Harmony Central Forums
Announcement Announcement Module
Collapse
No announcement yet.

30223310

Page Title Module
Move Remove Collapse







X
Conversation Detail Module
Collapse
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    You thought those were good? Here's more...



    The Intermodulation Distortion is particularly dramatic, as in, "where is it?!?" Yes, there's you 60Hz and 7kHz tones, which should in theory produce intermodulation distortion products, but I'm really not seeing much of anything except a teeny distortion product at 180Hz and another at 240Hz - and nothing for all practical purposes at the high end. Either I really, really need new glasses, or the Avid engineers did their job.







    Now for THD vs. level. With digital systems, distortion increases as levels decrease because you have less resolution. The following shows that at -6dB. THD is well under -84dB, and at -15dB, THD remains under -72dB - more extremely respectable specs.







    ...and here's dynamic range, which exceeds 120dB.







    And finally for our trip into specs-land, here's the scoop on crosstalk. If you think -70dB is a good spec, check this out: The left channel sits well under -90dB, and the right, under -84dB. Maybe this is why the imaging seems better than average.







    This adds up to truly excellent overall performance. I was expecting the specs to be good, or Avid wouldn't have been so confident about the quality of their interfaces...but these are really good.
    _____________________________________________
    There are now 14 music videos posted on my YouTube channel, including four songs by Mark Longworth. Watch the music video playlist, subscribe, and spread the links! Check back often, because there's more to come...

    Comment


    • #17
      Thanks Craig.
      **********

      "Look at it this way: think of how stupid the average person is, and then realize half of 'em are stupider than that."

      - George Carlin

      "It shouldn't be expected that people are necessarily doing what they appear to be doing on records."

      - Sir George Martin, All You Need Is Ears

      "The music business will be revitalized by musicians, not the labels or Live Nation. When the musicians decide to put music first, instead of money, the public will flock to the fruits and the scene will be healthy again."

      - Bob Lefsetz, The Lefsetz Letter

      Comment


      • #18
        Hi, Craig.



        I've been searching around for an in depth review on the avid mbox, namely the pro... so thanks!



        The interfaces I've been going back and forth on has been the avid mbox and the RME fireface 400 or RME babyface (since I personally don't require more than 2 inputs at a time). I haven't had a chance to play with the Avid Mbox, but I did NOT like the older mboxes' sound quality.



        The first FF400 I ordered came with a horrible high pitched noise (not incredibly audible, but enough to bother mixes). I returned it and am since teetering on a decision to go with a different interface. Sweetwater felt it was a faulty unit, but this issue comes up often in the RME forum. Often enough to make me question their interfaces.



        Do you have any thoughts on RME vs the Avid Mbox? I felt the sound quality was great on the ff400 (at low volumes/without the noise), but if the mbox is not too far off, I may just go that route. Of course, all of the RME fans rip on any other product than RME...



        I realize the internet is not the best way to pass final judgment, but I thought I would ask since you review so many.



        Thanks,

        Wren

        Comment


        • #19






          Quote Originally Posted by IHK
          View Post

          Hi, Craig.



          I've been searching around for an in depth review on the avid mbox, namely the pro... so thanks!



          The interfaces I've been going back and forth on has been the avid mbox and the RME fireface 400 or RME babyface (since I personally don't require more than 2 inputs at a time). I haven't had a chance to play with the Avid Mbox, but I did NOT like the older mboxes' sound quality.




          Me neither. The mic preamps in particular seemed muffled and indistinct - that's one reason I'm so pleasantly surprised by the turnaround in the Mbox Pro. I thought my ears were fooling me until I ran the tests and realized that yes, the fidelity really is that good.








          The first FF400 I ordered came with a horrible high pitched noise (not incredibly audible, but enough to bother mixes). I returned it and am since teetering on a decision to go with a different interface. Sweetwater felt it was a faulty unit, but this issue comes up often in the RME forum. Often enough to make me question their interfaces.



          Are you using a PowerPC Mac, by any chance? If so, then my response would be very different compared to whether you're using an Intel Mac or Windows machine.
          _____________________________________________
          There are now 14 music videos posted on my YouTube channel, including four songs by Mark Longworth. Watch the music video playlist, subscribe, and spread the links! Check back often, because there's more to come...

          Comment


          • #20
            "Are you using a PowerPC Mac, by any chance? If so, then my response would be very different compared to whether you're using an Intel Mac or Windows machine."



