Members Stingray5 Posted July 16, 2010 Members Share Posted July 16, 2010 A keyboard player friend of mine, plays in two bands with me and about 6 months ago, he bought a Kurzweill and he is just not happy with it. He has a $300.00 Yamaha that has a better piano and string sound. Now surely the Kurzweill has a better string and piano sound than this $300.00 keyboard. After listening to the Kurzweill on u tube it sounds fantastic. Does anybody have any suggestions as to how to get the good piano and string sound on this thing? PS. I have already saved this keyboard from going into a pond we were playing near a couple of weeks ago. My friend is pretty disgusted with it! He emailed the engineer at Kurzweill already and he was about as helpful as a blind man giving directions. If it sound like we not happy with the sound, you would be right! We are pleading, to help keep the keyboard from going to the nearest garage sale or river. If we can't get this thing straightened out, is there anything out there that has a good piano and string with horn sound in it, up to a $1000.00 or less he can purchase? For organ he just ordered the Hammond X1 or XK1?. Thanks for the help and for the opportunity to vent here.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Tomkeen Posted July 16, 2010 Members Share Posted July 16, 2010 The presets on the PC3 are very good already. Suggestion on how to get a good sound out of it? JUST PICK ANY PRESET AND PLAY. Come on, it's not that difficult. It's rather easy to just fault the keyboard, but what amp is he using? Any outboard gear? Can he actually play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members evildragon Posted July 16, 2010 Members Share Posted July 16, 2010 Piano: Preset 4 - Horowitz Grand. Strings and orchestrals? The best in business! Hammonds are great as well. Your friend - I think your friend is playing it through a bad amp (Behringer, eh?). Kurzweil sounds fantastic (WHEN PLAYED THROUGH PROPER AMPLIFICATION!), and I bet your friend is deaf on one ear or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Stingray5 Posted July 16, 2010 Author Members Share Posted July 16, 2010 He is a good player 40 years or there about. Our front house is qsc k2 sys. used different monitors not much difference. would running st. or mono make a big difference. Thanks for the response Guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Franz Schiller Posted July 16, 2010 Members Share Posted July 16, 2010 Something here sounds off. I agree that a Hammond XK1 organ is better than Kurz's, but otherwise the Kurzweil should rule. I echo Tomkeen's worry about outboard gear, or something bad in the signal chain? Or perhaps you're PA is mono, but you're feeding it stereo signals, and one side is getting lost? Or maybe phase cancellation? Also, try plugging headphones directly into the synth. If it sounds terribly wrong, then maybe the keyboard is broken. If it sounds ok, then you need to troubleshoot down the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members AJP Posted July 16, 2010 Members Share Posted July 16, 2010 I tried to get onto the Kurzweil train, I really did. Ordered the PC3LE, thinking "O.K., Peter Gabriel uses these damn things. They must be good". What I failed to realize at the time was that they virtually kidnapped a professional Kurzweil programmer for their tour. Are the pianos and orchestral sounds more realistic than those of other ROMplers? Perhaps. Do they sit in my mix as well? Nope. And the sounds that were there did not make me want to go to school on the VAST architecture. Went to the Motif XS7 and did not look back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members evildragon Posted July 16, 2010 Members Share Posted July 16, 2010 I agree that a Hammond XK1 organ is better than Kurz's Actually the core tonewheel sound that KB1 does in PC3 is splendid and in no way inferior to any other Hammond emulation. Even Leslie emulation is just fine, as its extremely tweakable. If it sounds wrong, then you just need to adjust the crossover frequency and/or rotor speeds, tweak the overdrive, or add EQ after it. Does wonders! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members EarthmanVIII Posted July 16, 2010 Members Share Posted July 16, 2010 Don't pollute rivers. I think the keyboard should end in a carboot sale. Preferably, somewhere near me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members epyon77x Posted July 16, 2010 Members Share Posted July 16, 2010 Except they DO sit well in a mix. :poke: Actually my experience in a band setting is quite the opposite...compared to say Triton ( an inferior machine in all regards ) I have to spend a lot more time with PC3 to make it sit in the mix the way I want it. I would recommend to the OPs friend to just get rid of it and switch to another board, if he cant find a decent piano or string sound on PC3 then there is no sense in keeping it, it obviously doesnt really cater to his tastes. This is my first Kurzweil and I have to say that even after two years of playing it Im still floored by the sounds and the sheer playability of the board ( and it is gods gift for studio work ), so Im kinda baffled by the fact that someone would prefer a $300 yammie... So, take a look at the other boards in the same ballpark and good luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members evildragon Posted July 16, 2010 Members Share Posted July 16, 2010 Tritons (or for that matter all Korgs) are all top-boosted so they naturally cut through any mix. Kurzweils are a bit more work in that regard, but they can blend in quite well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members epyon77x Posted July 16, 2010 Members Share Posted July 16, 2010 I know, Im just pointing out that for someone who needs a board that will work without spending some time with it ( and I can relate to that, especially when you are juggling 4 bands, all different genres and need things to work FAST because time is the issue and time means money ) PC3 might seem like a poor and frustrating choice. We both know people who wouldnt touch the PC3 just because they deem it too complicated and they are by no means stupid or bad players... Practicality is the king... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members AJP Posted July 16, 2010 Members Share Posted July 16, 2010 If it doesn't, just apply EQ at the end of FX chain. Does wonders for breaking through any kind of mix. XS7; no doctoring required for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members epyon77x Posted July 16, 2010 Members Share Posted July 16, 2010 XS7; no doctoring required for me. Well, judging from Yammie interfaces, even if you needed some doctoring you wouldnt be able to find where to do it so... J/K Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Tomkeen Posted July 16, 2010 Members Share Posted July 16, 2010 I've never had any problems cutting through with the PC3x. I've used it in several different settings, and it always sounds amazing. Even the other guys have noticed it, and that's saying something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Stingray5 Posted July 18, 2010 Author Members Share Posted July 18, 2010 I was talking to my friend and he told me, if his Kurzweil sounded half as good as a Trident ( sorry I'm sure I spelled this wrong) he would be happy. His reference meaning, when he heard me in an other band with the same PA, another guy played a Rolland and a Trident, they sounded awesome. Nothing like his Kurzweil. Here is a hint, the keys don't seem to have any sustain on the piano. I think he's going to have to get on here and give a little more detail. I'm just relating and not doing a very good job at that. Thanks to all of you for being understanding, I really appreciate it. I won't give up. I really believe the sounds are there it's just finding the solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members evildragon Posted July 18, 2010 Members Share Posted July 18, 2010 You probably mean Triton. And Roland. One L. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Stingray5 Posted July 18, 2010 Author Members Share Posted July 18, 2010 You probably mean Triton. And Roland. One L. Yes. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Fisnotigut Posted July 18, 2010 Members Share Posted July 18, 2010 A keyboard player friend of mine, plays in two bands with me and about 6 months ago, he bought a Kurzweill and he is just not happy with it. He has a $300.00 Yamaha that has a better piano and string sound. Now surely the Kurzweill has a better string and piano sound than this $300.00 keyboard. After listening to the Kurzweill on u tube it sounds fantastic. Does anybody have any suggestions as to how to get the good piano and string sound on this thing? PS. I have already saved this keyboard from going into a pond we were playing near a couple of weeks ago. My friend is pretty disgusted with it! He emailed the engineer at Kurzweill already and he was about as helpful as a blind man giving directions. If it sound like we not happy with the sound, you would be right! We are pleading, to help keep the keyboard from going to the nearest garage sale or river. If we can't get this thing straightened out, is there anything out there that has a good piano and string with horn sound in it, up to a $1000.00 or less he can purchase? For organ he just ordered the Hammond X1 or XK1?. Thanks for the help and for the opportunity to vent here.. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. People have different tastes in what sounds good and what doesn't. Your friend just may not like the tone that the PC3 puts out. That's ok. Some people prefer Yamaha pianos. That's ok too. But I love the piano and string sounds in my PC3. I can't stand the piano that comes out of my Roland XV-5080 but other sounds are great, otherwise I'd sell it. If it truly sounds crappy then there may be something wrong with it. Our band's sound guy is a keyboard player and he does love the Yamaha sound. But he also says my PC3 sounds incredible. I trust him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members vegasgt3 Posted July 18, 2010 Members Share Posted July 18, 2010 The piano sound between the Motif and Kurz is debatable as to which is better. I'll use one for some applications the other for something else. The strings are not, the Kurz's are the best INMO. I own both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members McHale Posted July 18, 2010 Members Share Posted July 18, 2010 Actually my experience in a band setting is quite the opposite...compared to say Triton ( an inferior machine in all regards ) I have to spend a lot more time with PC3 to make it sit in the mix the way I want it. This year alone, I've seen more than a dozen Tritons in the bands that open for us as well as the national touring acts we open for. You know how many Kurz's I've seen in the past couple of years? ZERO. Don't get me wrong, the Kurz is a fantastic machine and I've been a big fan of them through the years, but there's a reason you see Tritons even today 10 years after they were introduced dominate the stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Stingray5 Posted July 19, 2010 Author Members Share Posted July 19, 2010 The Triton is one of the best sounding I've heard,but I still think the sounds are in the PC361.Question do most of you plug into the stereo channel of the main mixer, or do you sub mix into a small mixer first, or do you run 1xlr left out into 1 channel and the right into another channel. I know I'm being a pain in the you know what, but with your help we can solve this thing.Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Suilebhain Posted July 19, 2010 Members Share Posted July 19, 2010 The suggestion to go directly into headphones is the best so far, but make sure that they are good headphones that can take the output of the Kurz. Something that breaks up when you hit something midrangy is going to make it sound horrible anyway. If the good headphones still give a bad sound, perhaps you have a problem in the output circuit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Stingray5 Posted July 19, 2010 Author Members Share Posted July 19, 2010 The suggestion to go directly into headphones is the best so far, but make sure that they are good headphones that can take the output of the Kurz. Something that breaks up when you hit something midrangy is going to make it sound horrible anyway.If the good headphones still give a bad sound, perhaps you have a problem in the output circuit. He said it sounded good with headphones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Fisnotigut Posted July 19, 2010 Members Share Posted July 19, 2010 This year alone, I've seen more than a dozen Tritons in the bands that open for us as well as the national touring acts we open for. You know how many Kurz's I've seen in the past couple of years? ZERO.Don't get me wrong, the Kurz is a fantastic machine and I've been a big fan of them through the years, but there's a reason you see Tritons even today 10 years after they were introduced dominate the stage. I like Korg's sounds. I have a Trinity that I still love. They get a big ZERO when it comes to piano sounds though. Yamaha and Kurzweil own the market there (IMO). I used a newly acquired Triton in a recording studio a couple years ago (the studio's purchase, not mine) and everyone was appalled at how crappy the piano sounded. I tried and tried to get them to just record MIDI but they had no clue what I was talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Suilebhain Posted July 19, 2010 Members Share Posted July 19, 2010 If it sounds good through headphones, at least you know it has nothing to do with the synthesis engine. Does your mixer have phantom power turned on or is it set to low impedance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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