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  • I Know There Are Some Vista Users Here

    What's the verdict? I just picked up another old computer that has a fresh install of Vista Business 32-bit (the refurbishing shop got a good deal on an obsolete license). It's my first dual-core computer, which I needed in order to play with the Harrison Mixbus software. It'll run under Vista.

    Is it OK to keep the Vista installation, or should I use up one of my Windows 7 installs (I think I have two left from a package) and just start out my new computer life with that? Mixbus will run under XP, so I'm also considering taking a step down to something I know pretty well. But if I'm going to ditch Vista (which I'm sure plenty of you will advise me to do) I want to do it before I start using the computer.

    Now that Vista is obsolete, is it really as bad as everyone said it was when it was new? I did let it suck up all the updates.
    --
    "Today's production equipment is IT-based and cannot be operated without a passing knowledge of computing, although it seems that it can be operated without a passing knowledge of audio." - John Watkinson, Resolution Magazine, October 2006
    Drop by http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com now and then

  • #2
    Vista is a great system once all the updates are installed. Its as stable if not more then Win 7.

    It had many issues when it first came out. Much of it involves the indexing, security and software bloat which slowed the OS down and made it slower then XP. Since Win 7 came out, the upgrades to Vista borrowed many of those improvements to fix Vista. If you take the time to install all the updates and service packs it runs as well as Win 7.

    Last time I reinstalled it on my one computer it took most of the day to download, install and reboot all the patches. It was worth it though because it does fine now. I went about 4 years between full installs and only had to do it then when I had a drive flaking out. Most other OS I've run needed a clean install sooner then that to get back the performance you'd have after a fresh install. The only major differences between vista are a few menus here and there which is no big deal. Other then that they are nearly identical systems now.

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    • #3
      Once it's all updated, it should be a pretty reasonable OS. The big problem with it, as WRGKMC suggests, is that the large increase in the codebase came before the available, affordable hardware base had 'caught up' with the much greater resource requirements.

      When I finally moved from XP to Win 7, I was overall happy with the OS -- but I can tell you flat out that while my hardware is arguably 4 times as fast/powerful as my old hardware, the machine in normal use is nowhere 4 times as fast. (Number crunching stuff, though, with the OS and GUI out of the way, is plenty fast, though -- so you should see more of the implicit hardware upgrade in performance on DSP processing and such, I'd think.
      Last edited by blue2blue; 06-11-2014, 09:10 AM.
      .

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      • #4
        It was pretty bad. I gave up on Vista early though. I don't consider XP a downgrade from Vista as much as I consider Vista a bum steer. XP is still lighter, faster and a lot less work to get stable from initial install IMO.
        <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

        “Music is well said to be the speech of angels... nothing among the utterances allowed to man is felt to be so divine."

        ~Thomas Carlyle

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        • #5
          I skipped Vista, although Craig has told me that it's quite good once all the patches and service packs are installed - it basically is quite similar to Win7 at that point, as I understand it.

          Having said that, I went straight from Win XP to Win 7 64 bit, and I found the transition essentially painless. It's a new OS, but not that dissimilar to the one I was familiar with, and it's been relatively easy for me to get around on it.

          I see a lot more programs these days that have Win 7 listed as compatible than I do Vista or XP, and for me, that would be a big consideration. If you're used to XP, either Vista or Win 7 is going to be a bit new to you, so IMO, it's probably better to go with the learning / using the newer OS, since it's more likely to be compatible with current software, and remain so for longer than the older OS will.
          **********

          "Look at it this way: think of how stupid the average person is, and then realize half of 'em are stupider than that."

          - George Carlin

          "It shouldn't be expected that people are necessarily doing what they appear to be doing on records."

          - Sir George Martin, All You Need Is Ears

          "The music business will be revitalized by musicians, not the labels or Live Nation. When the musicians decide to put music first, instead of money, the public will flock to the fruits and the scene will be healthy again."