            I am using Windows 7 - 64.

            AMD 6 core thuban

            8gigs RAM

            SATA III HD

            ....etc. (all new stuff purchased specifically for a windows based recording environment).



            I sold my macbook pro (was using an apogee duet that I liked well enough) and decided to go back to windows as a much less expensive upgrade.

            Comment


            • #21






              Quote Originally Posted by IHK
              View Post

              I am using Windows 7 - 64.

              AMD 6 core thuban

              8gigs RAM

              SATA III HD

              ....etc. (all new stuff purchased specifically for a windows based recording environment).




              Then it's not the famous Mac G5 whine. My guess would be a ground loop somewhere, but it's impossible to troubleshoot something like that remotely, as there could be many reasons. If you're using a FireWire port on the motherboard, the solution may be as simple as using the port on a FireWire PCI card instead.



              That said, I've reviewed a few RME interfaces in my time, and they always performed well and the drivers were solid. I'm not as familiar with their recent products, so can't make any direct comparisons...I've worked with a lot of interfaces, true, but certainly not all of them!
              _____________________________________________
              There are now 14 music videos posted on my YouTube channel, including four songs by Mark Longworth. Watch the music video playlist, subscribe, and spread the links! Check back often, because there's more to come...

              Comment


              • #22
                I did try a couple of firewire workarounds, so it's possible that I received a faulty unit. If I try out the Avid Mbox, I'll be sure to post my results if you like. Will make a decision by the end of the week.



                Thanks again for your reviews and comments. I find them quite informative and good read!



                Cheers,

                Wren

                Comment


                • #23
                  UPDATE: I apologize for the delay in continuing this pro review, but to make a long and frustrating story short, I had to re-install my system and programs after returning from Frankfurt - a hardware problem with the motherboard scrambled my system drive upon either startup or shutdown (or both, I don't know). The motherboard is fixed, I have a new hard drive, and I've been re-creating my system - I'd only switched over to Windows 7 full-time about six weeks prior to the mobo problem, so didn't consider the system finished enough to image for a restore.



                  I have most of the system back to normal, and re-installed Pro Tools today for use with the Mbox (FYI, there's a 9.0.2 update for Pro Tools). Again, apologies for the delay.



                  By the way IHK - would be very interested to hear if you don't have whine problems with the Mbox. So far I have to say the Mbox is a really well-engineered unit. No slam on RME, of course, but I doubt anyone would be disappointed by the Mbox's level of performance. If it has the I/O you want, I don't think you could go wrong.



                  Just curious - did you try using a FireWire port that's not connected directly to the motherboard, and make sure nothing else is connected to the same FireWire controller?
                  _____________________________________________
                  There are now 14 music videos posted on my YouTube channel, including four songs by Mark Longworth. Watch the music video playlist, subscribe, and spread the links! Check back often, because there's more to come...

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    I have to say...I'm surprised this hasn't gotten more attention, as the Mbox Pro is a really fine interface. I wonder if maybe people see "Mbox" and they think "yeah, those middle-of-the-road interfaces you had to buy to run Pro Tools" instead of recognizing these are a whole new ball game.



                    I think I'll wait a few days to see if anyone has questions, and then start covering the smaller, USB 2.0 interface. It may just be that people are less into FireWire these days and would be more interested in the USB 2.0, and I think we've hit all of the Mbox Pro's high points.



                    Any thoughts on the subject?!?
                    _____________________________________________
                    There are now 14 music videos posted on my YouTube channel, including four songs by Mark Longworth. Watch the music video playlist, subscribe, and spread the links! Check back often, because there's more to come...

                    Comment


                    • #25






                      Quote Originally Posted by IHK
                      View Post

                      I did try a couple of firewire workarounds, so it's possible that I received a faulty unit. If I try out the Avid Mbox, I'll be sure to post my results if you like. Will make a decision by the end of the week.



                      Thanks again for your reviews and comments. I find them quite informative and good read!



                      Cheers,

                      Wren




                      So...did you get the Mbox? It's one of those units where the more closely you look at it, the better it looks - unlike some where you start finding little flaws you missed the first time around.



                      Funny story: A TSA guard in Dallas saw my Harmony Central shirt and said he was thinking of buying an Mbox Pro after reading the Pro Review...I guess not all TSA folks are monsters.
                      _____________________________________________
                      There are now 14 music videos posted on my YouTube channel, including four songs by Mark Longworth. Watch the music video playlist, subscribe, and spread the links! Check back often, because there's more to come...

