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  • Quote Originally Posted by Jack Gilvey
    View Post

    How about stereo delays...which are true stereo (dry to one side, delayed to another)?




    There's only one selection that will do this, and it's in the Modulation section, not the Delay section. The ToneLab LE confusingly names two effects "Mod Delay," but they're in different blocks and have different features. The one you seek (Dry-only Left, Effect-only Right) is in the Mod block, and its delay-time parameter isn't as specific (it goes from 1.0 to 10.0) as the one in the Delay block (which gives the read-out in ms, from 3-2,000).











    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Gilvey
    View Post

    Aslo, I had planned on running through a Crate Powerblock (using the stereo inserts, bypassing the pre) and into a pair of 1x12 cabs, perhaps the new Valve Jr cabs (the Lady Luck supposed to be fairly flat).




    That's a really good use for the ToneLab (and for the Powerblock, which advertises itself as a "poweramp for multi-effects processors"). You'll have a stereo setup in a small, versatile configuration. It should look cool, too, with those vintage-inspired Epi Valve Junior cabs!
    Jon Chappell
    Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/jon_chappell
    Check out my website: http://jonchappell.com

    Comment








    • Quote Originally Posted by Jon Chappell
      View Post

      There's only one selection that will do this, and it's in the Modulation section, not the Delay section. The ToneLab LE confusingly names two effects "Mod Delay," but they're in different blocks and have different features. The one you seek (Dry-only Left, Effect-only Right) is in the Mod block, and its delay-time parameter isn't as specific (it goes from 1.0 to 10.0) as the one in the Delay block (which gives the read-out in ms, from 3-2,000).




      Thanks, Jon. A little disappointing. I guess what they call "stereo delay" just accepts a stereo input from the modulation block but applies the delay to both channels. "Cross delay" sounds like ping-pong, but again I'd assume the dry is in both channels and the repeat jumps back and forth.












      That's a really good use for the ToneLab (and for the Powerblock, which advertises itself as a "poweramp for multi-effects processors"). You'll have a stereo setup in a small, versatile configuration. It should look cool, too, with those vintage-inspired Epi Valve Junior cabs!



      Yeah, that was my thinking. Pretty manageable stereo setup with the option of just using a single cab.

      Comment








      • Quote Originally Posted by Jack Gilvey
        View Post

        I guess what they call "stereo delay" just accepts a stereo input from the modulation block but applies the delay to both channels. "Cross delay" sounds like ping-pong, but again I'd assume the dry is in both channels and the repeat jumps back and forth.




        Right on both counts.
        Jon Chappell
        Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/jon_chappell
        Check out my website: http://jonchappell.com

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        • Quote Originally Posted by Jon Chappell
          View Post

          Right on both counts.




          Well, maybe a reason to add a DD-20 to the mix after all.



          This is a stretch, but I don't suppose the "mod delay" from the modulation section would accept a tap/factor input for time?



          Also, reading through again kinda got me interested in the whole PA-speaker approach, but the Mackie 450 seems more than I need...how would the 350 compare as a stereo pair? The good dispersion appeals to me, my room is acoustically-treated, pretty dead, so without the benefit of reflections I have to stay right on-axis to get full highs with a typical 12".

          Comment


          • I haven't bothered to read all 12 pages of this thread but... 2 questions.



            Is it like the Vox Valvetronix series where you can only run one effect at once?



            and...



            Are the 1 2 3 4 buttons channel switchers or on/off switching?





            Thanks
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            Comment








            • Quote Originally Posted by Jack Gilvey
              View Post

              This is a stretch, but I don't suppose the "mod delay" from the modulation section would accept a tap/factor input for time?




              Unfortunately, no. In the mod section the tap-tempo is assigned to Mod Speed.









              Quote Originally Posted by Jack Gilvey
              View Post

              Also, reading through again kinda got me interested in the whole PA-speaker approach, but the Mackie 450 seems more than I need...how would the 350 compare as a stereo pair? The good dispersion appeals to me, my room is acoustically-treated, pretty dead, so without the benefit of reflections I have to stay right on-axis to get full highs with a typical 12".