          - Bob Lefsetz, The Lefsetz Letter

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          • #6
            Agree with go with the newest OS possible since it'll be around longer. Vista is OK these days with all the updates but 7 is better. But since it already comes with Vista installed, why not try it out first? You can always use one of your 7 downloads later if you don't like it, right?
            ______________

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            • #7
              Thanks for the input. It's pretty much as expected. I'm glad to hear that Vista seems to have settled down and it's not something to avoid at all costs (which was my impression a number of years back, so I did).

              I have only one Win7 system (everything else is XP) and I don't find much difference between this Vista installation and my Win7 system. I have both set up for all the "classics" that I could find and the two audio programs I've installed both work.

              As for "go with the newest because it will be around longer" . . . well, software doesn't wear out. It will be around as long as I want to continue to use it. But as Phil pointed out (and I have, too) there's more software and hardware that's written for Win7. The reason why I set up a Win7 system was to run Pro Tools 10, but what i gave up with that system was the use of my Mackie 1200F interface since its driver development stopped at WinXP.

              Another thing I gave up (and this might be temporary) is that the only loose Firewire cards that I have laying around are too tall to fit in this skinny case. When I clean off the bench, I'll probably stick one in and leave the cover off just to see how the Mackie "i" mixer works with Mixbus.

              This new system is here because I wanted to try Mixbus, which will run under XP, but wants a dual (or more) core CPU. Now that I know that the program works and a bit about what to expect from it, I should try it on one of my old Pentium 4 computers to see if the dual core requirement is real, or to what extent.
              --
              "Today's production equipment is IT-based and cannot be operated without a passing knowledge of computing, although it seems that it can be operated without a passing knowledge of audio." - John Watkinson, Resolution Magazine, October 2006
              Drop by http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com now and then

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              • #8
                Yes, by "be around longer" I meant that more software will be written for newer versions for a longer period and MS will continue to support it for a longer period. People are troubled now that MS is no longer supporting XP ending support for Vista will be next up. I still have a computer somewhere with Windows 98 on it. It's "still around". It just isn't useable for much, however.
                ______________

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                • #9

                  Originally posted by guido61 View Post
                  Yes, by "be around longer" I meant that more software will be written for newer versions for a longer period and MS will continue to support it for a longer period. People are troubled now that MS is no longer supporting XP ending support for Vista will be next up. I still have a computer somewhere with Windows 98 on it. It's "still around". It just isn't useable for much, however.


                  Don't know if that analogy holds true here. Vista and Win 7 are nearly identical now. It would be more likely they'd drop support for Vista, 7 and 8 at the same time then just drop one. XP in comparison was a different OS all together. Despite how it may have looked or ran it had many things that prevented it from being directly upgradable.

                  UAC is the Main technical Difference, plus there were many other things dealing drive encryption, file indexing and others that couldn't be upgraded by previous methods. The best they could do is back up a good deal of XP profiles and settings, save them, wipe the drive then reinstall those settings. You still had to reinstall all your programs however which made the backup/upgrade feature a waste of time and drive space. A clean install is the best method of installing Vista, 7 or 8.

                  Luckily all work fairly well with older XP software and so long as you can find drivers for older peripherals they should work well too.
                  Most driver and software made for Win 7 will work fine on Vista boxes just so long as there isn't anything unique to the win 7 OS system Vista didn't have, but that list is fairly slim. Win 7 does have some extra services. in its list but nothing that's going to force a Vista user to upgrade to a nearly identical system.

                  Time will tell however. So far my Vista system does all the same updated Win 7 does and on the same days Win 7 does.

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                  • #10
                    Actually, the end of lifecycle dates for Vista, Windows 7 and Windows 8 are all different, at least according to Microsoft.

                    http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/lifecycle

                    The first date column is the end of mainstream support date, the second is the end of the extended support date. Vista is already out of its mainstream support period, while Win7 SP1 is not.


                    Windows XP Service Pack 3 April 14, 2009 April 8, 2014
                    Windows Vista Service Pack 2 April 10, 2012 April 11, 2017
                    Windows 7 * Service Pack 1 January 13, 2015 January 14, 2020
                    Windows 8 Windows 8.1 January 9, 2018 January 10, 2023

                    * Support for Windows 7 RTM without service packs ended on April 9, 2013. Be sure to install Windows 7 Service Pack 1 today to continue to receive support and updates.
                    Last edited by Phil O'Keefe; 06-12-2014, 11:49 AM.
                    **********

                    "Look at it this way: think of how stupid the average person is, and then realize half of 'em are stupider than that."

