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  • thinking about yamaha digital mixer

    HI I haven't posted in a long time, been very busy. Just purchased a whole new PA system except a mixer, still using a 32 channel mackie. Any one had any experiance with the digital mixers. are they worth the money and whats the learning curve. and would it be worth it to ad to my new system?

    THe new system consists of, this may help
    I don't have the parts numbers handy at this moment

    -12 EV QRX tops
    -12 EV QRX 2 18" subs
    -8 EV Qrx monitors
    -6 Crest CA 18 amps
    -8 Crest CA 9 amps, got one hell of a deal!!!
    -2 QSC 3402 amps
    -2 Ashley EQ's
    -4 DBX compressors
    -2 Bherienger compressors
    -3 tc electrics effects units
    -2 Ashley crossovers
    -MAckie 32 channel FOH
    -mackie 32 channel Monitor
    -almost all shure mics except for 4 Neuman mics for the vocalists
    -thats the basics

    I have used this system eight times and don't have one single complaint, wish I could afford JBL stuff. BUt this EV stuff works great even outdoors. lots of head room.
    -
    I'll live in a carboard box before I give up my guitar!!

  • #2
    What sized crowds are you playing to with that PA? I bet it sounds great!

    Ohhh...sorry nothing to offer on digital mixers.
    https://www.facebook.com/pages/Full-Steam/179028619290

    Comment


    • #3
      I have done a crowd of 1,200 people. hopefully can do up to 5,000 because I have a show outdoors this summer that will require that, and I went and spent my whole inheritence. the 1,200 person show was insanely loud and I wasn't pushing anything. The sub just killed. I have a friend in town with 4 more subs and tops I can borrow if needed
      I'll live in a carboard box before I give up my guitar!!

      Comment


      • #4
        Digital mixers for live, hmm.....

        Pluses:

        Fully para EQ on every channel, along with gates and comps.
        Built in EFX
        Smaller and lighter, generally
        Snapshot automation can be used to switch between multiple bands

        Minuses:

        Menus instead of knobs
        Layered faders (depending)
        Hosed if the board locks up requiring reboot
        Questionable roadworthiness (depending on model)
        Enough mike inputs?

        That first minus is a big one.

        Terry D.
        Telling Stories releases 2nd CD, see our WEBSITE! Please check out my GROUPIE STORY and Tales from the Road.

        Comment


        • #5
          any specific modle you where looking at?


          I see you have 2 32 channel mackies - are they for FOH and monitor?

          I don't know why you want to be jumping on to the digital area for? What do you want to gain?

          Have you considered a new analog board?

          just wondering what your motivation is, that is all.

          Kev.
          -token canadian

          Lest we forget: double-blind tests make audiophiles look twice as stupid. CRAIG V 2007

          Just for fun, what do you think would happen if you decided to take a nap in the fast lane of a freeway? agedhorse -2008

          Funny, I'll bet I have a good one sitting on my shelf. agedhorse -2008

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by DDAY
            I have done a crowd of 1,200 people. hopefully can do up to 5,000 because I have a show outdoors this summer that will require that, and I went and spent my whole inheritence. the 1,200 person show was insanely loud and I wasn't pushing anything. The sub just killed. I have a friend in town with 4 more subs and tops I can borrow if needed

            5000 people outside may be wishful thinking if you need any real volume. You might want think this through a bit before hand.

            You spent your whole inheritance on this? Hoope you have a good day job and employment prospects as the way to make a million dollars in the sound businessis to start with 2 million...
            -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
            Former product development engineer: Genz Benz, a KMC Music/Fender Musical Instruments Company, continuing factory level product support and service for Genz Benz

            Currently product development engineer: Mesa Boogie

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by DDAY
              HI I haven't posted in a long time, been very busy. Just purchased a whole new PA system except a mixer, still using a 32 channel mackie. Any one had any experiance with the digital mixers. are they worth the money and whats the learning curve. and would it be worth it to ad to my new system?

              THe new system consists of, this may help
              I don't have the parts numbers handy at this moment

              -12 EV QRX tops
              -12 EV QRX 2 18" subs
              -8 EV Qrx monitors
              -6 Crest CA 18 amps
              -8 Crest CA 9 amps, got one hell of a deal!!!
              -2 QSC 3402 amps
              -2 Ashley EQ's
              -4 DBX compressors
              -2 Bherienger compressors
              -3 tc electrics effects units
              -2 Ashley crossovers
              -MAckie 32 channel FOH
              -mackie 32 channel Monitor
              -almost all shure mics except for 4 Neuman mics for the vocalists
              -thats the basics

              I have used this system eight times and don't have one single complaint, wish I could afford JBL stuff. BUt this EV stuff works great even outdoors. lots of head room.
              -


              the most important question here is how much cash you have to spend on this. also what kind of bands are playing and do they have any rider reqiurements?

              i think your racks and stacks ought to do it for an enclosed kind of space. you really should be looking at a 15K$ minimun to match quality for a mixer with this system.

              edit: sorry didnt realize the outdoors part, you might have some issues, but it shouldnt be too bad.

              a digital mixer to run live sound for a real concert is going to run upwards of 60K. you really cant use the cheap little guys because you really need a large control surface to mix a large band.

              how are you eqing monitors? i assume you are going to stick with the mackie? are the ashlys for monitors and you are planning to go higher for foh?
              Originally posted by Old Steve Ok, so you're a friggin' ninja....that'll make this all the more simple.

              Comment


              • #8
                okay answers to questions

                I had seen the digital mixers and was just wondering about them
                THe mackies are for both foh and monitors
                I can get my hands on a midas venice used, Better choice?
                I will continue to use the mackie for monitors

                the outdoors situation, would the extra four subs and tops be enough or should I get a loan and get more and how many would you reccomend I need to add


                I want to start small and learn before really digging in my paws and getting somthing really huge. I could bear to add 8 more subs and tops with amps, If I really needed to the show in the summer is making it worthwhile for me
                I'll live in a carboard box before I give up my guitar!!

