Tell me why this is a bad idea...

[stix 518]

Several months back, I asked about an opportunity where I could purchase a pair of Peavey SP4G cabs. At that time, I was told it was a lateral move vs. my Carvin TR1503 cabs and passed.

 

Well, they're still available and at a fire sale price (like $150 or less a cab). Here's my thinking and I once again need the advice and counsel from those far more knowledgeable than me.

 

(I can see the face palms and eyes rolling now! )

 

Let's say I grab these Peaveys and use them as my mains - run them off my PLX 3002 in stereo (900w/side @ 4 ohms) with the DRPA crossover set at 100hz. Then sell the 1503's for what I can get for them (couple hundred? Maybe even money for the Peaveys). Or I could sub-mix/aux send my subs with the 100hz high pass filter engaged on the board for everything but bass and kick (and perhaps keys) and do away with the DRPA all together, and run full signal and simply use the internal crossover in the Peavey's for seperation, no? In any case, aren't the Peaveys a better cab than the Carvins (seeing as there aren't many Carvin fans here to begin with)?

 

I've done a little research over at the Peavey website regarding the "quasi-three way" and the lower 15" sub being a waste in the set-up with the DRPA/crossover, etc. If the consensus is to go for this, maybe someone here could explain to me the best way to make it all work.

 

I don't have the necessary bucks for what I really should get at this point per the recommendations here and it will be a little bit of time before I do but wouldn't this be at least a temporary small step up if done correctly, for little or no additional money (and maybe cash back if I can sell the DRPA)? Can't see where I'd lose money on the back end with selling the Peaveys when the big step up comes. Should I make the move or just stick with what I got till/if I can drop "real" money for the transition. I'm confused

 

Stix

[Coaster]

i like the sp4g. i think they sound pretty good; not excellent, but darn good.

 

they're big and heavy. you need to get the HF at the right height somehow.

[stix 518]

sitting atop the TR1801's should put them up high enough, no?

[Craig Vecchione]

The price change doesn't make this less of a lateral move than it was before. No facepalms or rolleyes, though. It's just not a move worth making.

[Vinny D]

Pull the Carvin name plates off the TR1503 cabs, you will be amazed at how much better they will sound.

 

Kind of a waste of time & money to do a move that really is no upgrade at all.

Again, I just worked with a bunch of TR1503 cabs and I was pleased with there performance.

If you want an upgrade to your current system change out the subs, the TR1801 subs are pretty weak, just about anything would outperform them.

[jwlussow]

How much are they asking for the SP4Gs? It is a lateral move but you might be able to make a few bucks just turning the Peaveys around. While soundwise it doesn't make sense, you might be able to sell the Peaveys for more then you pay for them. I wouldn't buy the Peaveys unless I already had a buyer for them. You might be able to dump the Carvin on some unsuspecting high school band. Overall, I wouldn't waste my time with such a lateral move. The Peaveys will not sound any better then your Carvins and neither (as you have probably realized) has any real resale value. If you want to pick up the SP4Gs as backups or additional cabs, that might work but you never really told us how much they are charging for the Peaveys.

[stix 518]

I had to re-read my original post... Second paragraph:

 

Well, they're still available and at a fire sale price (like $150 or less a cab). . I can grab them both for around $300.

 

Stix

[jwlussow]

Sorry. I missed that. I guess it depends on what you are looking for. They will not enhance the sound but you might be able to use all the cabs (with proper EQ and power. If you want to switch you are wasting your energy as the difference will not be earth shattering. Would you pay $300 to keep the same sound you already have? If it is to have additional cabs available for larger shows and you can get them to play well together (good luck) then it is a no brainer. Great price for good cabs. If you want to replace your Carvins, it is probably a waste of time and money. Give me $300 and I'll take the Carvin nameplate off your cabs and people might think you sound better (to paraphrase Vinny D).

