Members Coaster Posted May 10, 2010 Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 i'm trying to build a bracket to hold a pair of mics in a mid side configuration. i dont have it figured out yet but i do have a couple ideas. digging through my pile of remnant stands and related para (people give me their old broken stands - i usually have a pile of about 10 or so that the hardware is busted) i'm seeing a few patterns on the tube sizes and threads. the tube sizes (with the 5/8" 27 threads) seem to be made from plain old 1/2" pipe (approx 19/32 or 5/8 diameter) but seem to be turned down a little (smaller diameter) on the thread area. not all, but most of the pile i have. i've seen 1/2" copper pipe at the BORGs but never that size of steel or aluminum. i dont imagine copper is a great building material for stands. is there steel pipe that size? i have enough tubes in my pile to make generally what i need, but does anyone know what the stand makers are using for bulk tubes? i'm thinking seriously about making my MS bracket out of copper because i will need to weld some tabs on it, i havent figured out a good way to attach it so my stand though (yet). if i could find steel (not crap pot metal like the tubes i have) i would use that instead - copper might be the wrong material. i'm doing so much recording that i am working hard to simplify my setup and i am getting really tired of setting up the same MS pair on a pole over and over. seems to take about ten minutes each time to get it just right with my old clamps. i did have a quick MS setup at one time i made out of a boom i cut down and slipped into a boom clutch, but the clutch eventually broke off the end of my tall aluminum stand. i'm thinking about a tube that slips over the 1/2" tube with a setscrew in it to tighten it. i do have a 5/8 27 tap and die but have not done much with them except clean up damaged thread on already made stands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Rezrover Posted May 10, 2010 Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 Something like this: http://pro-audio.musiciansfriend.com/product/Musician%27s-Gear-Double-Microphone-Attachment?sku=451066 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Coaster Posted May 10, 2010 Author Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 no, needs to be vertical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members slipslick Posted May 10, 2010 Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 Sweetwater has an On Stage side mount boom that mounts on the tube of a stand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members dennis a Posted May 10, 2010 Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 How about this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted May 10, 2010 CMS Author Share Posted May 10, 2010 EMT (electrical metal tubing) is galvanized steel and commonly called "thinwall conduit". The 1/2" variety might be close to the dimensions you're looking for. Certainly easy to find and cheap enough to experiment with. If you clean it with solvent and hit it with some 220-grit, it can be primed and painted fairly well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members IsildursBane Posted May 10, 2010 Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 no, needs to be vertical. Get a longer one and put an elbow adapter on it. The design of this is going to be dependent upon the particular mics you want to use. Two side-address LDC's are going to need a different mount than a combo of end address SDC + side-address LDC's, which is going to need a different mount than those miniature Schoeps CCM mics. Mics shaped like lollipops are going to need a different mount than mics that are merely cylindrical. I've successfully used Sabra-som mounts with some long-ish Microtech Gefell mics to get an M/S configuration. The Sobrasom mount has a swivel, and if your mic clips are also swiveled (which they generally are), you can maneuver it into just about any stereo configuration you can think of, assuming that the mics themselves aren't too big to fit. It won't look pretty, but it'll get the job done. The Sobrasom mounts look and feel kind of cheesy, but hold better than you'd expect. -Dan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted May 10, 2010 Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 There are standard tubing and pipe sizes. Tubing is generally sized using outside diameters and pipe using inside diameters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Coaster Posted May 10, 2010 Author Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 conduit is interesting; the energy involved in bending it shouldnt be experienced with what i am going to be doing with it but as far as i know one cannot weld to galvanized metal. might come in handy though and i can find that at BORG. i'll try and take a pic of my setup tonight if i can. its so simple; literally a vertical tube that the shockmounts clamp onto. and i really can afford the ten minutes it takes to make sure they are in the right spot and the clamps wont fall off (they have been rebuilt but are old and a little rickety) but as many of you already know if you have 25 things to do and some are 5 to 10 minutes....well then shaving off any of them improves your time +flexibility and lowers stress. i've shaved off a lot - what used to take me 65 minutes now can be done in about 25. i could get that down even more with a quick MS setup like i had before (it worked really slick till the aluminum tube cracked) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members IsildursBane Posted May 10, 2010 Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 conduit is interesting; the energy involved in bending it shouldnt be experienced with what i am going to be doing with it but as far as i know one cannot weld to galvanized metal.might come in handy though and i can find that at BORG. What mics are you