Harmony Central Forums
Announcement
Collapse
No announcement yet.

The Composition Thread

Collapse



X
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #76
    Indeed, most excellent.

    Kiru
    "Don't sell your life! Do whatever you really want to do. You must act as the master of your life, and then become free. No matter how difficult it is, no matter how unsuccessful it might seem, do whatever you want!"
    -- Michio Kushi

    The only way to settle questions of an ideological nature or controversial issues among the people is by the democratic method, the method of discussion, of criticism, of persuasion and education, and not by the method of coercion or repression.
    -- Mao Zedong

    Comment


    • #77
      Originally posted by Birdienumnum
      Bravo!


      Originally posted by Kirumamoru
      Indeed, most excellent.


      Don't cheer me! If you want to say something useless, tell if it's helpful for you!

      Forever,




      Kim.
      The Composition Thread is sticky!
      There is no heavier burden than a great potential.- Unknown source

      Comment


      • #78
        I'm glad you've touched upon the idea of perception of time speed. Whenever I write a composition, I always have in my mind how long I would like the song to be. I would add parts to it, but the composition often does not reach the length I would like it to be. There is a sort of a benefit from this though. There is enough parts and motion to fool the listener into thinking that it is a 6 minute song when it is actually a 3 1/2 - 4 minute song. I hope that this is within the realm of what you're saying
        http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page...m?bandID=73567
        Soul On Tap
        The Coupe De Villes
        Chris Beard Band

        current gear list:
        Yamaha MOX8, Korg Triton, Korg CX3, Korg X2, QSC K12, Rhodes Stage '73(needs new tines), Ventilator, Reason 3

        "Leave the ego, play the music, love the people.." - Luther Allison

        Comment


        • #79
          Originally posted by Jeez

          Don't cheer me! If you want to say something useless, tell if it's helpful for you!
          Forever,
          Kim.



          Thank Jeez.
          I have found lots of usefull and practice topics.
          I am not an erudit, nor a aplied student, just I try to do something with my one and half neuron.
          http://jd800center.blogspot.com
          http://gilbertostrapazon.blogspot.com

          Comment


          • #80
            Originally posted by tucktronix
            I hope that this is within the realm of what you're saying


            It's similar. Two very different pieces may be both exactly the same length... but that doesn't mean that the listener will percieve them to be the same length!

            If you start composing a piece knowing how long you want it to be, perhaps you could try planning out the structure before you even do anything else. For example:

            At 120BPM 4/4, a five minute piece will have 150 bars. Knowing this, you could split it up into large sections - maybe bars 1-32 are the introduction, bars 33-72 present the primary thematic material (the main themes), bars 73-130 are some kind of development or alternate 'B' section, bars 131-142 revisit the main theme, and the remaining eight bars (143-150) form the conclusion (outro).

            Once you've sorted your outline, you can either go straight into "putting the notes in", or you could split the sections up even further. For example, bars 33-72 present the primary thematic material, but that's 48 bars (quite a lot)... so maybe split that into a ternary structure (A B A), where each theme has sixteen bars.


            Anyway, that's one possible approach.


            Another way of "filling in time" is to take the process of development further - rather than keep coming up with new sections, develop the ones you already have. This will help you generate more material, and also make the final piece more cohesive. Read my post on variation and development for more details.

            Forever,




            Kim.
            The Composition Thread is sticky!
            There is no heavier burden than a great potential.- Unknown source

            Comment


            • #81
              Thanks for the info!! I usually do follow the structural approach, laying and labeling each part on Cakewalk. I will try developing some further, as you had suggested. I used some development techniques on a tune I've written called "Guitaricide", with success. Again thanx
              http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page...m?bandID=73567
              Soul On Tap
              The Coupe De Villes
              Chris Beard Band

              current gear list:
              Yamaha MOX8, Korg Triton, Korg CX3, Korg X2, QSC K12, Rhodes Stage '73(needs new tines), Ventilator, Reason 3

              "Leave the ego, play the music, love the people.." - Luther Allison

              Comment


              • #82
                Another example - you're working in F#-minor. Your triad is F#, A, C#. You could extend it by adding E, then G#, then B.
                You could extend this idea by having a different instrument play the extentions. For example, you could have your favourite thick pad playing your triad, then have the extentions played by a thin airy pad in the background. This gives you more ways to balance the simple with the complex.


                Hey, good trick! =)

                I wanted to take this opportunity to introduce some theory jargon, and maybe pave the way for some jazz theory discussion.

                The tones Jeez is talking about are the 7th, 9th, and 11th of the chord. Why do we call them that? It's easy - let's look an the F# minor chord:
                F#
                G#
                A
                B
                C#
                D
                E

                If we assign numbers to these tones (aka the "degrees" of the scale), then we have

                F# - 1
                G# - 2
                A - 3
                B - 4
                C# - 5
                D - 6
                E - 7

                So it says here that the G# is the 2nd degree of the scale, right? Well, yes, except now we're talking about extensions. So, let's extend the scale, as if we were to continue playing it up on the keyboard:

                F# - 1
                G# - 2
                A - 3
                B - 4
                C# - 5
                D - 6
                E - 7
                F# - 8
                G# - 9
                A - 10
                B - 11

                If we continue counting after 8, then we see that G# becomes the ninth degree of the scale, rather than the second. Why is it called the ninth and not the second? Well, a few reasons not worth going into. Basically, a 2 and a 9 are used in different ways.

                Adding a 7th or 9th is a good way to fatten up a chord (try it on a pad). When you want to impress your friends, refer it to it as an "F# minor add 9 chord!" 7ths and 9ths are also very common in jazz chord voicings. 11ths and 13ths appear in jazz as well, but not as frequently.

