Second Mixer for Volume Contol?

[mgmer]

The Problem: The sound man cannot hear the powered floor monitors on the stage.

The Plan: Place a small mixer on stage next to the director in order to make volume adjustments.

The Equipment: Mackie VLZ4 24 channel sending a line level signal from the Aux Send to the stage into Yamaha Powered Monitors.

The Question: Is it OK to take that line level signal on stage & run it through a 2nd small mixer prior to the powered monitor speakers? The monitors do have gain controls on them, but they are not easy to reach where they are located.

The Purpose: The director desires to make subtle volume corrections from the podium of the monitors that the choir & he hear. Trying to make the director happy, happy, happy.

 

I'm a newbie at this so any advice will be helpful.

 

Thanks

 

 

[agedhorse]

The problem is that the director appears to be a control freak. Why can't he get the levels set right and leave the heck alone like a grownup? The more he fiddles with it the bigger the problems will become and happy happy happy becomes even more and more unhappy.

 

Yes it can be done, you will need a balanced line level mixer to do it properly, you will also probably regret ever going there IMO.

[sibyrnes]

I can't think of any good reason why anyone should be making "volume corrections" to the monitors during a performance. That's asking for trouble! I would tell him it can't be done and let him concentrate on what he should be doing.

[Shaster]

The Purpose: The director desires to make subtle volume corrections from the podium of the monitors that the choir & he hear. Trying to make the director happy, happy, happy.

 

I'm a newbie at this so any advice will be helpful.

 

Thanks

 

 

Volume corrections? How about correct the volume at the source? In any case, if the "corrections" are so subtle, why not just leave them alone? And if they are major, they shouldn't be handled by someone on stage that isn't a tech. Most problems could be solved before they occur. You could level out any prerecorded music, or consider making it post fader - that kind of thing.

 

The best solution would be (IMO) to give the soundman a monitor speaker with the stage monitor feed. That way he can hear and make adjustments if necessary.

 

[dbMontana]

The best solution would be (IMO) to give the soundman a monitor speaker with the stage monitor feed. That way he can hear and make adjustments if necessary.

Soloing the AUX via headphones works too. Yes?

[Dogoth]

Soloing the AUX via headphones works too. Yes?

 

Didn't you know that the "Q" wedge must match the stage boxes exactly?

 

I'm being sarcastic because I've seen that on riders and personally believe it's of minimal value.

 

Headphones should work well enough. IMO a listen wedge (or phones) are for making "relative" changes (I.E. a bit more guitar relative to the rest of the mix). Since you are not standing where the artist is you can't ever know exactly what they are hearing so you only make "relative" changes. OTOH giving that control over a LIVE monitor (in contrast to IEMs) to an uneducated artist is asking for trouble.

 

[Shaster]

Soloing the AUX via headphones works too. Yes?

 

It should or could, but if the guy is that fussy, the only thing that might make him happy is a cue wedge. Then he "knows" the FOH guy is hearing it right. Hearing with the eyes and all that jazz...

[dbMontana]

--snip--

Headphones should work well enough. IMO a listen wedge (or phones) are for making "relative" changes (I.E. a bit more guitar relative to the rest of the mix). Since you are not standing where the artist is you can't ever know exactly what they are hearing so you only make "relative" changes.

I agree totally that soloing an AUX is only good for monitoring relative changes in levels and therefore question all the more the perception that a mix-booth que monitor would be that much better than headphones. Although I've grown used to it, most artist-directed monitor mixes sound empty/partial/imbalanced in comparison to FOH -- without being able to hear the stage volume arriving at their ears mixed in that is.

OTOH giving that control over a LIVE monitor (in contrast to IEMs) to an uneducated artist is asking for trouble.

Yea I have two guys that always mix their own IEMs via iPhone/Pad but the few other experienced players using floor wedges I've offered the option to have declined saying they'll just let me know what they need. Fair enough. Of course, as you note, the majority of artists I wouldn't trust with that control whatsoever.

 

It should or could, but if the guy is that fussy, the only thing that might make him happy is a cue wedge. Then he "knows" the FOH guy is hearing it right. Hearing with the eyes and all that jazz...

Yes, there is the issue of keeping the talent happy -- even through nonsensical means if necessary <wink>. Granted, the output from a que monitor would mix with the FOH and provide a more balanced mix (in comparison to headphones that is) but FOH is not what the artist is hearing at their ears anyway so....?

[Dogoth]

Yes, there is the issue of keeping the talent happy -- even through nonsensical means if necessary <wink>. Granted, the output from a que monitor would mix with the FOH and provide a more balanced mix (in comparison to headphones that is) but FOH is not what the artist is hearing at their ears anyway so....?

 

Well put. Even though I think having a matched Q wedge is a waste of time, if the rider is adamant, I of course provide it and say nothing. If you're far enough out in the house, you'd need to delay the Q wedge to match FOH (IMO more time uselessly spent but if it's a paying customer....... :-).