Tools You Use (or could use) For Learning

[MikeRivers]

I'm getting tired of giving my long-running "Getting the most from your handheld recorder" workshop at the banjo camps that I attend. In looking for something else that I could teach (besides banjo) I was talking to someone at the camp last week about learning tools. I'm not taking about detailed instructional videos or chord construction charts, but things more conducive to learning instruments that involve a fair amount of the aural process. The Amazing Slow Downer immediately came to mind, but nearly everyone has discovered that one already. A fiddler told me about a program she uses that can reverse a video left-to-right. When she's watching a video of another fiddler, she says that she imagines looking at herself in a mirror and that makes it easier for her to follow the player's bow motion. So this is the sort of thing I'm looking for more of.

 

One thing I'm wondering about, and with which I've had very little experience with other than playing with EQ, is an application that will bring an instrument in a recording more up front in the mix. I played with that using Spectral Layers but that's way too complicated to teach in an hour and a half. Has anyone found something simple and intuitive that might work for this? I'm a Windows user, but Mac programs are fair game, too. Anyone ever use Roland's R-Mix?

 

Got anything to share?

[RoadRanger]

My old Tascam MP-BT1 "bass trainer" has a three position "bass line" enhancer that works somewhat. The newer model GB-10 lacks that feature .

[WRGKMC]

I like the way this site does it. It contains tabs and a musical playback system that plays the tabs.

 

http://www.wholenote.com/

 

If you select the lessons tab and drill down through them you come to pages like these that can be played.

http://www.wholenote.com/l7525p17--WHEN-YOU-LOVE-SOMEBODY-Original-Tune

 

I think an even better step would be to highlight the notes in the tabs as the tones are played which

would make it about as easy as following the bouncing ball singing lyrics.

 

I believe you can change the tempo to the notes being played on this site as well.

Its engine for playback wasn't the best last time I checked it but it is pretty cool none the less.

There isn't a whole lot of cover tunes, and the guy gets a little wild with writing stuff that would be

difficult to finger on a guitar at any speed, but it is still neat none the less.

 

There are programs that tab out music played, midi or analog. And there are midi to tab converters.

I actually have one I bought back in the late 90's. I could break out a midi tune and all of its individual tracks

into sheet music. Never used it much though. I suppose If I had the tool 45 years ago as a beginner I would

have used the hell out of it. Now I can play just about anything I hear so its all useless to me.

 

Kids don't realize how good they have it to learn instruments. I doubt many have bought music books either

unless they were part of taking formal lessons. Everything is out there on line for free if they dig hard enough.

Being hard to find is what I suppose made it more valuable to others who had to pay for it.

 

I owned a 5 string banjo back on the 60's and 70's. I already knew how to finger pick a guitar very well doing

folk tunes, classical and rag time type songs. I could never convert that skill over to banjo and do the whole Earl

Scruggs thing with those fast forward and backward rolls like that. If I had a slow downer back then I could have figured it out

but my hands were already trained on the guitar and trying to play banjo was a huge step backwards I was unable to make.

 

I recently got another 5 string several years ago which I successfully electrified. I can still fake some things on them,

but I know I'll never be a master of that instrument. I picked up playing my first instrument again too, the violin and

have gotten back some of my skills on that one. They all need many many hours of practice to train the mind and hands to be fluent.

[MikeRivers]

There are programs that tab out music played, midi or analog.

 

Tab from audio? Really? I'd like to know about that. I know someone who has done some 5-string banjo tablature using a MIDI electric guitar strung and tuned like a banjo but if there's a program that takes in audio and spits out tab (or even musical notation), that's pretty tough. There have been a couple of notation programs that attempt it but they're really fussy about the audio and mostly can't handle chords, but there's been some progress in multi-timbral tuners these days, so maybe it's getting better.

[WRGKMC]

 

Tab from audio? Really? I'd like to know about that. I know someone who has done some 5-string banjo tablature using a MIDI electric guitar strung and tuned like a banjo but if there's a program that takes in audio and spits out tab (or even musical notation), that's pretty tough. There have been a couple of notation programs that attempt it but they're really fussy about the audio and mostly can't handle chords, but there's been some progress in multi-timbral tuners these days, so maybe it's getting better.

 

You're right most aren't very accurate and they cant convert polyphonic notes very well if at all.

