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Rant : With all hyper technological advances, In the keyboard world we still have ..

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  • #16






    Quote Originally Posted by guido61
    View Post

    I suspect the technology exists, but that not enough people are willing to pay for it to make it financially feasible for any company to produce. People don't want to pay more than $500 for a controller and then bitch that it doesn't have the action of a $40,000 Steinway.




    the extra $35k is for the strings and fancy case
    All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident. Arthur Schopenhauer (1788 - 1860)

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    • #17






      Quote Originally Posted by The Real MC
      View Post

      And that is the core of the problem.



      I bought my Kurzweil MIDIBoard brand new for $1700 back in 1989. In those days good controllers were made and people paid for that quality.



      I'm always disappointed when today's controllers don't have the feel and features of my MB. They're nowhere near as sturdy and rugged either. And with cheap manufacturing and cutthroat competition abound, the market no longer exists for a decent controller.



      Is my MB obsolete? It doesn't implement 14-bit NRPNs but there are hardware add-ons for that. I am happy with my MB and it doesn't need to do EVERYTHING.



      The people who bitch about price are reaping what they sowed.




      I, too, love my MIDIBoard. But it is showing its age. I need to go in and re-solder one slider (replaced 5 years ago, I'm assuming a cold solder joint). And I find the action 'hard' in the sense that it hits the sensor with more clack than thump and the keys bounce or double-send as a result--especially when I'm playing delicately. Any suggestions? It's the USA action.
      All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident. Arthur Schopenhauer (1788 - 1860)

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      • #18






        Quote Originally Posted by guido61
        View Post

        I suspect the technology exists, but that not enough people are willing to pay for it to make it financially feasible for any company to produce. People don't want to pay more than $500 for a controller and then bitch that it doesn't have the action of a $40,000 Steinway.




        I actually haven't looked at the digital piano market, but I wonder if there are some decent feeling controllers in that category that are hiding from us synth players. Digital pianos with real hammers for instance exist now, for those who demand the utmost realism in hammer action.



        They obviously won't have the controller features of the DAW purpose keyboards, and probably more primitive MIDI, but maybe there's a few gems that are better than the plastic crap.



        I do see a lot of plastic crap even in the "hammer action" category that probably is no better than the VMK-161 controller I have (pretty good feeling controller, cheaply made, buggy software).
        What I make with way too many blinky light modular items, plugins, and an Alesis Andromeda.
        Forbidden Star: home studio / melodic ambient / New Age / the deep zone
        Boney Fiend: the band, man / punk / garage / beer

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        • #19
          I have a Prophet 08 and Moog LP. Why do these instruments have tiny little LCD screens that display what... 24 or 36 characters? And have 128 user programs? These "modern day" analog synths still look and act like they have 80's technology in them.



          Ditto for my MOX6. Same dinky LCD screen. I understand it is a poor man's Motif XS, but are larger screens really that much more expensive? And only 128 user patch memories?



          My little iPhone seems to have 1,000x the computing power and technology that is found in so many keyboards.
          -------------------------------
          Michael
          Jupiter-50, MOX6, TI Polar, Moog LP, Korg Micro X, JV-1080
          27" iMac, DP 7.24, Omnisphere, Alchemy, many more...
          http://www.youtube.com/keybdwizrd

          Comment


          • #20
            Yup. The only time this is acceptable is when you have editing software for the computer, and even then it's only mildly acceptable in this day and age. There's NO excuse for manufacturers to be using little two line displays on complex instruments like the Prophet 08 and Virus TI. They should be much larger, color displays and touchscreen would be nice for certain instruments. And even on the compact instruments, why can't they use a small color display with a higher resolution? Even $40 MP3 players have a nicer screen than my TI desktop, and they've been around at that price for years.

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            • #21
              In 1988 a state-of-the-art PC had 4MB of memory, and a state-of-the-art drum machine had enough memory for 50,000 notes. Today my PC has 8GB of memory (2000x more than 1988), yet a state-of-the-art workstation keyboard has memory for 128,000 notes (about 2x more than 1988). How much more would it cost Yamaha / Korg / whoever to put in enough non-volatile memory to hold more than about 40 songs (i.e. more than 1 MB)? (Props to Casio at least for giving us a decent 16MB of sequence memory ).

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              • #22
                Yamaha and other manufacturers came to the conclusion that "most" players only used internal sequencers to create scratch songs so they could remember them or rough them out before using a DAW for any serious recording work. Why put hardware into a keyboard that most players weren't going to use? All that does is drive up the cost in a very competitive market.



