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  • noob here-amp used as monitor?

    I searched through many pages and couldn't find the answer. Can I use an amp (Fishman Loudbox) as a monitor and plug it into the mixer without damaging anything? If so, I have a monitor out on the mixer but wasn't sure what input to use on the amp. Appreciate any advice.

  • #2
    Yes, but be sure to use an isolating transformer and drop the signal down to mic level (passive DI will work well). You need isolation because most acoustic amps provide phantom power on the XLR inputs.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Former product development engineer: Genz Benz, a KMC Music/Fender Musical Instruments Company, continuing factory level product support and service for Genz Benz

    Currently product development engineer: Mesa Boogie

    Comment


    • #3
      I have a monitor out on the mixer but wasn't sure what input to use on the amp.


      Isn't the Loudbox a single channel (single instrument input) amp?

      Bob
      Veni, Vidi, Velcro;

      (I came, I saw, I stuck around)

      Comment


      • #4
        I'm also curious as to how I'd go about using my 2-channel AER Compact 60/2 as a monitor.

        For a solo performance, with acoustic-electric guitar and a vocal mic, I was thinking of plugging both into the combo-amp, mainly because I REALLY like the sound quality and reverb on this amp. The amp has a -20dBV D.I. out, but it's pre-FX/pre-Master.


        Is my only option then, to mic the cabinet and send that to the P/A? The amp also has a 0dBV Line-out, which is post FX/post Master.

        If I use the 0dBV Line-out, do I even need a mixer? or can I go straight into the main input of my powered speaker (NX55p)

        Thanks,

        Bob
        Veni, Vidi, Velcro;

        (I came, I saw, I stuck around)

        Comment


        • #5
          Generally, for an acoustic amp beingused with an acoustic instrument, the instrument will plug into the acoustic amp, and there will be a direct output that is seperate and is sent to the PA.

          I'm not clear on what you want to hear out of your "monitor" I guess?
          -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
          Former product development engineer: Genz Benz, a KMC Music/Fender Musical Instruments Company, continuing factory level product support and service for Genz Benz

          Currently product development engineer: Mesa Boogie

          Comment


          • #6
            I searched through many pages and couldn't find the answer. Can I use an amp (Fishman Loudbox) as a monitor and plug it into the mixer without damaging anything? If so, I have a monitor out on the mixer but wasn't sure what input to use on the amp. Appreciate any advice.

            If properly interconnected, my guess is that it will at best sound like a loud telephone (and be extremely feedback sensitive)... and if you're cool with that for your monitor needs... carry on.

            Comment


            • #7
              Thanks Andy,

              I was hoping to hear the same in my monitor, as FOH (the amps' reverb, on vox and instrument), but I also understand that there could be some potential for feedback issues??? The reverb on that combo-amp, is deeeelicious, but I use it very sparingly.

              My main desire/concern here, is for "travelling light"/ solo performance/ acoustic-elec guitar and vocal mic. Just my combo-amp, and one NX55p if possible.

              If I can avoid an external mixer for FOH, I'd like to do so, therefore, if I end up plugging my guitar and a vox mic into my combo-amp, then running FOH from the "D.I. out" on my combo-amp, I think I could go directly into the XLR mic-channel on the NX55ps' built-in pre-amp. Problem is (if I understand this correctly), that I'd have none of my amps' reverb at FOH. The combo-amps' "D.I. out", is pre-FX/ pre-Master.

              If I want that reverb at FOH, I'd either mic the combo-amp (mic into the NX55p's pre-amp), or, use my combo-amps' "line-out" (which is post FX/post Master) and run a cable into the NX55p's main input?, or should I use the "line-in" on the NX55ps' pre-amp?

              Does that make sense?

              Bob
              Veni, Vidi, Velcro;

              (I came, I saw, I stuck around)

              Comment


              • #8
                Thanks Andy,

                I was hoping to hear the same in my monitor, as FOH (the amps' reverb, on vox and instrument), but I also understand that there could be some potential for feedback issues??? The reverb on that combo-amp, is deeeelicious, but I use it very sparingly.

                My main desire/concern here, is for "travelling light"/ solo performance/ acoustic-elec guitar and vocal mic. Just my combo-amp, and one NX55p if possible.

                If I can avoid an external mixer for FOH, I'd like to do so, therefore, if I end up plugging my guitar and a vox mic into my combo-amp, then running FOH from the "D.I. out" on my combo-amp, I think I could go directly into the XLR mic-channel on the NX55ps' built-in pre-amp. Problem is (if I understand this correctly), that I'd have none of my amps' reverb at FOH. The combo-amps' "D.I. out", is pre-FX/ pre-Master.

                If I want that reverb at FOH, I'd either mic the combo-amp (mic into the NX55p's pre-amp), or, use my combo-amps' "line-out" (which is post FX/post Master) and run a cable into the NX55p's main input?, or should I use the "line-in" on the NX55ps' pre-amp?

                Does that make sense?

                Bob



                Yes, but generally on a well designed acoustic amp, the DI is post eq and effects for this reason.
                -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                Former product development engineer: Genz Benz, a KMC Music/Fender Musical Instruments Company, continuing factory level product support and service for Genz Benz

                Currently product development engineer: Mesa Boogie

                Comment


                • #9
                  In a normal situation though, when you're sending to a FOH mixer, vs sending directly to a powered speaker, wouldn't you want the "D.I. out" to be pre-eq and FX, so those can be added by the FOH engineer?

