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  • I need Guitar Paint suggestions please. .

    Im about to buy this American strat I found. Its really cheap because someone did an awful relicing job on it. (see pics) I want to refinish it in something other than Nitro for a change. What kind of paint is good for guitars that I can use in a spray can? Acrylic maybe? Whats a good brand to use and where can I order it online? I was thinking of painting it Pewter like the old Clapton Strats. Anyone know off hand where I can get this color? Thanks.
    Originally Posted by guitarmandp


    But I really don't give ****************, I have money to make and I'm wasting my time playing on a message board.

  • #2
    Acryllic lacquer is my fave. Duplicolor is my choice. Just don't use the Duplicolor clear. It's not consistent and you may end up with a sticky guitar. Get Deft clear to go over it.
    It's 4am woman make up your mind. EITHER SPIT IT OUT OR SWALLOW IT!!!

    Comment


    • #3
      Ok thanks. Does it go on pretty thin? How many coats should use? How long does it take to dry? KNow any good tutorials on painting guitars with Acrylic?
      Originally Posted by guitarmandp


      But I really don't give ****************, I have money to make and I'm wasting my time playing on a message board.

      Comment


      • #4
        Ok thanks. Does it go on pretty thin? How many coats should use? How long does it take to dry? KNow any good tutorials on painting guitars with Acrylic?

        If you've done nitro you can do acryllic. No difference whatsoever in application. The only difference between the two is the binder used. Lacquer is lacquer. Acryllic just doesn't yellow like nitro, which I think is a good thing. With the new smaller cans I'd go one for color and two for the Deft clear. Same rule of threes, same thin coats, same one month wait when the last clear goes on. Reranch does have agood primer (pun intended) on spraying nitro. Use that you'll be fine.
        It's 4am woman make up your mind. EITHER SPIT IT OUT OR SWALLOW IT!!!

        Comment


        • #5
          OK last question. Wheres a good place to buy it from online that has a good selection of colors? Thanks!
          Originally Posted by guitarmandp


          But I really don't give ****************, I have money to make and I'm wasting my time playing on a message board.

          Comment


          • #6
            Is this waht I need? Acrylic enamel?

            http://duplicolor.com/products/premiumEnamel/
            Originally Posted by guitarmandp


            But I really don't give ****************, I have money to make and I'm wasting my time playing on a message board.

            Comment


            • #7
              No do not use enamil, ever.

              I'd stay away from acrylics all together myself and just go with straight lacquer.
              Acrylics are not the same thing. Duplicolor sells plain enamil. thats the only one I'd use.

              Custom Tele may have had good success with acrylics but its not the norm for guitars.
              I've also read enough horror stories where people used acrylics and tried to apply regular
              clearcoat over it and had chemical rejections to know its not a good medium unless you
              stick with the same manufactures recomended products for the whole job.
              Even then acrylics havent been around long enough to pass the test of time like normal
              lacquer has proven itself.

              You want guitar paint, you can buy just about any color you want.
              Just drive down to your local auto parts store and buy spray cand auto body lacquer in spray cans.
              They often sell the clear coat as well. Read the label for the chemical ingrediants.
              Get plain lacquer. You can buy clear lacquer in any hardware store as well.
              You probibly need one or two cans of the paint and 2 cans of the clear coat to get a glassy factory guitar look.
              You can also buy shellac at the hardware store. you need to put that on as a primer and sand it super smooth.
              If you do that first you may only need onecan of paint. If you applu the paint dirtectly to the wood, you will need
              two cans and still risk the grain showing.

              Comment


              • #8
                Duplicolor does make lacquer.Their touch up paints are actyllic lacquer. You may try Auto Zone O'reilly auto parts or stores such as that. Chances are good, if you live in the U.S., there is a store near you. If they don't have a color you like, go thru the book they have and get an idea. Then Google that color to see if it's what you want. Part of the reason I prefer Duplicolor is the wide selection of colors. I've also found that their filler primer is great right after using a good lacquer sand and sealer. Helps fill in the tiny imperfections that are always present.
                It's 4am woman make up your mind. EITHER SPIT IT OUT OR SWALLOW IT!!!

                Comment


                • #9
                  CustomTele, Is this what I need? http://www.autozone.com/autozone/accessories/Dupli-Color-8-oz-pewter-metallic-Perfect-Match-paint/_/N-25gw?counter=45&itemIdentifier=59722_0_0_
                  Originally Posted by guitarmandp


                  But I really don't give ****************, I have money to make and I'm wasting my time playing on a message board.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    No do not use enamil, ever.

