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Radial DI for Keys


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  • Radial DI for Keys

    Hey everyone, just have a couple of questions regarding using a DI with keys....

    I 've a RD700 GX on bottom, NE3-73 on bottom along with a Handsonic and SP-555 sampler flanking either side. Everything runs through a A&H Zed22FX into a pair of K12's. I am loving the home setup now, but for live gigs the percussion and sampler stay home and usually I submix with a smaller Mackie mixer.

    Even though the Mackie (and A&H) have balanced outs, I am still strongly considering using a DI to brings levels down and keep the signal cleaner on stage. The submixer is right next to me on a stand, so should I be placing the DI between the keys and submixer or between the submixer and FOH/PA/Snake?

    I know Gigman mentioned this a while back and gather that everything stays 1/4 inch TS(unbalanced out from keys to either mixer or DI, balanced out(TRS or XLR) of DI or mixer to the FOH). Does the DI really make a difference in terms of ease of mixing to a house PA? Seems like every time I submix out to the soundguy, my signal is WAAAAY hot and have to turn down everything to the point that even the control outs for monitors and can't be heard well on stage! Does converting line level to mic level essentially solve this problem?

    Secondly, anyone using the Radial JDI Duplex? I found one on fleabay for $315 new with warranty, open box...that's still a hefty investement but for two keyboards, it seems like the best out there. Feel free to enlighten if anybody has better suggestions!


  • #2
    The Radial JDI Duplex is magnificent. Best sound I ever got out of my FOH send. Beware, sound guys everywhere will walk off with it if they get a chance!
    Moe---It puts the SINES in the basket, or else it gets the hose again.http://www.hotrodmotm.com


    • #3
      I have a JDI and a JDI Duplex I use around the house. Jensen trannies are soooo clean sounding.


      • #4
        ... should I be placing the DI between the keys and submixer or between the submixer and FOH/PA/Snake?...

        I use a Yamaha MG12/4FX mixer for my keyboard rig - and an A&H MixWiz as my PA mixer. I run my keys straight into the Yamaha - then use a pair of 1/4 TRS cables to go from the Yamaha into two channels of an 8 channel Behringer Rack Mounted DI on the PA rack - which in turn uses a pair of balanced XLR cables to from from the DI into two channel strips on the MixWiz. By adjusting the output fader on the Yamaha - and the input gain on the channel strips - I'm able to get a decent signal where neither the output fader or the input gain are at extremes.

        On those occasions that I use my PA for rehearsals at my place - I patch 3 more DI channels (2 for guitars and 1 for bass). The bass and guitars then simply plug their amp modelers (various Line 6 "Pod" models) direct into the DI and we eliminate the need to schlepp amps of any sort to rehearsal.

        I'm not a Behringer fan but will say that I haven't had any problems with the Rack Mounted DI that I'm using. The 8 channels worth of passive DI connectivity at a total cost of roughly $100 - has met my needs pretty cheaply.
        The SpaceNorman


        Keyboards and Tone Generators: Yamaha CP300, Kronos 88, Roland AX Synth, Motif ES Rack
        Keyboard Rack: Samson SM10 Line Mixer, Motu MIDIExpressXT MIDI Interface, Shure PSM200 IEM system, M-Audio Wireless MIDI, Live Wires IEM ear buds, iPad wOnSong.
        Stage Amplification: Stereo via 2 Yamaha DSR112s


        • #5
          I have a Radial stereo DI. I had the Jenson version of the single one but had to sell it. In live sound, I cannot tell the difference in the non Jenson one and the Jenson one yet accept about a $200US difference for the stereo version. I am sure there is one though. But no matter the setup, DI,s are as essential as a safety net as much as a surge protector is. Also on keys run before the powered speakers and even mixer when possible.


          • #6
            JDI Duplex here also. It's BY FAR my favorite DI box and I have had a couple sound guys try to steal it. WELL worth the price.

