Instrumental rock. is there a market for it?

[mbengs1]

theyre only few radio friendly instrumental rock guitar players. all i know is satriani, vai, neil zaza. who else? would an aspiring instrumentalist succeed even if theyres not many people interested in it?

[Folder]

Back in the sixties and seventies there were a lot of instrumental hits on top forty radio. As far as rock is concerned I don't think I've heard any instrumentals on the radio since the eighties.

[Anderton]

I think the main market these days is for buff dudes and busty blondes. If they can play music, so much the better

[1001gear]

Yeah. It seems to be a question of how big and / or affluent the demographic that wants to sleep with you.

[dboomer]

Back in the sixties and seventies there were a lot of instrumental hits on top forty radio. As far as rock is concerned I don't think I've heard any instrumentals on the radio since the eighties.

 

 

 

And those songs were very different then Satriani, Vai, etc. they were Pop songs and were melodic. Your average audience could sing them. Everything I've heard for the last 20 years seems to be based on the lead player's virtuosity at the cost of simple melody, which has been greatly overlooked in my opinion. Most jazz has a similar issue in connecting with their audience. It is far too complicated for the average listener and 10 minute free-form solos just lose the audience.

 

 

 

One could make make a living writing/playing stems for commercials or for TV shows I guess. But for plain old listening, the songs just have to be there.

[Etienne Rambert]

 

 

 

And those songs were very different then Satriani, Vai, etc. they were Pop songs and were melodic. Your average audience could sing them. Everything I've heard for the last 20 years seems to be based on the lead player's virtuosity at the cost of simple melody, which has been greatly overlooked in my opinion. Most jazz has a similar issue in connecting with their audience. It is far too complicated for the average listener and 10 minute free-form solos just lose the audience.

 

One could make make a living writing/playing stems for commercials or for TV shows I guess. But for plain old listening, the songs just have to be there.

 

Yeah. I agree about melody.

 

Today, Surf and Spaghetti Western music have become a single genre. Some bands and clubs feature it. I personally would not be interested in instrumental Rock or even Rock with vocals exactly because of the absence of melody you mention.

[Anderton]

And those songs were very different then Satriani, Vai, etc. they were Pop songs and were melodic. Your average audience could sing them. Everything I've heard for the last 20 years seems to be based on the lead player's virtuosity at the cost of simple melody, which has been greatly overlooked in my opinion.

 

That's a really great point. When I think back to the Ventures, all their songs had hummable memories. I can still remember them now, which says a lot given how many melodies have passed through my brain since then.

[Mark L]

 

That's a really great point. When I think back to the Ventures, all their songs had hummable memories. I can still remember them now, which says a lot given how many melodies have passed through my brain since then.

 

Indeed

 

And don't forget The Shadows. The lead guitarist was a big influence on Tony Iommi, dontcha know. I kid you not - it's in Tony's autobiography

 

[video=youtube;Isdf4ThtxYA]

[Mark L]

 

That's a really great point. When I think back to the Ventures, all their songs had hummable memories. I can still remember them now, which says a lot given how many melodies have passed through my brain since then.

 

Indeed

 

And don't forget The Shadows. The lead guitarist was a big influence on Tony Iommi, dontcha know. I kid you not - it's in Tony's autobiography

 

Edit: Just tried adding a video to this post, but I got an error message. Good old HC...

 

Edit #2: ^^^ Looks like my original post with video has magically appeared above. What devilry is this?!

[1001gear]

 

 

 

And those songs were very different then Satriani, Vai, etc. they were Pop songs and were melodic. Your average audience could sing them. Everything I've heard for the last 20 years seems to be based on the lead player's virtuosity at the cost of simple melody, which has been greatly overlooked in my opinion. Most jazz has a similar issue in connecting with their audience. It is far too complicated for the average listener and 10 minute free-form solos just lose the audience.

 

 

 

One could make make a living writing/playing stems for commercials or for TV shows I guess. But for plain old listening, the songs just have to be there.

 

10 minute free form solos lose musicians especially. Pft there's enough crafted music that has that effect.