              Well, I think the 350 is more than adequate for most situations. The 450 would be for really high-gain applications. And I've said this before, but I have been plagued by a succession of full-range amps with poor dispersion, so I think matching the ToneLab with the 350 (or the 450 if you really need it and have the $) is a great idea. The only caveat is ... it's not a guitar amp. A multi-fx and a "PA speaker" is an unusual amplification system to be hauling around and setting up on a stage. You might garner some strange looks at the local open mic jam. And you can't rest a beverage on it, either.
              Jon Chappell
              Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/jon_chappell
              Check out my website: http://jonchappell.com

              Comment








              • Quote Originally Posted by int.parascope
                View Post

                Is it like the Vox Valvetronix series where you can only run one effect at once?




                Yes, one effect per BLOCK, but there's overlap and different ways to get similar effects. You gotta "RTFM" if this is a concern.









                Quote Originally Posted by int.parascope
                View Post

                Are the 1 2 3 4 buttons channel switchers or on/off switching?




                Both, depending on whether you're in "stompbox mode" or "bank/program" mode.
                Jon Chappell
                Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/jon_chappell
                Check out my website: http://jonchappell.com

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                • Greetings all...



                  I have "scanned" the better part of this thread and I've downloaded the manual and read some of it. However, I'm a hands-on kind of person and until I sit down with the box in front of me and the manual open at the same time, I really don't "get it".



                  I have not bought a TL LE yet and am on the fence about getting one. My effects setup at the moment is a cry-baby and a TS-8. I primarily play blues and rock. I'd like to add a delay and chorus and that's why I'm thinking about getting the TL - the thought of four stomp boxes, cables, batteries (or wall warts) all laid out on stage doesn't excite me. I like the thought of different amp models, but have been underwhelmed by other devices I've tried in the past - I guess I'm not really looking for amp models, but multiple, programmable effects... and wah.



                  From something I saw earlier in this thread, I'm wondering if you can get a good distortion and use the wah on this box at the same time? Can someone elaborate on that? Thanks,



                  Wag
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                  • Thanks again for the info, Jon.










                    I guess I'm not really looking for amp models, but multiple, programmable effects... and wah.



                    I find the real thing that sets the Vox stuff apart is the basic tone, perhaps due to the VR circuit. For just effects, there are more verstile units on the market.

                    You can only use one modeled stomp box at a time, so no wah with a fuzz. You can use one box with one mod effect, one delay, and one reverb. But the one-box-at-a-time can be limiting to some, so you'd have to look at that. The basic tone of the boxes is fantastic, though, as least they were in my 60VTX.

                    Comment








                    • Quote Originally Posted by wagdog
                      View Post

                      I have "scanned" the better part of this thread and I've downloaded the manual and read some of it. However, I'm a hands-on kind of person and until I sit down with the box in front of me and the manual open at the same time, I really don't "get it".




                      When considering a device as complex as a multi-effects processor, everyone should adopt your strategy. Fortunately, a downloadable pdf of the manual is available, so one can study up, and go to the music store armed with information (and print-outs, if necessary).
                      Jon Chappell
                      Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/jon_chappell
                      Check out my website: http://jonchappell.com

                      Comment








                      • Quote Originally Posted by Jack Gilvey
                        View Post

                        Thanks again for the info, Jon. I find the real thing that sets the Vox stuff apart is the basic tone, perhaps due to the VR circuit. For just effects, there are more verstile units on the market. You can only use one modeled stomp box at a time, so no wah with a fuzz. You can use one box with one mod effect, one delay, and one reverb. But the one-box-at-a-time can be limiting to some, so you'd have to look at that. The basic tone of the boxes is fantastic, though, as least they were in my 60VTX.




                        Yes, Jack, you've got it, in a nutshell. Some mfx, like the Boss GT-8, are more versatile with regard to fx, and you can see that just from the schematic. (That subject has been touched on previously in this forum.)



                        You're also right that Vox designed this more with tone in mind, so that's where their focus is, and why the ToneLab LE is less expensive than the GT-8. It's fairly easy to look at the GT-8's signal topology, compare that with the ToneLab LE's, and have the GT-8 coming out on top.