                    - George Carlin

                    "It shouldn't be expected that people are necessarily doing what they appear to be doing on records."

                    - Sir George Martin, All You Need Is Ears

                    "The music business will be revitalized by musicians, not the labels or Live Nation. When the musicians decide to put music first, instead of money, the public will flock to the fruits and the scene will be healthy again."

                    - Bob Lefsetz, The Lefsetz Letter

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Last edited by MikeRivers; 06-12-2014, 02:28 PM.
                      --
                      "Today's production equipment is IT-based and cannot be operated without a passing knowledge of computing, although it seems that it can be operated without a passing knowledge of audio." - John Watkinson, Resolution Magazine, October 2006
                      Drop by http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com now and then

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by WRGKMC View Post
                        Vista is a great system once all the updates are installed. Its as stable if not more then Win 7..
                        +1

                        I have one machine with Vista on it and an OEM copy of Win7 ready to go but Vista got a whole lot better with the updates and I'm fine with it as it is now.

                        Terry D.
                        Telling Stories releases 2nd CD, see our WEBSITE! Please check out my GROUPIE STORY and Tales from the Road.

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                        • #13
                          I ran my DAW on Win 7 first, then I swapped things around and have been running my DAW with Vista. I do find I have less crashes pushing the box to its limits using Vista, But this may just be the OS works better on my particular box of the Older M-Audio 1010LT cards just work better with the Vista drivers, and the older software just runs better.

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                          • #14
                            OK, so here's a Vista puzzle. I ran into this same thing when I set up a Win7 system and just worked around it, but dammit, I want to know what's making this happen.

                            Why do I see a bunch of folders under Mike that are the usual Windows documents names that I don't have access to? I'm the only user, and the administrator, so why shouldn't I have access to everything, especially things that are in folders under my own name?

                            On Win7 I just didn't use these folders but made equivalents with better names under the root directory, but I'd like to know what's going on here and why the default is that the presumed owner can't access his own files.
                            Last edited by MikeRivers; 06-13-2014, 03:18 PM.
                            --
                            "Today's production equipment is IT-based and cannot be operated without a passing knowledge of computing, although it seems that it can be operated without a passing knowledge of audio." - John Watkinson, Resolution Magazine, October 2006
                            Drop by http://mikeriversaudio.wordpress.com now and then

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hum, Did you right click on them and go into folder properties? There should be a tab that says security and you can give yourself full rights.
                              Some of the stuff may be set up for shared if you're on a network. Doth think that would stop you from accessing the folders though.

                              The only other thing that comes to mind if you open up the control panel, then select folder options, you can make global access changes under "View" You can try reset first, or you can click on show hidden folders and drives. This will let you see and access system critical files. Normally you wouldn't need to go into those unless you really know what you're doing. They hide those so you don't accidentally click on the wrong folder, or have a bunch oc crap you don't need doing a search.

                              The only other thing I can think of is in the control panel, is click on User Accounts. You can go in from there and manage your accounts.
                              If I remember right, you can install software as a user or an administrator. If for example, you have an open software disk and just click on the install it sets it up under the user name. If you right click on it you have the option of installing it as an administrator so all users can use that program if you authorize them to use it.

                              It gets a bit confusing. You may want to google up details. The main reason for it is if you have a house with a number of users on the same computer. If your kids log on with their user name you can block them from using your programs or using your files. A good feature if you have a family.

                              In my case I'm the only one using my computer so I shut all that crap down. During installation of the OS you are the administrator. If you choose to have a secure log on, you are then a user. You have to give yourself the same rights as the administrator and then you'll have access to everything.

                              This is one of those UAC things people hated in the beginning. Luckily there's a billion articles that teach you how to shut it off. In an office where you have allot of people it does keep people out of your computer but a home computer, turn that crap off.

                              http://www.mydigitallife.info/turn-o...windows-vista/

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