[dboomer]

There is a whole era of "Space Age" pop. 2 minute radio-friendly songs, harmonically and rhythmically simple and melodically accessible. Hooks, brevity, clarity.

 

 

The Ventures and Shadows were the most prolific but don't forget the whole surf music thing, Duane Eddy, Sandy Nelson, Lonnie Mack and the whole "Pop Jazz" thing (Ramsey Lewis, Mongo Santamaria, Kai Winding Herb Alpert).

 

[philboking]

theyre only few radio friendly instrumental rock guitar players. all i know is satriani' date=' vai, neil zaza. who else? would an aspiring instrumentalist succeed even if theyres not many people interested in it?[/quote']

 

Tommy Emmanuel is doing quite well at this:

(not exactly rock, though if a rocker were this good he'd probably do quite well)

[AlamoJoe]

I think instrumental music could make a comeback were there savvy and talented people in the visual arts to create video for the background of the music. YouTube stuff.

[UstadKhanAli]

Another question might be:

 

Rock music: is there a market for it?

[UstadKhanAli]

I realize that this isn't the best way for making money, but when I've made music, I've rarely considered whether there was a market for it. I just always created the music that I wanted to create. As always, YMMV.

[dboomer]

I think instrumental music could make a comeback were there savvy and talented people in the visual arts to create video for the background of the music. YouTube stuff.

 

 

 

So are you thinking that the music itself isn't enough?

 

 

 

Maybe it isn't, maybe it needs to be better. Before the Beatles there were songwriters and there were song performers without much crossover. Money changed everything and while it opened doors for a lot of obscure songwriters to break in I believe the overall quality level of songwriting took a giant nosedive. What I now see is way too many " home-made songs" as opposed to high quality songs.

[AlamoJoe]

I realize that this isn't the best way for making money' date=' but when I've made music, I've rarely considered whether there was a market for it. I just always created the music that I wanted to create. As always, YMMV.[/quote']

 

That's certainly a sound philosophy for personal fulfillment. That way you are always satisfied, and the enjoyment others take in your output is simply icing on the cake.

[Hard Truth]

 

Instrumental music is a more important part of rock and R&B than usually acknowledged, but since electronica emerged, much of the best instrumental music has not been labeled rock, appropriately much of the time.*1

 

Even during the new wave days when displays of virtuosity were forbidden, there was some good long instrumental passages in many Television songs and the vocals on many B-52 songs were just frosting on a good instrumental (i.e. Rock Lobster). Sonic Youth and Butthole Surfers often emphasized the playing over the vocals or song with thick evolving textures prominent rather than easily discernible leads or melody.

 

And instrumental rock music lives on.

 

Tortoise and Animals as Leaders are instrumental bands safely in the rock genre and do pretty well. There are a few other 'post-rock' instrumental groups like Tortoise around and there are a few instrumental metal bands in addition to the shredders like Steve Vai and Joe Satriani.

 

The genre defying nordic bands Jaga Jazzist and Sigur Ros*2 usually are filed in the rock section

 

There are the bands in Allman Bros/Grateful Dead jam band tradition and the Brit Prog-rock tradition that play a lot more than they sing and there are second and third generation jam bands that do so also or are entirely instrumental, ie. Humphrey's McGee. Many of the best rock players have crossed into fusion at times-ie. Guthrie Govan, Derek Trucks and Jimmy Herring.

 

The newer players in the rock fusion*3 area have strong rock influences and can rock out as well or better than anyone and have worked with rock players extensively. Especially Oz Noy, but also Bill Frisell, John Scofield, Wayne Krantz,.....

 

There are scenes around people like producer/ bassist Bill Laswell in NY and producer Adrian Sherwood (African Headcharge, Tackhead) in England that do a lot of music, roughy half of it instrumental*4, with a strong, but not always dominant, rock element (often from guitarists Buckethead or Nicky Skopelitas) that freely mixes with hip hop, electronic, reggae/dub, experimental/avant/noise, funk, jazz, African and Indian influences.