                More on extensions:
                In the olden days, a 7th chord was used in a very specific way - the 7th of the chord (the Bb in a C chord) "wants" to resolve down a half-step to an A. So, a C7 to F chord progression is very satisfying, since you have a half-step motion from the Bb to an A, and there's more half-step motion between when the E goes to the F (or Eb if it's an F7 chord). Also, the root note goes down a 5th, which is pleasing to our ears (see Yoozer's chart).

                However, as music has gotten more "modern," this rule isn't as stricly followed as it used to be. Still, you'll hear the V7-I resolution a lot, especially in slower pop songs in which the 7 has time to be emphasized.

                (warning - post written with no coffee)
                Where would Kraftwerk be without the Beach Boys or James Brown? Where would hip-hop be without Kraftwerk?

                - Ronan Harris

                Comment


                • #83
                  Sorry no post yesterday, I only had two hours sleep the night before, and thus eved up going to bed at about 9pm (and waking up at midday).

                  Forever,




                  Kim.
                  The Composition Thread is sticky!
                  There is no heavier burden than a great potential.- Unknown source

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    Just thought of an exercise for my post on extensions - whip up a beat and bassline in your sequencer, then play the extensions of the chords on a pad - so if you're grooving in the key of C, play a chord of D and F (D and A is neat, too).

                    You could even play the normal chord tones for section A, and then add/play just the extensions for section A'.

                    Man...such a good discussion of ideas in this forum right now, but I'm so far away from my studio!!
                    Where would Kraftwerk be without the Beach Boys or James Brown? Where would hip-hop be without Kraftwerk?

                    - Ronan Harris

                    Comment


                    • #85
                      Originally posted by Treves
                      C D F D A A A'


                      You really should make it clear when you're referring to notes, or chords, or sections.

                      Something like "chord C, note D, note F", or always specifying major/minor (if appropriate) for chords... Simple really, just to avoid confusion.

                      Forever,




                      Kim.
                      The Composition Thread is sticky!
                      There is no heavier burden than a great potential.- Unknown source

                      Comment


                      • #86
                        Sorry about that. No post last night because I was busy with another project. I've got another post coming up for tonight though.

                        Forever,




                        Kim.
                        The Composition Thread is sticky!
                        There is no heavier burden than a great potential.- Unknown source

                        Comment


                        • #87
                          Fair enough. I've edited the post.
                          Where would Kraftwerk be without the Beach Boys or James Brown? Where would hip-hop be without Kraftwerk?

                          - Ronan Harris

                          Comment


                          • #88
                            I want to teach you all a little trick. Instead of writing down chords like this: C-major, A-minor, F-major, G#9b-minor, you could do it liek this: C, a, F, g#9b. Get it? Capital letters for majors, small letters for minors. Piece of cake, short, and easy to read .

                            Comment


                            • #89
                              Originally posted by Caleidoscope
                              I want to teach you all a little trick. Instead of writing down chords like this: C-major, A-minor, F-major, G#9b-minor, you could do it liek this: C, a, F, g#9b. Get it? Capital letters for majors, small letters for minors. Piece of cake, short, and easy to read .


                              Good idea for chord charts or anywhere else where chords are assumed.

                              However, in this thread we may refer by letter name anything from notes, to chords, to keys, to scales, modes, etc.

                              That's why I've requested that we make it clear. A few extra seconds of typing is worth the added clarity.

                              Forever,




                              Kim.
                              The Composition Thread is sticky!
                              There is no heavier burden than a great potential.- Unknown source

                              Comment


                              • #90
                                Quiet, quiet, sit down...

                                Good evening, class. Tonight's lesson will be on Expectation and Excitement - particularly how it relates to drum programming.

                                Before we begin, I'd like to make clear that while we'll be discussing one-bar drum patterns, these prinicpals apply to all aspects of rhythmic composition (including basslines, melody, etc). Additionally, these principals are applicable to drum patterns of arbitrary (any) complexity, but for simplicity we will be primarily concerning ourselves with the four-on-the-floor kick drum pattern often heard in popular club music.

                                I'm also assuming equal velocity (volume) for every note. Variable velocity will make this ubject far more complex than can be discussed in a single post. I'm already pushing it as it is.

                                A little more on drum patterns of arbitrary complexity. The important thing to remember here is that everything is relative to the normal. That may sound kinda obvious, but I'll explain further. A static (looped) drum pattern can only be interesting for a limited amount of time. After hearing the repetition several times, we (the listener) know what to expect. However complex this drum pattern is, repetition makes it the normal. If, after a few iterations, we change the loop, we (the listener) will be surprised in some way... but if this variation is then looped, it becomes the new pattern - it becomes the new normal upon which we build our new expectations.

                                So basically, we will discuss two patterns - the normal, and the variation. The normal is what has been repeated, and what the listener expects. The variation is a new loop that is very similar to the normal, but different enough to surprise the listener.

                                Ok, enough semantics. Let's get on with The Real Thing.

                                Expectation

                                We can create expectation by removing notes from our variation. The sense of expectation is created because the listener expects (from the normal) a certain note to exist, but it does not. You might say the listener "wants" something to be there, but it is not, so the listener is kept "wanting".

                                For example:
                                 the existing note that it associates with (variation, beat 4), the effect is that of strengthening the existing note, or elongating it (making it longer).

                                I'll discuss some special cases in my next post.

                                Forever,




                                Kim.
                                The Composition Thread is sticky!
                                There is no heavier burden than a great potential.- Unknown source

                                Comment













                                Working...
                                X