                I still have my Yamaha ES8 and when I was still actively playing gigs I did my entire show using the internal sequencer memory. Classic rock songs are not all memory hogs and if you clean up each track when you are about finished with it to make sure it was clean and not using up memory unnecessarily, you can get the most efficient use of what you have on-board. Provided I planned a good mix of fast dance tunes and a few slow tunes that requried strings, horns, and a lot of different instruments, I could put together a one hour set with just a little planning. I would load up a new set before I went on break so I was ready to go. I got in the habit of erasing songs I had played previoiusly after I did about 5 songs, while the crowd was catching its breath. I never ran out of memory never had much trouble getting through the night without a hitch. My ES8 worked flawlessly and sounded great considering the time period I bought it and all the years I used it for live shows.



                Obviously, dealing with limitations takes your eye off the ball, but if you have reasonable limitions you can worth with, your KB won't cost you an extra $1000 because you had to pay for things you didn't need.







                Cheers!





                Mike T.
                Yamaha Motif ES8, Alesis Ion, Prophet 5 Rev 3.2, 1979 Rhodes Mark 1 Suitcase 73 Piano, Arp Odyssey Mk III, Digitech Vocalist Live Pro, lots of PA gear, Oberheim DMX, Roland R-70 Drum Machine, and more toys.

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                • #23
                  Oops, plaid_emu, thanks for reminding me about the Virus TI... I have one of those, too. Same dinky, crappy little screen.



                  Kudos to Korg for putting large screens on instruments like the M50, and a large COLOR screen on the $999 Krome 61. Apparently it IS possible.... Let's see the other manufacturers follow suit.
                  -------------------------------
                  Michael
                  Jupiter-50, MOX6, TI Polar, Moog LP, Korg Micro X, JV-1080
                  27" iMac, DP 7.24, Omnisphere, Alchemy, many more...
                  http://www.youtube.com/keybdwizrd

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    The small "green screen" on my ES8 was a major complaint I had with that KB, but it did prove to be OK for how I used it. But I'm with you guys, a large color screen is better than a small mono screen, especially at my age!





                    Cheers!





                    Mike T.
                    Yamaha Motif ES8, Alesis Ion, Prophet 5 Rev 3.2, 1979 Rhodes Mark 1 Suitcase 73 Piano, Arp Odyssey Mk III, Digitech Vocalist Live Pro, lots of PA gear, Oberheim DMX, Roland R-70 Drum Machine, and more toys.

                    Comment


                    • #25






                      Quote Originally Posted by JimboKeys
                      View Post

                      In 1988 a state-of-the-art PC had 4MB of memory, and a state-of-the-art drum machine had enough memory for 50,000 notes. Today my PC has 8GB of memory (2000x more than 1988), yet a state-of-the-art workstation keyboard has memory for 128,000 notes (about 2x more than 1988). How much more would it cost Yamaha / Korg / whoever to put in enough non-volatile memory to hold more than about 40 songs (i.e. more than 1 MB)? (Props to Casio at least for giving us a decent 16MB of sequence memory ).




                      The computer industry definitely has far more resources available for developing and exploiting electronic hardware than the music industry does.



                      I guess this is why Korg decided for Kronos / Oasys to actually use a computer. I'm sure Kronos's 2GB of memory can hold a few more than 128K notes?
                      What I make with way too many blinky light modular items, plugins, and an Alesis Andromeda.
                      Forbidden Star: home studio / melodic ambient / New Age / the deep zone
                      Boney Fiend: the band, man / punk / garage / beer

                      Comment


                      • #26






                        Quote Originally Posted by keybdwizrd
                        View Post

                        Oops, plaid_emu, thanks for reminding me about the Virus TI... I have one of those, too. Same dinky, crappy little screen.



                        Kudos to Korg for putting large screens on instruments like the M50, and a large COLOR screen on the $999 Krome 61. Apparently it IS possible.... Let's see the other manufacturers follow suit.




                        yea some are still really screens
                        Guess what? ! I have a Fever and the prescription is more cowbell !


                        Moog Modular,B3 leslie,gran piano, GX1

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                        • #27
                          - lack of "pro" level gear in the market

                          - lack of unbalanced outputs

                          - lack of good op-amps

                          - lack of memory

                          - lack of high resolution

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                          • Lerber4
                            Lerber4 commented
                            Editing a comment
                            Cords. I hate them.

                            I would like all my gear (boards, soft synths, rack units, amps, PA, pedals) to work wireless. Maybe use the iPad to configure the routings so I just need a weighted controller, a synth controller, and a bunch of hw or sw modules.

                            At the gig, call up virtual/physical configurations and associated patches with a gesture on the iPad. Maybe have a box 'o knobs for hands-on tweaking.












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