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  • Adding sub bass to kick drum

    Hello,

    I am currently putting together a new band. I want to use the sound company that my former band used. Everything was great with this sound co. except we felt like the low end was missing especially on the kick drum. The sound guy stated that he can only reproduce what is sent to him via the kick mic. We want low end kick like you would hear on a modern rock recording or at a modern rock concert. Ive done some recording at home at with my experience, I have to add the sub bass to the kick to get this modern sound. EQ alone will not do it.



    So my question is, is there any hardware that will add sub bass frequencies to the kick that can be used live? Or any other tricks we can try? I dont know what the specifics are on this sound co's equipment. But I can tell you that when you play CD's through it, the bass is there.

  • #2
    Begin by tuning the kick. If that doesn't work, next step... tune the kick!



    After that, a decent mic and a PA with a sub is all that is nessessary (other than tuning the kick! )
    Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment. -Will Rogershttp://facebook.com/SpitShineRocks

    Comment


    • #3






      Quote Originally Posted by lovegun
      View Post

      Hello,

      I am currently putting together a new band. I want to use the sound company that my former band used. Everything was great with this sound co. except we felt like the low end was missing especially on the kick drum. The sound guy stated that he can only reproduce what is sent to him via the kick mic. We want low end kick like you would hear on a modern rock recording or at a modern rock concert. Ive done some recording at home at with my experience, I have to add the sub bass to the kick to get this modern sound. EQ alone will not do it.



      So my question is, is there any hardware that will add sub bass frequencies to the kick that can be used live? Or any other tricks we can try? I dont know what the specifics are on this sound co's equipment. But I can tell you that when you play CD's through it, the bass is there.




      http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=...9QEwBw&dur=560

      Comment


      • #4






        Quote Originally Posted by lovegun
        View Post

        Hello,

        I am currently putting together a new band. I want to use the sound company that my former band used. Everything was great with this sound co. except we felt like the low end was missing especially on the kick drum. The sound guy stated that he can only reproduce what is sent to him via the kick mic. We want low end kick like you would hear on a modern rock recording or at a modern rock concert. Ive done some recording at home at with my experience, I have to add the sub bass to the kick to get this modern sound. EQ alone will not do it.



        So my question is, is there any hardware that will add sub bass frequencies to the kick that can be used live? Or any other tricks we can try? I dont know what the specifics are on this sound co's equipment. But I can tell you that when you play CD's through it, the bass is there.




        What's the bass drum mic your using?

        Comment


        • #5
          It would help to know what he was using. You should be able to get plenty of thump out of a kick drum with a good PA.

          Comment


          • #6
            Is your sound guy named Wyn? Just asking.



            Any decent PA with subs should be able to get what you want. The question then becomes "is there enough rig for the gig?"



            Low end is one of the most difficult things to get right because the demands on speakers and AC power are high. If you don't have enough gear, or enough current to run the gear, low end won't happen.

            Comment


            • #7






              Quote Originally Posted by lovegun
              View Post

              ...Ive done some recording at home at with my experience, I have to add the sub bass to the kick to get this modern sound. EQ alone will not do it...




              This comment is why I am suggesting that the OP start by looking at the kick drum, not the PA.
              Good judgment comes from experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment. -Will Rogershttp://facebook.com/SpitShineRocks

              Comment


              • #8
                ^ I completely agree with you. You can't amplify what isn't there. Didn't mean to imply those posts above were wrong. The FIRST thing to look at is the drum.

                Comment


                • #9
                  To actually add "sub" bass you'll need to gate an oscillator using the kick drum as a trigger. You can probably get the effect you want with a peak/dip EQ (as opposed to a shelving eq which is typical on a mixer) and a compressor much more easily.
                  Don Boomer

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The mic is a Shure Beta 52A. The only reason I think the PA is sufficient is because when we play CD's through it, the bass sounds great. We will definitely try tuning the kick. Our sound guy did suggest that to our drummer from my last band. The drummer argued about it. This will definitely be the cheapest route. Hopefully the new drummer is not as stubborn and at least give it a try.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Do you by chance know the make of the drum kit and the head being used? Also have you adjusted the location of the mic in the bass drum itself to see if that helps?



                      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ga8Q12mKYxI



                      Bob's the man. Bass drums can be tricky to tune due not being able to hear the tones as well as smaller drums but nice video on tuning that bass drum.



                      Hear those are good mic's for the application that you are using



                      I once had a D112 that went funky on me and no matter what could not get it to sound good, swapped with another one found out had a bad D112 that "worked" but didn't produce desired results and was the source of the issue.

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                      • #12
                        By any chance, do you have the high pass filter (also possibly known as lo cut) engaged on the kick drum channel?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          What's the pa consist of???
                          -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
                          Former product development engineer: Genz Benz, a KMC Music/Fender Musical Instruments Company, continuing factory level product support and service for Genz Benz

                          Currently product development engineer: Mesa Boogie

                          Comment


                          • #14






                            Quote Originally Posted by lovegun
                            View Post

                            We want low end kick like you would hear on a modern rock recording or at a modern rock concert.




                            These are not the same thing. There is MUCH MUCH less low end enhancement on a recording than what's typically done at concerts.








                            Ive done some recording at home at with my experience, I have to add the sub bass to the kick to get this modern sound. EQ alone will not do it.



                            That's not correct. In fact, when listening to a recording, excessive low-end on the kick is a big indicator that the mix engineer was an amateur. What you are hearing on recordings is most likely a combination of excellent tuning, playing, and recording, along with (depending on the genre) a lot of compression.








                            Our sound guy did suggest that to our drummer from my last band. The drummer argued about it.







                            -Dan.
                            Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a set of earphones.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              You want a modern rock kick sound then ditch the beta 52 and get a D6. BUT, if the drummer can't be bothered to actually tune his drums your ****************ed before you even get started. If I had a drummer like that..... well I wouldn't.

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