Members rockets&robots Posted September 9, 2013 Members Share Posted September 9, 2013 I play in three piece punk band and i get the same complaint at every one of our shows. "I can't hear your vocals." I do not play at raging levels with monsterous 100 watt tube stacks. I play a replica of a fender tweed pro that is right around 25 watts and I never run even half way with a green rhino overdrive in front of it and a morely volume plus pedal in front of all that to gate the distortion. I think its one of three problems: Most obviously it may be that the vocals need more volume to be hear. I could need compression to bring up the softer sung parts and eliminate frequancies stoping me from getting the most volume from my vocal channel. lastly it could be that i need to mix it differently. Here is a list of my PA gear though i do have that same problems on venue owened PA systems as i do on my own PA.~Shure SM-58 (though i have use the beta 87 for solo acoustic shows i find it feeds back before i can reach the volume level needed to play as a band)~mackie cfx20 mixer~peavey CS-900 power amp~Electro Voice SX100 12in speakersI'm curious if its a problem where i need to mix differently: perhaps i could use my Vox AC-4 (usually my practice amp) miced and a line out on the bass amp (Fender rumble 75 watt 1x12 combo) to get more control and scoop them (cut the mids back a ton) then boost the mids on the vocals (use the sweepable mids on the mixer to boost around the.. idk 1khz range). Or if its an issue of compression or mic model i could get the TC Helicon cocal compressor stompbox and maybe a beta 57. that would be ideal because I could use these on anyones PA. Lastly if it is a power amp or speaker issue i could possibly upgrade and lug my PA to the venues so long as it fixes the "I can't hear your vocals" problem. Any suggestions would be much appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RoadRanger Posted September 9, 2013 Members Share Posted September 9, 2013 rockets&robots wrote: I play in three piece punk band and i get the same complaint at every one of our shows. "I can't hear your vocals." I do not play at raging levels with monsterous 100 watt tube stacks. I play a replica of a fender tweed pro that is right around 25 watts and I never run even half way with a green rhino overdrive in front of it and a morely volume plus pedal in front of all that to gate the distortion. I think its one of three problems: Most obviously it may be that the vocals need more volume to be hear. I could need compression to bring up the softer sung parts and eliminate frequancies stoping me from getting the most volume from my vocal channel. lastly it could be that i need to mix it differently. Here is a list of my PA gear though i do have that same problems on venue owened PA systems as i do on my own PA. ~Shure SM-58 (though i have use the beta 87 for solo acoustic shows i find it feeds back before i can reach the volume level needed to play as a band) ~mackie cfx20 mixer ~peavey CS-900 power amp ~Electro Voice SX100 12in speakers I'm curious if its a problem where i need to mix differently: perhaps i could use my Vox AC-4 (usually my practice amp) miced and a line out on the bass amp (Fender rumble 75 watt 1x12 combo) to get more control and scoop them (cut the mids back a ton) then boost the mids on the vocals (use the sweepable mids on the mixer to boost around the.. idk 1khz range). Or if its an issue of compression or mic model i could get the TC Helicon cocal compressor stompbox and maybe a beta 57. that would be ideal because I could use these on anyones PA. Lastly if it is a power amp or speaker issue i could possibly upgrade and lug my PA to the venues so long as it fixes the "I can't hear your vocals" problem. Any suggestions would be much appreciated. Get somebody to mix you for at least one show so you have some idea as to where to set things. Assuming you're not now putting anything but the vocals through the PA you should be able to get them loud enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rockets&robots Posted September 9, 2013 Author Members Share Posted September 9, 2013 I will try this. My initial concern is this: I have had people on the board for me before (some more skilled than others) and i have had a couple times where it has worked out but it usually doesnt. We dont have a lot of skill at my level of playing in this area (south east idaho) for mixing. Do you think it may be all in the levels or in the EQ? Thanks for the feedback Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Mogwix Posted September 9, 2013 Members Share Posted September 9, 2013 The PA you have should be plenty. Some questions: 1. How are you setting up your PA? Do you set up your speakers behind the band?2. Are you running instruments/drums through the PA? If you set up the speakers behind the band, I'd recommend you invest in a cheap 31-band EQ and . If you're running anything other than vocals through the PA, stop. Drums