                    I'd stay away from acrylics all together myself and just go with straight lacquer.
                    Acrylics are not the same thing. Duplicolor sells plain enamil. thats the only one I'd use.

                    Custom Tele may have had good success with acrylics but its not the norm for guitars.
                    I've also read enough horror stories where people used acrylics and tried to apply regular
                    clearcoat over it and had chemical rejections to know its not a good medium unless you
                    stick with the same manufactures recomended products for the whole job.
                    Even then acrylics havent been around long enough to pass the test of time like normal
                    lacquer has proven itself.

                    You want guitar paint, you can buy just about any color you want.
                    Just drive down to your local auto parts store and buy spray cand auto body lacquer in spray cans.
                    They often sell the clear coat as well. Read the label for the chemical ingrediants.
                    Get plain lacquer. You can buy clear lacquer in any hardware store as well.
                    You probibly need one or two cans of the paint and 2 cans of the clear coat to get a glassy factory guitar look.
                    You can also buy shellac at the hardware store. you need to put that on as a primer and sand it super smooth.
                    If you do that first you may only need onecan of paint. If you applu the paint dirtectly to the wood, you will need
                    two cans and still risk the grain showing.


                    I don't even know where to start here. Acrylic lacquer is lacquer. It's just the binding agent is acrylic as opposed to nitrocellulose as cutomtele mentioned. Fender used it a **************** ton back in the 60's for their metallic paints. It goes onjust like nitro. Also you say he should go down to the local auto parts store and buy lacquer? There's like a 90% chance its going to be acrylic lacquer if its at an auto parts store. It's been around just as long as nitro.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      CustomTele, Is this what I need? http://www.autozone.com/autozone/accessories/Dupli-Color-8-oz-pewter-metallic-Perfect-Match-paint/_/N-25gw?counter=45&itemIdentifier=59722_0_0_

                      That is the stuff. BTW, nitro clear will work over acryllic lacquer. Reranch has rattle cans of it.
                      Also acryllic enamel is a whole 'nother stuff.
                      It's 4am woman make up your mind. EITHER SPIT IT OUT OR SWALLOW IT!!!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        This one is the closest match to the Clapton pewter, excepts its metallic. Check these out side by side and tell me what you think.
                        Originally Posted by guitarmandp


                        But I really don't give ****************, I have money to make and I'm wasting my time playing on a message board.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I've been wondering about the krylon satin nickle. I purchased a couple cans, thinking about attacking a bass guitar with it.
                          Just throwing it out there. (its the one on the right)

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I've used straight lacquer as well as Duplicolor Acrylic Lacquer. One thing with the acrylic lacquer sprays is that it goes in so damn thin that if you want a protective layer you have to coat, coat, coat, coat and coat some more. Much more than when I used lacquer and a compressor. You can also use straight lacquer over top of acrylic lacquer so it's easy to get many colors in acrylic lacquer than find a quality lacquer for the clear coat.
                            .....

                            Guitars: Music Man JP6; Jackson USA Select SLS; Hand Made Customs / Amp/Effects: Fractal Audio Axe-FX Ultra
                            Bass: Schecter Stiletto Studio-4 / Amp/Effects: Roland CB-30
                            Drums: Roland TD-20 / / Amp/Effect: lolwut?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I don't even know where to start here. Acrylic lacquer is lacquer. It's just the binding agent is acrylic as opposed to nitrocellulose as cutomtele mentioned. Fender used it a **************** ton back in the 60's for their metallic paints. It goes onjust like nitro. Also you say he should go down to the local auto parts store and buy lacquer? There's like a 90% chance its going to be acrylic lacquer if its at an auto parts store. It's been around just as long as nitro.



                              fender used both acrylic and cellulose laquers but they werent the same as whay you're buying today. Most have been abandoned for
                              poly lacquers. The nitrocellulose lacquer were celluloid based, and promoted quick color fading and checking.
                              Dupont did develop acrylics that Fender eventually used. They did use the Nitrocellulose clearcoat on most guitars which is a cotton
                              extract added to the lacquer to make it hard but it did yellow over time.
                              There have been vast changes to lacquers over the years, each having consequences when combined.

                              Its the specific acrylic binding agent that can causes problems. You may have a very specific window for applying certain acrylics especially water based.
                              if you miss that time frame window the next coat doesnt bind properly and may not harden at all.

