 So will my Behringer handle a 2.6 ohm or a 3 ohm load without going thermal on me? I am (for obvious reasons) somewhat...hesitant to try it myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members abzurd Posted July 21, 2003 Members Share Posted July 21, 2003 I highly doubt that it will. My guess is that the mixer is rated to 4 ohms only. Even if Behringer said it was OK I still wouldn't risk it. Besides that, you will be getting very little power to each monitor (probably less than 100W each). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members MoosBros Posted July 21, 2003 Members Share Posted July 21, 2003 Originally posted by Audiopile From what little I know, I'd put the Carlsbro in the same catagory as the Crate, Rogue, Nady stuff.Seriously, don't shop on eBay unless you know your gear!!! I don't say this lightly as I happen to have 22 PA gear type items currently listed on eBay.I don't know of any powered mixers with multiple channels of monitor power... usually there's one (or none). I think Mackie has a three amplifier model with one dedicated monitor and two dedicated mains... and maybe one of the mains could be assigned to additional monitor duty... I dunno. the Yorkville powered mixer consoles have stereo main out amps, PLUS another monitor amp,,,, it has two monitor sends,,, a pretty nice mixer for an all in one unit....probably one of the nicest out there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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