using? -Dan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted May 10, 2010 Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 but as far as i know one cannot weld to galvanized metal. Sure you can, just don't breathe while doing so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMS Author Craig Vecchione Posted May 10, 2010 CMS Author Share Posted May 10, 2010 conduit is interesting; the energy involved in bending it shouldnt be experienced with what i am going to be doing with it but as far as i know one cannot weld to galvanized metal. It can be welded. Use a silicone bronze or aluminum bronze electrode. With other electrodes the zinc stays separated and is drawn into the center of the weld, forming centerline cracks. The copper base of the bronze electrodes will dissolve the zinc. It is imperative that you use excellent air extraction/ventilation when welding galvanized metals. The fumes are highly toxic. The welded area will need coating, as the silicone or aluminum broze weld is cathodic relative to the steel which makes the weld corrode faster than even the adjacent unprotected steel. Paint containing zinc is a good choice here, even if it's not gonna look "rock 'n roll";). You can always overcoat that with black. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted May 10, 2010 Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 Or just sand through the galvanized coating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Coaster Posted May 10, 2010 Author Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 Or just sand through the galvanized coating. hadnt thought of that. is it just mild steel under there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BillESC Posted May 10, 2010 Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 How about a couple of these? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted May 10, 2010 Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 hadnt thought of that. is it just mild steel under there? Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Coaster Posted May 10, 2010 Author Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 thats exactly what i have bill. they are not bad, but tend to mark up aluminum tubes really bad so i put a strip of gaff tape over the tube every time. what i would like to have eventually is a tube with welded tabs on it that the shockmounts mount directly to without any of the 5/8 27 type of connection. also i would like to have the center of gravity shifted back towards the center of the main pole so the stand doesnt bow when raised above 12' like it does now. i had something that did this with the boom clutch setup, and maybe thats an idea but the clutch broke the aluminum tube of my main stand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BillESC Posted May 10, 2010 Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 I take it you're trying to record stereo from the FOH position? This would work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Coaster Posted May 10, 2010 Author Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 no, that wouldnt work for MS with what i have. i do have a bar like that, and i have a few other strange doodads like a vertical bar for XY/ORTF/etc. i'm recording small and large ensembles with mics right up at the stage. for rock band stuff i dont bother with the room, i just use a lincoln box type audience mics with everything else split and maybe some extra mics to boot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members BillESC Posted May 10, 2010 Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 Crappy picture but how about this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Coaster Posted May 10, 2010 Author Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 no. needs to be vertical. think of a stick stand with nothing on the end where those atlas clamps clamp on to the stick part of the stand, one over the other. ultimately a person doesnt need a bracket/contraption to do this, you can just use any vertical stand. it just takes about 10 minutes to gaff the stand and adjust the clamps so the mics are right, plus the stand has a bad CG like this and so it bows if raised too high. what i did before was take a normal boom clutch and screwed it on the end of my tall aluminum stand. then i used a cut down tube that fit into the boom clutch. the mics stayed attached to the short tube, and the tube ran parallel to the main stand and went above it - then the mics were centered over the main stand and the CG was good so the main stand didnt bow. problem was after about a month of this the aluminum tube cracked at the threads so i stopped doing it. i guess it was too much stress on the threads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members IsildursBane Posted May 10, 2010 Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 What mics are you using and what mounts are you using with them? -Dan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Coaster Posted May 10, 2010 Author Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 cad M179 and the shock mounts that come with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Coaster Posted May 10, 2010 Author Members Share Posted May 10, 2010 i have a show i am off to right now, i grabbed the camera and i will take pictures of my setup and possible the old setup if i can find it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Coaster Posted May 11, 2010 Author Members Share Posted May 11, 2010 ok, i set this up tonite at the show. the wires are sloppy; sorry. this is what i am doing: see how curved the stand is when i raise it? i often have to go higher than this. it is really pronounce in person, on camera it doesnt look to curved. heres the dark photo without flash. it is blurry. my wifes camera is setup for auto everything and i dont like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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