and guitar amps are loud enough (in most cases) so it's a good idea to devote the entire PA to getting the vocals on top. Oh, and by the way. Compression lowers the volume of loud passages, reducing dynamic range and raising the noise floor. This is important because if feedback is an issue, using compression will only amplify that feedback and lower your gain-before-feedback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rockets&robots Posted September 9, 2013 Author Members Share Posted September 9, 2013 I run my vocals and my acoustic with a DI box through the PA and my speakers are always in front of us. I do have three EV sx100s and I run them all daisy chained with one speaker as a wedge. that may be my problem also. I only have one working half of the power amp that works so the monitor and the mains have to be the same mix but again I have this same problem when I do not run a monitor and when I use others PA systems so I'm not sure it is the problem. The reason I was thinking compression is because I am a dynamic singer and I sing some parts loudly and set the gain for those parts so I wont peak but I often sing much softer than where I set the gain at. I was hoping it would even things up and limit my peaks while bringing my softer parts up. I've never used one though so this is all hypothetically what I would like out of it maybe not what will happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members agedhorse Posted September 9, 2013 Members Share Posted September 9, 2013 Try it without the speaker being used as a wedge first. That may be a big part of the problem. If you need a monitor, get your mixer/amp fixed and do it they way it's intended, off of the aux bus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Bajazz Posted September 9, 2013 Members Share Posted September 9, 2013 ...I play in three piece punk band There is you explanation! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Pro Sound Guy Posted September 9, 2013 Members Share Posted September 9, 2013 You need a much larger sound system to get over the top of your stage volume.The only way around this with this tiny system is bring the stage volume down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members nchangin Posted September 9, 2013 Members Share Posted September 9, 2013 Possible to post a video? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members bigjd Posted September 9, 2013 Members Share Posted September 9, 2013 Hey Rockets &Robots I'm in Idaho Falls give me a shout I can give you a hand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members rockets&robots Posted September 10, 2013 Author Members Share Posted September 10, 2013 Mogwix, would a 9 band EQ work? I have one of those built into my mixer. I mentioned what you said to some folks and they suggested I try a Behringer Feedback Destroyer.Pro Sound Guy, can you recommend an upgrade route? maybe just a more powerful power amp or some powered speakers?bigjd, her is a link to my bands facebook https://www.facebook.com/myveryfavoritebandnchangin, here is a link to a youtube video of us from a 2+ years ago but its a poor quality recording. I think this night we used a combination of mine and another bands PA. my speakers were monitors and the mains were powered 10 inch mackies. it was also before I downgraded from a 2x12 mesa boogie trem-o-verb so that makes a difference. I Honestly am not sure this video will help but its all I got =( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members StratGuy22 Posted September 10, 2013 Members Share Posted September 10, 2013 It hurts seeing that video. Step 1 is to turn down. Is that an 810 Ampeg? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members RoadRanger Posted September 10, 2013 Members Share Posted September 10, 2013 Holy carp ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members monthlymixcd Posted September 10, 2013 Members Share Posted September 10, 2013 StratGuy22 wrote: It hurts seeing that video. Step 1 is to turn down. Is that an 810 Ampeg? Looks more like a V4BH head w/ an old Peavey international series 4x12 or 2x10/1x15 bass cab under it to me. That's still a 100W tube head though which is still a lot of stage volume.OP - Is that your mic you're singing into? What is it? Even if you can get your stage volume down... I'd suggest getting a mic with the best GBF (Gain Before Feedback) that you can afford.If you're asking these types of questions, then you're at that level where you need to start looking at things differently. Your instrument amps (and the drum kit itself... in the case of the drummer) are there so you can monitor your own playing (and hopefully hear what your bandmates are playing) and the PA is for your audience's benefit... to help them hear a balanced band sound. Stage volume like that makes it impossible to create a mix that your audience will enjoy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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