                              Heres an example of a classic failure to bind in this thread. http://www.reranch.com/reranch/viewtopic.php?t=44428&sid=caddcabbf33984aaa8d832e6 7f9bb179
                              He either missed the window or used the wrong combination of chemicals. Not all lacquers are the same and not all lacquers are compatible with each other.
                              You even have water based acrylic lacquers that dry through oxidization and polymerization, vs evaporation in your alcohol based lacquers normally used on guitars

                              Acrylics are Thermoplastics that are often used in enamils and cause them to shine but they are very slow drying and remain flexable which is not so good for guitar work.
                              A hard finish carries vibrations better than a softer flexable finish.

                              The specific automotive acrylic I'm talking about doesnt contain acetone and is often sold as "acrylic lacquer" vs just plain lacquer.
                              Plain lacquer may contain acrylics or cellulose, or a combination.
                              Acetone is contained in your normal lacquers and melts into the previous coat, You can apply
                              additional coats years later and they will melt into the previous finish. Some of the touch up spraye are sold
                              specifically as "acrylic touch up paint". They lack the acetone and do not melt into the previous coats, they cling to them.

                              The problem with touching up with regular lacquer is if applied with a heavy coat, the lacquer can act like a paint remover
                              when it quickly reacts and disolves the previous coats. They modify the acrylic touch up paint so it does not melt the previous coates of paint.
                              They dont give allot of details on the manufacturers websites, but if you view the material safety data sheets, they do list the chemicals.
                              The duplicolor acrylic touch up paint doesnt contain the acetone which is a normal thinner for lacquer and causes it to melt into previous coats.

                              Keep in mind, I'm no chemical expert. Information on compatibilities are extremely limited on the net. My concern is I've seen allot of failures and
                              had enough of my own to suggest you read and follow the manufacturers instructions. I'm still not 100% sure on the chemical details and the
                              manufacturers use of the word acrylic surely confuses the situation. They should use synthetic lacquer or some other term to describe the touch up
                              paint. They all contain lacquer yes, but thats no longer the only consideration. Its all the other stuff added and what they call it which is the problem.

                              I will say this if the products you're combining all have acetone then you are probibly OK to mix them. Its the ley thinner that will melt into previous coats
                              and cause it to dry quickly. MEK is very simular to acetone as it will dry quickly. I used to use it to remove magic marker from autobody paint. it leaves the paint untouched.
                              My guess is some touch up paints use MEK (metheyl Ethyl Keytone) instead of acetone. it disolves the lacquer and vinyl and dries quickly but it doesnt disolve the previous
                              paint applied. It coats over the old paint.

                              This is one reason why I I suggest you be careful when you mix and match brands and types of chemicals. You can run into problems and with
                              some peoples experience levels, they will luck out and pick the wrong combinations. I do not know all the the possible side effects and
                              I'm sorry I dont have all the answers here. I just know they are much more complex then most think and its all due to manufacturers tricks.
                              You can use manufacturers recomendations and get them to work. They are the experts but they also have specific guidelines for their chemical combinations.

                              As an example, The last guitar I painted,
                              I didnt use the manufacturers specific primer. The result was the paint easily chips off now like an eggshell when I get a ding.
                              That wouldnt happen if I had used the matching primer. The paint needed that primer to join with it. I did use the matching
                              clear coat so that had no issues, but the proper method would be to use all matching chemicals. The Primer would have adhered
                              to the wood properly, the paint would adher to the primer and the top coat to the paint properly.

                              If you use different manufacturers for the three different applications, thats where you are taking a crap shoot, and thats my main concern for others.

                              They may use certain combinations of chemicals that allow their own applications to adhere properly, and reject a competitors.
                              I know manufacturers do this. It prevents large users from using low cost substitutes when they are in a pinch. Even Fender used all kinds of substitute
                              paints and look at all the problems thay had. They wrote the book on **************** ups.

                              Anyway, my comments were specifically targeting "non" acetone lacquers which manufacturers commonly call acrylic touch up paint now.
                              They do lack the specifics in advertisements trying to make things simple for customers. In the process it causes allot of confusion.

                              Read this and it gives basics. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lacquer

                              Your regular acrylic lacquers arent being used by auto manufacturers any more on new cars so the older laquers are getting harder to find.
                              Most have gone to polys because they are more durable and many touch up paints is designed to adhere to poly so be sure to read the contents and instructions carefully.

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