                  I ask this question in regard to the op's post, where he said he'd be using a FOH mixer. He didn't state whether his mixer had FX, nor how many channels it has. Presumably , he's folding back to his combo-amp/monitor. I was hoping to show him some other options, in case his Fishman Loudbox, is actually the two-channel Fishman Loudbox Performer. He had asked, "which input I should use", so I presumed he has the 2 channel amp. The Loudbox, has only 1 instrument input.

                  Bob
                  Veni, Vidi, Velcro;

                  (I came, I saw, I stuck around)

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    It's the Fishman Loudbox 100 with one instrument, one mike input. I think that my question has already been answered about using the isolating transformer. I think I'm better off using a monitor speaker. Thanks to all for your responses.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      In a normal situation though, when you're sending to a FOH mixer, vs sending directly to a powered speaker, wouldn't you want the "D.I. out" to be pre-eq and FX, so those can be added by the FOH engineer?

                      I ask this question in regard to the op's post, where he said he'd be using a FOH mixer. He didn't state whether his mixer had FX, nor how many channels it has. Presumably , he's folding back to his combo-amp/monitor. I was hoping to show him some other options, in case his Fishman Loudbox, is actually the two-channel Fishman Loudbox Performer. He had asked, "which input I should use", so I presumed he has the 2 channel amp. The Loudbox, has only 1 instrument input.

                      Bob


                      No, not necessicarily.

                      IF effects are important to the playability of the amp (ie. playing off of the effects) and the eq is used constructively (rather than stupidly), there's no problem. That's the way we configured our amps that went out on tour with the Eagles. In their case, IIRC, FOH received a dry signal but the monitor system and amp themselves used the effects on board. On the amp modles they use, there's both options available on 3 XLR outs... ch 1 dry, ch 2 dry and ch 1+2 wet especially for this purpose.
                      -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                      Former product development engineer: Genz Benz, a KMC Music/Fender Musical Instruments Company, continuing factory level product support and service for Genz Benz

                      Currently product development engineer: Mesa Boogie

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Thanks Andy, that sounds like a great amp. Was there ever a version offered to the public?

                        As I've mentioned in previous posts, Tommy Emmanuel uses the same amp I do, the AER Compact 60/2. I'm not certain if he used the amps' reverb when I saw him at the Montreal International Jazz Festival a few years back. I know he sometimes uses an old Alesis MicroVerb, but I didn't see that unit. He simply had his Compact 60/2 on the stage, off to his left, miced to FOH, with a Korg Earthworks(???) DTR 2000 tuner, sitting atop his amp, and his Maton guitar which he calls "Mouse", the Mouse that roared. In the studio, he uses an AER Domino, which is basically, two Compact 60's, in a single cabinet. 4 channels.

                        What amazes me most about the AER's, is the clarity of the vocal channel. Blows me away every time I hear it. No coloration whatsoever. It uses an 8" coaxial speaker btw. It's this amp which first got me interested in an EAW (Radian) MicroWedge. I'd kill to try one out. It also uses a coaxial speaker, and I'm wondering why we don't see this type of speaker, used more often for monitors.

                        I once auditioned AER's flagship amp, the AER Acousticube III, but never tried singing thru it. Helluva nice sounding amp though, but north of $3k, and the Compact 60/2 gives me all I need and then some. AER does offered powered satellites designed to work specifically with the Compact 60 (The AG-8), but they're very pricey as well. ($900.)

                        http://dreamguitars.stores.yahoo.net/aeracam.html

                        Lately, I've also started reading about the Renkus-Heinz IC-Live Looks very interesting.

                        http://www.renkus-heinz.com/products/products.html

                        Bob
                        Veni, Vidi, Velcro;

                        (I came, I saw, I stuck around)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Yes, the current model is: http://www.genzbenz.com/?fa=detail&mid=2145&sid=420&cid=94.

                          IIRC, when I last worked with Tommy, he went direct. Whatever effects he used on stage was what he used. Sounded fantastic. I'll have to see if I have the rider and maybe what he used is on there.
                          -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                          Former product development engineer: Genz Benz, a KMC Music/Fender Musical Instruments Company, continuing factory level product support and service for Genz Benz

                          Currently product development engineer: Mesa Boogie

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Thanks Andy,

                            I was hoping to hear the same in my monitor, as FOH (the amps' reverb, on vox and instrument), but I also understand that there could be some potential for feedback issues??? The reverb on that combo-amp, is deeeelicious, but I use it very sparingly.

                            Bob


                            I tried this for a while with my Genz Benz Shen 60LT. I ran a line out of my PA (guitar and vox) to my amp for a stage monitor. I was never happy with it. Very feedback prone. The monitor on my PA was post EQ. Between the channel settings, the monitor output's 9 band EQ, and the amp EQ, I think it was just one too many EQ settings that could potentially cause feedback. I could never get it right.

                            I quit using it now. I got a TC Helicon VoiceSoloXT and I am MUCH happier.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              With any acoustic instrument, you must know what you are doing as there is plenty of opportunity to screw it up. With eq and effects, less is generally more. Also, knowing when you are getting into trouble is part of avoiding it. Guitar pickups and mic selection both factor into the GBF equation as well.

                              The Eagles of course have the advantage of a really good monitor system and guys who know their stuff.
                              -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                              Former product development engineer: Genz Benz, a KMC Music/Fender Musical Instruments Company, continuing factory level product support and service for Genz Benz

                              Currently product development engineer: Mesa Boogie

                              Comment



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