            Response from John from American Musical Supply on why I have received 2 used/damaged Korg M3's and 1 reboxed M3 from Guitar Center (a.k.a. why I'll never buy from AMS again): Footfall wrote:What you're experiencing with these units is the result of our warehouse crew intentionally "overpacking" this product.Current Korg Gear: KRONOS 88 (4GB), M50-73 (PS mod), RADIAS-73, Electribe MX, Triton Pro (MOSS, SCSI, CF, 64MB RAM), DVP-1, MEX-8000, MR-1, KAOSSilator, nanoKey, nanoKontrol, nanoPAD 2


            • #7
              Sounds like I'll need a Lo-Jack option on this baby...jeez. Does it "warm" the sound in any way? Some patches seem to be so dynamic, I almost hope there is some degree of punch without the occasional screecher!
              Thanks for the advice guys,


              • #8
                It is more like balance and clear. That could constitute warmth I guess?


                • #9
                  So I picked up the Duplex new for pretty cheap online...can't wait to hear what it does to the sound! For anyone using one, do you usually just attach it to your amp/mixer/stand or just lay in on the ground? I don't really know how much tweaking of levels need to be done once everything is hooked up, but do you find the need to adjust levels on the fly or is it a "set and forget" kind of device?

                  Also, do you guys hook this home for your home set-up or is this strictly for the stage? There are no studio monitors or rack at home an I am running a PA at home which is basically the same as my stage setup plus a few other toys. Cable runs are obviously pretty short, but are you just adding this to your sound chain all the time?

                  Last question...if the balanced outs on the Duplex are 1/4" and XLR, am I better off using once versus the other in terms of signal quality? I know it's apples to oranges but this just means more damn cables to buy. Jesus, this hobby is getting pricey



                  • #10
                    You are obsessing. There are no levels to set on the JDI. Also no reason to use it at home unless you are running both a PA and stage amplification. I typically push in the ground lift buttons to prevent hum, and put it in the back of my rack on stage.

                    Last week I did a quickie show and took no stage amp rig for the first time ever. I just set my trusty JDI on the stage next to my Nord and listened to my rig thru the monitors.
                    Moe---It puts the SINES in the basket, or else it gets the hose again.http://www.hotrodmotm.com


                    • #11
                      I use my JDIs at home for tracking bass, drum machines and keys though API 512s and my own stereo tube preamp which both don't have line ins. Since the JDIs split the signal I can track direct to DAW and though the pres at the same time.


                      • #12
                        Ah yes....GAS + Audiophilia = totally obsessed! Thanks for pointing out this clearly pathologic behavior my friend. Glad to hear that some folks are using this device as the mixer in lieu of a dedicated mixer/monitor.

                        I will be flying up to Ocean City, MD for a gig in a few weeks and will bring up just my Electro....figured this would be a good time to bring the Duplex since I won't have my own amplification system. Hope the airlines don't use the case as a frisbee

                        Breathe deeply...


                        • #13
                          I've been using a pair of Rapco DB100 passive direct boxes since 1992. They introduce no extraneous noise nor color. There is no way I'd waste $315 for a DI box.
                          '57 Hammond B3; '69 Hammond L100P; '68 Leslie 122; Motion Sound Low Pro/Pro 3T; Neo Vent; Kurzweil PC3; GEM Even toquinox 88 Pro and 76 key; GSI Gemini; Voce V5+; EV ELX112P; '67 Howard Combo Organ; http://www.dyinbreedband.com


                          • #14
                            The quality of a DI box is critical if you need/choose to employ one. But IMO, you could use a mixer that accepts both balanced/unbalanced signals from your keys, and feed that XLR or TRS output to house.
                            Keep it simple. The more gear you run your signal thru, the more it gets altered.
                            Orgasms frighten me


                            • #15
                              I disagree (respectfully of course) with Delaware. My band's soundmen (top-notch techies) have been very complimentary of my sound with the Duplex. My band opened up for country star Justin Moore a couple months ago, and his keyboard player's rig (2 Triton Extreme 88's) sounded killer out front. He was using the single version of the Duplex. That's what convinced me to pull the trigger. But I'm all in favor of skepticism, because the lack of it can cost you alot of $$$$, I have learned.