                Comment


                • #9
                  I cannot spend upwards of 60K thats for shure, so I guess the digital is out. and I do all kinds of local shows for blues, metal and some multiband shows.

                  MY monitor setup consists of DBX eq's 4 and 2 driveracks
                  I'll live in a carboard box before I give up my guitar!!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by DDAY
                    I cannot spend upwards of 60K thats for shure, so I guess the digital is out. and I do all kinds of local shows for blues, metal and some multiband shows.

                    MY monitor setup consists of DBX eq's 4 and 2 driveracks


                    could you shell out 15K for a decent analog board? i really think you would do better with an upper level A&H GL than anything digital.
                    Originally posted by Old Steve Ok, so you're a friggin' ninja....that'll make this all the more simple.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by DDAY
                      I cannot spend upwards of 60K thats for shure, so I guess the digital is out. and I do all kinds of local shows for blues, metal and some multiband shows.

                      MY monitor setup consists of DBX eq's 4 and 2 driveracks


                      If you are thinking of digital a yamaha 01V96 with a second adat card in the slot with 2 Behringer ADA8000 preamps will give you 32 analog preamps. This would be around $3000. Of course if you pick up the new M7CL at around $20,000 that would be great.

                      http://www.yamahaproaudio.com/products/mixers/m7cl/index.html

                      I don't know what your future plans are but digital desks seems to be the trend for the future. I am very glad I went with the 01V96 as it is a great sounding easy to use unit. I can store scenes for mulit band sound checks and for repeat bands and venues. The gates, compressors, delays, etc all are fine.
                      The 4 built in effects units are fine. With a little adjusting I have gotten some very good results.

                      With the Foh system you have seems a shame to have the foh desk perhaps not as good as it could be. ( Like now..... )
                      But to each his own.

                      Kindest Regards
                      Dookietwo

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        i was not aware of that new yamaha unit, if its really only 20K that should be a hot seller.

                        I really dont think the 01V96 with behringer a/d is appropriate here. if your doing reinforcement for a crowd of 5000 you really should be using proffesional gear. you can't skimp on quality. youve spent a lot of coin on the rest of your system, buy a desk to match it.
                        Originally posted by Old Steve Ok, so you're a friggin' ninja....that'll make this all the more simple.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          You are likely to find engineers that do not like working live on a console like that. Not very live-sound friendly unless you have absolute control of everything that happens around you. It can be a real disaster when the gid turns into a cluster-**************** free for all.
                          -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                          Former product development engineer: Genz Benz, a KMC Music/Fender Musical Instruments Company, continuing factory level product support and service for Genz Benz

                          Currently product development engineer: Mesa Boogie

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            We use 12 EV QRx 212's over 8 EV MTL-1's, and 8 EV 115's for monitors, all biamped with QSC PLX and RMX 4050's on the subs. Ashley EQ's, DBX Driverack, DBX comps and gates, TC effects, mostly Shure mics. It's strange how similar our systems are.

                            In any case, we have a 40 channel A&H ML3000 out front, and it does pretty well. It's a pretty small console, but it's pretty good for what it is. For small shows we can do 4 mixes from FOH, still with 4 effects. The VCA's are a nice addition, as is the variable high-pass filter. For a small VCA console, I don't think you can do better for the money.

                            I wuldn't mind seeing an ML4000 or 5000, or something along those lines. I'd also rather see a GL2800 than a Venice, I've never been a fan of that console. Not that it's a bad board, you just don't get what you pay for, IMO. And VCA's are always a good thing, but if you're not going to have VCA's, you have to have at least 8 subgroups.

                            The opener for a show we did last weekend was using a Mackie TT24 for monitors, mostly ears. It seemed to work really well, and the monitor guy, who was also the rhythm guitarist, apparently, was really happy with it. The headliner had PM5D's on FOH and Mons, and that worked well too (obviously). But I think for $7k, that Mackie might be something to think about. Other than that, you might want to think about a mid-priced VCA console, and maybe something better than a Mackie 32 on monitors too.

                            FWIW, we do crowds of 2,000-ish fairly regularly with our system, and it does pretty well. You could do 5,000 with it, but it's not the best choice. The mids on our 212 QRx boxes don't throw all that far, and the horns seem to bite a little when you push them. I'm also not a fan of the angled horn lens, but it helps a lot in certain circumstances. On the positive side, the boxes are fairly lightweight, and they array and couple really well. The rigging is also very useable. The QRx subs sound great, and throw pretty well. I wish we had those instead of our MTL-1's, but whatever. I find that the biggest issue is the horn on the tops. If you've got it pointing down, you've got to make sure the tops are up high enough. If you need to change them, it's a pain in the ass. And you can't just aim them straight out. Kind of sucks sometimes.

                            In my opinion, if you want to go the digital route, and want to go small, the TT24 might be a decent choice. If not, get a solid VCA desk, and you should be fine. We've had some bigger acts on our ML3000, and there haven't been any complaints. Sure, it's not the best, you could always use more EQ and auxes, and there's a few other things that could be better, but it's a great board for the money. All the engineers that have been on it knew what to expect, and knew that they could get the job done with it. And at the end of the day, that's all that really matters.

                            BTW, I think a 40 channel ML3000 goes for right around $10k.
                            B.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              ive never been a huge fan of the ML's, but i think the GLs are perhaps the best console ive expirienced for the cost. A GL4800 would be fantastic.

                              youve never really answered us, how much cash do you have?
                              Originally posted by Old Steve Ok, so you're a friggin' ninja....that'll make this all the more simple.

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