[RoadRanger]

I just worked with a bunch of TR1503 cabs and I was pleased with there performance. If you want an upgrade to your current system change out the subs

+1

the TR1801 subs are pretty weak, just about anything would outperform them ...

... except PV118's or Yammy clubs . Probably about the same as those.

[stix 518]

Survey SEZ!

 

buuuuuuuzzzzz!

 

It's a pass. I guess it wouldn't even make sense if they were giving them away as far as improvement. Guess I'll just wait and make the right move at the right time.

 

As always, thanks guys. Really do appreciate your input!

 

Stix

[jwlussow]

Good choice. Wait for a real upgrade.

[Vinny D]

+1 ... except PV118's or Yammy clubs . Probably about the same as those.

 

I think I would rather have those then the TR1801

The TR1801 just has no getup and go to them.

It seems like the drivers have very little to no excursion at all in them, it doesn't take much to bottom the drivers out and make them start making real ugly unwanted noises

You have to be VERY carefull with how much power you give them.

 

Put a real set of subs under the TR1503's and it would make a pretty nice system.

The mid driver is very aggressive sounding in the cab and takes a little EQ'ing to smoothen out, but once you find the ear piercing frequencies the cab really does sound much better.

Very easy to get vocals to come alive with the TR1503, again, it's probably the best PA cab Carvin ever made......and I have tried a bunch of there stuff.

[stix 518]

Thanks for the heads-up, Vinny. Will start to look for a nice set of subs to go with the 1503's and try to tweek them with some eq'ing. Any suggestions on what/which suspect frequencies would help smooth the cabs out - knowing full well that there are a lot of variables that enter into the equation. But I do know, after spending time here, there are certain cabs that have particular consistent weaknesses, regardless of the other variables. Same with these??

 

Stix

[RoadRanger]

The TR1801 just has no getup and go to them. It seems like the drivers have very little to no excursion at all in them, it doesn't take much to bottom the drivers out and make them start making real ugly unwanted noises You have to be VERY carefull with how much power you give them.

Just curious how much power you find that they can take? The OP is running them bridged off a PLX3002 and says they aren't protesting

[Vinny D]

 

Thanks for the heads-up, Vinny. Will start to look for a nice set of subs to go with the 1503's and try to tweek them with some eq'ing. Any suggestions on what/which suspect frequencies would help smooth the cabs out - knowing full well that there are a lot of variables that enter into the equation. But I do know, after spending time here, there are certain cabs that have particular consistent weaknesses, regardless of the other variables. Same with these?? Stix

 

 

It's not a system I have access too to as I only helped someone set it back up so it could be used again.

I know I took a picture of the EQ when I got done so the owner could use it as a reference point if he messed it up to bad, I will check when I get home too see if I still have it.

[Vinny D]

Just curious how much power you find that they can take? The OP is running them bridged off a PLX3002 and says they aren't protesting

 

They really can't take much more then 4-500watts.

I was using a Carvin DCM2000 on them, tried it in bridge mode and parallel mono..........pretty much same results either way.

I don't trust Carvins wattage numbers as I feel they are way inflated but, supposedly in bridge mode it's 2000w @ 4ohms.

So each sub was getting 1000w, couldn't get anywhere near clipping the amp without speakers wanting to jump out of the cab.

Set it in parallel mode which I believe is somewhere around 450 @ 8ohms, seemed to be about the same volume level as when in bridged mode and still had the speakers jumping and bottoming out before any clipping happened.

 

I had the subs crossed at 90hz with a slight cut at 100hz (even though they were crossed at 90 the cut at 100 still effected the sub greatly)

I then pretty much dropped everything from 50hz down as the sub would never produce anything below that anyway.

 

The subs are old (10 years or so??) and I have know idea how much they were abused, the drivers seemed pretty tired and weak in them. The overall sound of the sub box itself was not that impressive, this was Carvins copy of what JBL had offered around the same time.....and the equivalant looking JBL sub was never that impressive either IMO.