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Great review. Got my Mbox 3 Pro as soon they were available at Sweetwater... Sounds cleaner then my 002 and much, much more cleaner then my older mbox. And the damn thing is almost as heavy, maybe even heavier then my 002. LOL.... Defintely built better then the older Mbox's and Digi00 interfaces. Was looking for a review like this for a while to pretty much confirm what I was hearing and see what the inside looked like and started feeling like I was the only one on the planet with one... LOL... I just purchased a Peluso 2247 LE Mic and a Great River ME-1NV Mic-Pre and have it going in to my MBox 3 Pro Running on the latest 17" MacBook Pro fully loaded with Pro Tools 9 and I'm blown away by how it sounds. Avid out did them selves with this interface. With The Mbox 3 Pro being able to handle 24bit/192khz and Pro Tools 9 allows you to record and mix at 24bit/192khz, you basically have a low budget HD rig ($1,000)... Mbox 3 Pro kind of makes the 003 seem pointless and waist of money... (sorry 003 owners) I'm finally getting that "BIG BOY STUDIO" sound i've always wanted with out breaking the bank. This was definitely a great investment for me. And this review definitely made me feel better about buying it.

                        Comment


                        • #27






                          Quote Originally Posted by CT357
                          View Post

                          And this review definitely made me feel better about buying it.




                          Well the intention of the review is to help people make the right choice, but it sounds like you'd already figured out your needs anyway. I'm glad you agree this is night and day compared to the older models, it certainly seems that way to me. Also one thing I haven't really mentioned is that if you use programs other than Pro Tools, the drivers seem really solid. So far I've tried the Mbox Pro with Sonar and Ableton Live, and it works without a hitch. I'll try it with some other programs too to get more of a feel about its performance, but it seems that Avid is definitely trying to push the Mbox Pro as a solution for whatever DAW you use, not just Pro Tools.



                          BTW - as to 192kHz - I'd say it's not worth the extra storage aggravation, 96kHz is just fine and anyway, few people can reliably tell the difference between something recorded at 44.1/48kHz and 96kHz - let alone 96 and 192. But hey, it's there if you want it!
                          _____________________________________________
                          There are now 14 music videos posted on my YouTube channel, including four songs by Mark Longworth. Watch the music video playlist, subscribe, and spread the links! Check back often, because there's more to come...

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Hi Craig,



                            Great review. Thanks for the informative photos on build quality and measured specs. This is really good to know. I was blown away when I got an AVID Omni interface for an HD3 rig. I used to use a Benchmark DAC1 for a monitor DAC/level control with a Digi HD192, but no more. The Omni converters and monitoring control (real analog gain attenuation - not digital) so good they arguably beat the DAC1. AVID claims the new mBox use the same circuitry as their new HD units - from your measurements and review that looks to be true! A great option to have for remote work, especially since I can buy the mBox discounted since I don't need to buy the PT application again.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Thanks for such a great review Anderton; I am one of two Mechanical Engineers that designed the mechanical portion of the MBox3, MBox3 Mini, and the MBox3 Pro. Your review gave me a great feeling of accomplishment for a lot of long hours put into the product design.

                              Comment


                              • #30






                                Quote Originally Posted by Richard Keesing
                                View Post

                                Thanks for such a great review Anderton; I am one of two Mechanical Engineers that designed the mechanical portion of the MBox3, MBox3 Mini, and the MBox3 Pro. Your review gave me a great feeling of accomplishment for a lot of long hours put into the product design.




                                You're probably just happy that someone noticed the lockwashers



                                Sometimes people forget that these units don't just happen by themselves, that a Real Human at the other end has to sweat a bunch of design decisions, like "do we use lockwashers or do we save a couple of bucks?" Frankly, I'm aware that a lot of effort goes into this kind of thing, but I'm fuzzy as to the details. If you wouldn't mind, would it be possible to give a few paragraphs on how these products come about? Do you design them all on a computer then get prototypes? You say there were two mechanical engineers - did you each specialize in some aspect of construction, or collaborate? How did you decide which features were important and which features to omit? I'm not expecting you to reveal trade secrets or write a thesis, but it would be cool to get some insights into how these products actually come into the world.
                                _____________________________________________
                                There are now 14 music videos posted on my YouTube channel, including four songs by Mark Longworth. Watch the music video playlist, subscribe, and spread the links! Check back often, because there's more to come...

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X