 

There are also scenes for neo surf and retro instrumental bands-The Mermen, Los Strait Jackets, Man or Astroman?, Hellecasters, Dick Dale...

 

I think an excellent player with great compositions, who is original and charismatic and does good marketing can succeed doing instrumental music in a large city. They will probably make half of what they would if they played vocal music of equal quality, but they might be able to survive changing trends better than a vocal group would, esp. if the player(s) is able to do pick up gigs

 

 

*1 However many electronica bands esp Big Beat ones like Crystal Method, Chemical Bros and Fat Boy Slim truly rocked and crossed over to rock radio a good bit, they just didn't use guitars.

 

*2 Sigur Ros is not strictly instrumental, but voice is often used as instrument and there are long instrumental passages

 

*3 Not to be confused with fuzak or "quiet storm music."

 

*4 Assuming the use of samples with speaking or singing voices doesn't count

[dboomer]

There's also a few variations of Ventures/Shadows style music going on around the world. Check out the Finnish "Rautalanka" (Laika & the Cosmonauts) and Japanese "Eleki" ( Terry & the Bunnys).

[Hard Truth]

Even though I know they were never part of the surf music scene, I always considered both the Ventures/Shadows to be surf music because it sounded like surf music. (unless you grew up in So Cal.) Their sound was a little different from many surf bands because they didn't seem to do any improvisation or strive for as much excitement in their playing, especially compared to Dick Dale.

[UstadKhanAli]

 

That's certainly a sound philosophy for personal fulfillment. That way you are always satisfied, and the enjoyment others take in your output is simply icing on the cake.

 

That's exactly it. And again, I'm very realistic. I realize that not everyone can do this. But it's the way I approach the music I make or the photos I take.

 

I don't really care about the market. I make what I wish to make, and then I put it out there for the world to embrace or ignore as they see fit. I have absolutely no desire to constantly figure out what I think people like, do a market research study, or change depending on what is marketable. That would drive me insane, and I don't think I could find my personal "voice" in creating the art that I do.

 

I realize that most artists are not like this, and this isn't a judgment. It's just what I do.

 

Thankfully, a surprising amount of people like what I do, especially in the photography realm. But if they didn't, it would not matter. I would keep on keeping on.

[Anderton]

Part 1:

 

I don't really care about the market. I make what I wish to make"

 

Part 2:

 

"Thankfully, a surprising amount of people like what I do."

 

I detect "correlation"

 

[UstadKhanAli]

 

I detect "correlation"

 

Yeah, good point.

 

Sometimes, there really can be because if you're inspired and finding your "voice", you're doing your best work.

 

And again, I'm not saying this to buck the trend or anything like that. It's just what I do. I get that other people may need to do music or photography or other artistic endeavors as a job or need to make money doing this or have other reasons or maybe just have more "mainstream" tastes.

 

If I were dependent on music to make a living, I would be writing songs in about love and relationships, not creating songs with odd names with 1950s space exploration themes.

 

If I were dependent on photography to make a living, I would be photographing weddings and portraits, then in my spare time, shooting photos of wild horses galloping and close-ups of flowers, not staying out all night and photographing star trails, Milky Ways, and light painting abandoned ghost towns.

 

 

 

 

[MrKnobs]

If you can shred modes then yes, there seems to be a never ending market for instrumental rock guitar primarily as a Roland demo guy.

 

Terry D.

[Dansnydr]

As a fairly active player of instrumental music (Surf) I'd say there's certainly a market for it. That is, if you don't define a market by financial terms, instead realizing other forms of value. I don't know how other genres operate, but we in the surf music world are generally a very supportive and open minded community. There are podcasts and magazines and facebook pages and a 24 hour radio station and above all the flagship forum for the world's surf fans and players - surfguitar101.com . As a result of being in this "market" I have made 4 albums, joined 3 bands, received tons of positive support, set up tours, hosted traveling bands, won awards ( brand new '65AVRI Jazzmaster), toured Italy for 2+ weeks, and best of all - made lots of incredible friends. For a middle-aged hobby, could one ask for anything more?