Members dewdman42 Posted June 20, 2009 Members Share Posted June 20, 2009 Ok, first of, please don't respond to this thread with comments about vocal lessons. I am just a backup singer, give me a break. I play in a rock band. I need something to help clean up my backup vocals a bit. I've heard of TC-helion VoiceCorrect, seems simple and inexpensive if it works, but it seems some people are elated about it and some people have had problems with it. I like the concept though. Basic simple. On the other hand it might be nice occasionally to be able to offer a harmonized part, but truthfully, its going to be rare that i need to do that. More often I just need to be on pitch, and make my mic sound better. Occasionally I have to sing in falsetto in order to hit harmony notes that are out of my range and it would be even better if I could make falsetto sound less falsetto. hah. I have also thought about picking up a used AVP-1, for roughly about the same price as a new TC Helion VoiceCorrect. It does a lot more, but its much older technology. Might be more robust on stage though and I like that its rack mount. What do you guys think about these processors. Forget the issue of taking a single awesome lead singer and giving him backups, that is not what I want. I am the backup. I just want to sound better with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted June 20, 2009 Members Share Posted June 20, 2009 Really, in spite of the fact that you don't want to hear it, some vocal coaching and practice will help your sound more than any processor can. More importantly, it will help your confidence and stage presence. All of the tradeoffs with the processing can make things sound worse, especially if you don't have somebody monitoring it's set-up and operation during sound check and then monitoring for mistracking and negative artifacts during the gig. You don't want to be on the receiving end of glitches as it often calls attention to how bad your singing really is. Makes it even worse. If you can handle this, then try a few to see if they work for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dewdman42 Posted June 20, 2009 Author Members Share Posted June 20, 2009 sure. What I don't want or need in this thread is a lecture about voice lessons. I need information about the various vocal processors. gracias. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tlbonehead Posted June 20, 2009 Members Share Posted June 20, 2009 wow, huh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members trevcda Posted June 20, 2009 Members Share Posted June 20, 2009 If you have excellent control over stage volume and what reaches your vocal mic, if you've got a sound man that stays at the board, knows how to use the equipment and can mix it and if you can use it tastefully so that it applies light vocal correction and not over quantized robot like correction (think Cher, Madonna and every rap artist that believes his own hype and thiks he can actually sing because a keyboard player is supplying the tracking melody for the vocal correction) then, yes, these processors can work fairly well. The problem is that they become a crutch and get over used to the point that it doesn't sound natural and makes monitoring difficult at best, particularly those stupid little floor boxes. I like some of the rack mounted gear as it will often have many more adjustable parameters to dial it in correctly. Evantide made some nice units. Of course there is a higher learning curve and cost involved. Now I'm gonna say it- get a really good monitor system and just learn how to sing or let someone else do the back ups if you are not capable. I wouldn't allow one on my stage Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dewdman42 Posted June 20, 2009 Author Members Share Posted June 20, 2009 so far absolutely nobody has answered my question. I am not going to respond anymore to people that feel they need to divert my question to their own gospel. I asked a simple question and explicitly asked people like you to NOT do what you are doing. But you can't help it I guess. hopefully in the future some people with experience regarding some of the aforementioned products will respond to the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members tlbonehead Posted June 20, 2009 Members Share Posted June 20, 2009 so far absolutely nobody has answered my question. I am not going to respond anymore to people that feel they need to divert my question to their own gospel. I asked a simple question and explicitly asked people like you to NOT do what you are doing. But you can't help it I guess. hopefully in the future some people with experience regarding some of the aforementioned products will respond to the thread.Getting better at singing is the best advice you are going to get. So you don't care if one of these units makes you sound worse yet, you just want to use one instead of practicing? BTW, you got very usefull advice above too on what it takes to make one of these usable and workable in a live environment. I suppose you'll just disregard that as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted June 20, 2009 Members Share Posted June 20, 2009 so far absolutely nobody has answered my question. I am not going to respond anymore to people that feel they need to divert my question to their own gospel. I asked a simple question and explicitly asked people like you to NOT do what you are doing. But you can't help it I guess. hopefully in the future some people with experience regarding some of the aforementioned products will respond to the thread. Just because you don't like the advice you get here doesn't mean that it's not the best advice. If you are asking about killing yourself and want to know if hanging or CP poisoning is the better way, I think advice reconsidering suicide is probably much better advice than either of the other options. If you don't like this place, just go away, it really won't hurt my feelings and probably others here too. What the world really doesn't need is yet another crappy vocalist... just like the world doesn't need another crappy egocentric guitarist. How about looking at IMPROVING? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted June 20, 2009 Members Share Posted June 20, 2009 My experience with the products you mention has been dreadful when used as you hope to use them. But why don't you prove it to yourself, you seem to be headed towards the bottom of the talent heap with your approach anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Crownman Posted June 20, 2009 Members Share Posted June 20, 2009 I had a buddy use an Antares for a while. It made hiskills worse and ended up as a crutch that he couldn't sing without. Also, since the sound was run from the stage it did more harm than good as it went all which a way. However, as an effect it's kinda fun to play with, SPARINGLY. I will admit that I did use one of these on my voice at 2 gigs. I was sick as hell, ears clogged up, and couldn't hold pitch for my life. But I decided to push through with one. Luckily I had a great friend that's been doing sound for a very long time at the controls. I sounded like crap but he made it barely passable to the drunkards for those two nights. If that situation came up again I would cancel the gigs instead of use it. You might as well have the singer record his own backing track and use that at the gigs. Then you could just mime away all night. I don't think you are going to find the answers you want in here. You don't want to better your abilities, you want to take the easy way out and try to cover up the lack of them. This is why you're getting the responses that your getting. Sorry, try posting this in the vocal forum and you'll probably get different answers. They might be the ones you're looking for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members moogieotter Posted June 20, 2009 Members Share Posted June 20, 2009 Get someone to record the backing that you like, then just use a sampler to play it back into the PA and pretend to sing along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RoadRanger Posted June 20, 2009 Members Share Posted June 20, 2009 What do you guys think about these processors.They are wicked cool and go to 11 for sure ! Screw all these guys that wasted all them years practicing and taking booring lessons - they just feel stoopid when for $1000 you can sound as good as any Rock Star just by pushing the "on" button ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Jerry007 Posted June 20, 2009 Members Share Posted June 20, 2009 On the other hand it might be nice occasionally to be able to offer a harmonized part, but truthfully, its going to be rare that i need to do that. More often I just need to be on pitch, and make my mic sound better. Occasionally I have to sing in falsetto in order to hit harmony notes that are out of my range and it would be even better if I could make falsetto sound less falsetto. hah. I can't quite parse this... but these processors can be used to correct pitch. The reason you're getting the type of response that you are from forum users: 1) The processors you mention will not, in any way shape or form, fix bad or sub-par singing. By your description, most are assuming that you're not a good singer. 2) These processors are very difficult to use in a live situation, especially by someone with little engineering talent/experience. Your post suggests you have little of either. 3) When asking for free help/advice, it's never a good idea to supply your own preconditions... For an example of real-time vocal processing gone wrong, google "Billy Joel Super Bowl" Take a listen to his pitch fluttering and sliding around... My guess is that your new processor will yield considerably worse results... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members jwlussow Posted June 21, 2009 Members Share Posted June 21, 2009 There's a very true saying in music. Are you ready for it? It's known from the best studios to the worst live shows. It "garbage in, Garbage out". You cant avoid it. There is no magic button that will fix intonation and phrasing. Please try them all. They do not work well unless you want to sound like a humanized robot and the more you use them the more you need them. Practice singing. That will make the most impact. You can buy a million dollar guitar but it won't sound any better then a Hondo if you dont know how to play chords. Practice makes perfect, whether you like or or not. You don't need our permission and it doesn't look like you will be getting many endorsements. If you want to use one, get it and prove us wrong. Don't get mad at us because we dont give you the answer you already expect us to give you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members trevcda Posted June 21, 2009 Members Share Posted June 21, 2009 Katy Couric rocks in this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members georgestrings Posted June 21, 2009 Members Share Posted June 21, 2009 They are wicked cool and go to 11 for sure ! Screw all these guys that wasted all them years practicing and taking booring lessons - they just feel stoopid when for $1000 you can sound as good as any Rock Star(tm) just by pushing the "on" button ! OK, now that's funny... - georgestrings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members abzurd Posted June 21, 2009 Members Share Posted June 21, 2009 I've used the hell out of vocal haromonizers for the last 8 years. I've only used correct functions in the last few weeks though, with the new VoiceLive2. It's used for ONE song where I'm looking for that Kanya/T-Pain sound. I don't like that style, but it's pretty cool as a change up effect. I use it for "Play That Funky Music" and it goes over well, but I digress. I just checked ou the VoiceTone Correct online and it basically took the correct and "auto-tone" features from the VL2 and put them in a cheaper box. IMO, you'll get more benefit from the automatic tone settings than the correction function, but if you want to try one out, just get the thing. I will say TC-Helicon is the way to go. They focus soley on vocal processors and their gear is a cut above the Digitech stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members mshifflett Posted June 22, 2009 Members Share Posted June 22, 2009 sure. What I don't want or need in this thread is a lecture about voice lessons. I need information about the various vocal processors. gracias. No one is trying to lecture you, but really step back and think about it. Before you stoop to that "correction" level, just give a vocal coach a shot and see what happens. If you still need the device, then go for it at that point. The correctors that I have heard live were not very pleasing to the ears. Even though the pitch was corrected, the by-products were horrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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