 

They worked enough to make the owner happy (he had 6 of each TR1503/TR1801) we where only using 1-pair and we tried to pick the best cabs out of what he had.

[agedhorse]

Just curious how much power you find that they can take? The OP is running them bridged off a PLX3002 and says they aren't protesting

 

That's what he thinks, but actuality may prove otherwise

 

IME, about 600 watts RMS per driver is just about at the mechanical limits and that assumes a 40Hz (steep) HPF. Without a HPF, maybe 300-400 watts.

[Vinny D]

That's what he thinks, but actuality may prove otherwise IME, about 600 watts RMS per driver is just about at the mechanical limits and that assumes a 40Hz (steep) HPF. Without a HPF, maybe 300-400 watts.

 

The drivers in the boxes I was setting up didn't seem like they could handle anything above the 450w @ 8ohms the DCM2000 was putting out, the drivers looked and sounded like they were going to launch themself at any time

[RoadRanger]

That's what he thinks, but actuality may prove otherwise

Yah, I'm suspecting that too .

 

Hey Stix, just so's we ain't talkin' behind your back the inside joke is we get a lot of folks stop by here that think they are bridged when they aren't and/or have the DR limiters set way too low (or high). With 1500w into each of them drivers they should making all sorts of LOUD bad noises and/or shredding/burning up. Somethin' ain't right there...

[jwlussow]

I've seen a handful of noobs think that dual mono is the same as bridging. They did not realize that they needed to physically change they way things were plugged in and switch the amp to "bridged" mode. If you are plugging the cables in the way you normally do, you are not bridged (that is a good thing).

[stix 518]

I don't know, guys. I'm pretty sure I've got them in bridged mono - single feed in (off the summed out low on the DRPA) into channel 1 on the amp. banana clip to the two red connectors - bridged mono dipswitches on on the back.

 

RR, you should plan a trip down just to check out my set-up (and help me set it up right, perhaps?). Maybe I'm just a total f-up (it's been said ! ) and not doing what I think I'm doing (which may be a good thing nonetheless).

 

Vinny, I would be interested in seeing that pix just for reference.

 

BTW, my cabs and subs aren't tired looking. Actually, they don't look like they've been used much at all.

[Vinny D]

 

Vinny, I would be interested in seeing that pix just for reference. .

 

 

Here is the link to the cell phone pic of the EQ settings I ended up with: http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b107/139vinny/Service/TR1503-TR1801EQ.jpg?t=1273621937

 

I kept the low pass filter on the EQ at 50hz, the subs don't have much to offer below that anyway.

The mid driver in the TR1503 needs some calming down...as you can see in the pic, but once you smoothen out the mid driver that cab sounds pretty nice.

Again, I kept the subs crossed at 90hz.

[Gordon Sound]

Can you try them out? maybe you will like them better. For under $300 I would just buy them for spares. The componants are worth $300 even if you just take out the bits and ebay them. You might like them better than what you have and cant really lose on the deal.

[RoadRanger]

RR, you should plan a trip down just to check out my set-up (and help me set it up right, perhaps?). Maybe I'm just a total f-up (it's been said ! ) and not doing what I think I'm doing (which may be a good thing nonetheless).

Sure, I'm not all that busy this month - PM me when you've got some time to play.

 

I'll bring a conventional crossover and a "heavy iron" 1450 amp to bridge into them subs just for laughs (700w each, about max safe without a DSP). We can A/B it pretty easy if we "Y" the output of your board so we can feed both crossovers and sub amps simultaneously then just move the banana plugs back and forth . Your garage have earthquake insurance?

[stix 518]

hahaha, the rig is actually in my finished basement - acoustical ceilings. I've had it loud enough to where stuff fell off shelves and snow fell from the tiles!

 

Wife and I are taking a long weekend away this weekend to celebrate our birthdays. I'll PM you next week Tuesday to try and schedule something. Sounds like fun! (And maybe I'll learn something - I hope!).

 

Stix