                        But Vox by their own admission went in a different direction: they simplified this unit from its predecessor (the SE), dropped the price, and is banking on its tone production (enhanced by better processing power) to compete with other, more versatile mfx units. No one knows yet whether that will be successful, but consider that they did introduce an extra D/A-A/D conversion stage in the chain, so that the Insert/Pedal/Preamp signal (already digitized) could take advantage of the Valve Reactor technology (which is analog and occurs just after the preamp).



                        So you can say the ToneLab LE pales to the GT-8 in effects, but to be fair, you should also factor in price and tone. Not saying you'll necessarily prefer the tone of the LE to the GT-8, just that you should consider it. The two issues that are not in dispute are price (LE wins) or effects flexibility (GT-8 wins). That leaves it up to tone (?? wins) to decide the rubber match -- and your own ears to act as the judge here!



                        (Remember, too, that the three categories might not be weighted evenly -- also a personal decision.)



                        Very perceptive comments, Jack. Let us know what you end up deciding!
                        Jon Chappell
                        Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/jon_chappell
                        Check out my website: http://jonchappell.com

                        Comment


                        • Hi Jon,

                          great work you're doin here

                          i've read almost everything but maybe i missed some, so here are some more questions.






                          Quote Originally Posted by Jon Chappell
                          View Post

                          The ToneLab has three gain controls, and the Channel Volume acts like the "final output" control, or what you want the ultimate loudness to be. It doesn't interact in the way a gain and master volume do -- that's the function of the Gain and VR Gain.



                          So as far as a rule of thumb, I would put lead patches at a little louder than rhythm ones, distorted patches louder than clean ones. You could run your two contrasting levels at, say, 7 and 10. You're supposed to use the Channel Volume to balance sounds between patches, so you don't want to have to constantly make a volume adjustment (either with the pedal or an amp tweak), every time you switch from rhythm to lead, so experiment (you might determine 6 and 10 is better), but I'd recommend running the channel volume high (9 or 10) for your loudest setting. You paid for all those digital bits, so make them work for you.




                          so what is the difference between
                          • knob 6 "adjust the volume level of the programs" when you press AMP+CAB

                          • knob 6 "channel volume" when you press AMP



                          Also is there a way to repeat a phrase so you can play along with it, like a loop station ?



                          And last on

                          http://www.tonelab.net/node/812 (forum is down at the moment)

                          they had a discussion about to trim the tube of a tonelabSE, there is also such a feature on LE, but the best settings are to have all tuner leds lit but on a soundlabLE there are no leds for the tuner.



                          Thanks

                          Comment







                          • Very perceptive comments, Jack. Let us know what you end up deciding!



                            Thanks, I will. I'm certain I'll try the Tonelab as-is and add a stereo (which I think I've oversold the importance of to myself) delay if needed. I did get to try the LE briefly and really liked the sound of the AC30/mod delay(delay) even through this little Crate combo GC had set up...very Edge-y.

                            Comment


                            • Thanks Jon for all your observations and responses. After looking up the Vox I stumbled on this forum and I am very glad I did.



                              How well do the effects of the unit stack up? Delay, Chorus, reverb....



                              Also by looking at your pics at the top of the thread it looks like one effect from each control can be combined with one effect from another control. So you have five input sources to vary. Is that right?



                              Thanks again for this thread. I feel a vox may be in my future very soon.

                              Comment








                              • Quote Originally Posted by mjaggisan
                                View Post

                                Also by looking at your pics at the top of the thread it looks like one effect from each control can be combined with one effect from another control. So you have five input sources to vary. Is that right?




                                Yes, that's right; You have five independent blocks, which can be combined using any effect. And note that there are overlaps (Modeled Pedal distortion + Amp/Cab distortion, [Modulation]Mod Delay + [Delay]Mod Delay), for more variety.



                                So looking at the five chicken-head selectors (as you referred to in your post) lets you know at a glance what the names of the effects are, and downloading and reading the manual on the variable parameters within each effect reveals their depth.
                                Jon Chappell
                                Follow me on Twitter: http://twitter.com/jon_chappell
                                Check out my website: http://jonchappell.com

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