Basically you'd use analog to midi software and then you'd use midi to tab software.

The analog to midi has gotten better over the years. Its not much different then how a harmonizer works

locking onto a note. It seems to work pretty well with electric guitar.

 

I've never tried it with a banjo. My concern would be with the head resonation and short note duration of a banjo.

That however may actually be a benefit. I just wouldn't know without trying it. The problem with guitars is too much sustain

between notes and the software doesn't see the clean note change and may lock onto a harmonic instead of a root note.

 

How the sound is converted to an audio signal might be a problem too. If a contact mic is used on the bridge its likely to

pick up all the head resonation from the other strings and confuse the software. Micing it may not have consistent dynamics

which the software needs to maintain a lock. I have installed a tele neck pickup underneath the head on my Banjo and it does

a pretty good job with giving me a banjo tone because tele pickups produce a pretty good twang on a tele. Maybe a Humbucker

mounted under there would produce a rounder tone with more fundamentals.

 

It would still be a single note process. If you wanted to finger pick something, you'd have to slow it way down so you'd have a clear arpeggio

happening. Once its converted to midi then there wouldn't be any further issues because you could speed that up for listening purposes.

The software that converts it to a tab just scans the entire midi track so speed isn't an issue using it.

 

 

 

[MikeRivers]

Sounds like it's easier to just write it, but then some people prefer to take the easy way, no matter how difficult it is. TablEdit works quite well, lets you hear what you're written, and it's not difficult to correct mistakes.

[MikeRivers]

Any favorite tempo changers? I have Amazing Slow Downer ($), Audacity (no-$), and Audio Speed Control for Android to demonstrate. They all about the same (awful) at half speed but it's possible to learn from them. They're all pretty good at about 50% speed. Any recommendations for the iPad? And good iPad tablature programs? I don't have any iGadgets so I can't play with them myself.

 

I tried Best Practice (free) which won't start on my netbook because it looks for a CD drive and that computer doesn't have one unless I plug in an external one. I tried e-mailing the author at the contact address but that's dead.

[RoadRanger]

I mostly use the tempo changer in my Tascam MP-BT1 but on the PC use Transcribe!, mostly to change the pitch on a song to the key we are going to play it in:

http://www.seventhstring.com/xscribe/overview.html

It can save a .wav file of the pitch shifted song so you can recode it as an MP3 to give out to folks to practice against. You can also turn on a frequency display that is good for finding that elusive bass note that's buried under everything or for figuring out how much you need to pitch shift to get a song to A440 if it's not (mostly old classic rock tunes). I've received a huge number of free upgrades with Transcribe and am very happy with it .

I think Amazing Slow Downer is free for the iPad (or at least it was when I grabbed it). I also have an older paid version on my PC but don't use it anymore - upgrades aren't free so screw them .

[MikeRivers]

Thanks. Transcribe is pretty decent. I discovered that there's Amazing Slow Downer for tablets now, both iOS and Android. I don't have an Apple, but the Android version is really good, probably the most glitch-free of the lot when playing at half speed.

[davd_indigo]

I don't know what product this would be, but I've been told there's a product that changes keys on printed scores. A friend told me some here in Orlando use this on tablets they take to working gigs. I'm thinking that people in these banjo workshops play in E or A (are these standard banjo keys?). But being able to change keys is essential if playing with a singer.

 

There is also now tablet software called NotateMe with notation executed by a stylus. My plan is to get a Samsung Note tablet (12.2 inch) maybe a year from now (when I'm close to retirement) and using it for writing music. But another application I hope to use it for: finding some sort of scrapbooking app and imbed information for specific songs: maybe a youtube video of the song, maybe a notepad file with the lyrics with chord changes over the lyrics, maybe writing/composing some intro or interlude to certain songs in NotateMe and imbedding it into the same scrapbooking app. The idea here being able to have something for a player/musician to work with prior to a rehearsal or gig in order to hit the ground running. Seems like this might have potential for a workshop. A musician could carry his personal song list around on a tablet with something to pass on to other musicians for referencing.

 

 

[wesg]

Anytune Pro on an iOS tablet is a great tool. You import audio from your iPod app, then you can slow it down, speed it up, bumping the tuning, or transpose it. You can also set repeat markers for working on a tough section.

 

I also use Chordify.net for generating rough charts from YouTube videos. Some are much better than others...

 

Wes